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05-20-2015, 04:46 PM   #61
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Sorry, but you are doing exactly that. And since your claims blatantly contradicts what they said - even official statements - you're asking us to believe they're lying. There's nothing logical, no lessons learned behind your FUD. Deciding if they will start working on a FF camera only after announcing the first new-generation FF lenses? But promising it nevertheless, and with an impossible deadline - with the intention of delivering 1 year late or never? Really?

I strongly suggest you should reconsider your position - the avalanche has already started.


Last edited by Kunzite; 05-20-2015 at 04:56 PM.
05-20-2015, 05:12 PM   #62
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Having followed Pentax for years... I don't see it the way Falconeye sees it. But by my count they are a year late this June. Although that perception was corrected in a later statement by Pentax. It's not easy to get an accurate read from Pentax. They explained that. The 645z got pushed ahead of the FF. Any hold up now will be with production snafus, I expect it out before the end of the year. But it doesn't matter to me. Until they have a solid group of FF landscape lenses it won't make one bit if difference to me.
05-20-2015, 06:25 PM   #63
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I agree with Norm. Unclear yet

Better than even money they do 50mp, but at a 2800usd price point.I believe Pentax internal debate was/is on a 50mp play. Lessons are in 645Z... Pentax Will position K-FF as pro, 50mp will be the play... Not firm yet...They are late, but I guess why: I know nottink
05-20-2015, 06:45 PM   #64
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Any hold up now will be with production snafus, I expect it out before the end of the year.
I think so too. With the release of the K-S2, and soon the K-3 II, and 645Z production seemingly humming along nicely, the decks seem cleared for FF.

The soon to be released Ricoh GR followup is also now 'in the can'. And since the GR is apparently going to be assembled in China, it won't get in the way of FF related work for the Pentax factories in Vietnam or the Philippines.

05-20-2015, 07:40 PM   #65
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What surprised me was the delivery of the K3 II prior to the FF. Since we're speculating here, perhaps they wanted to use the K3 II as a test bed for FF features. Features like onboard gps, astrotracer, pixelshifting, and maybe the new AF. Since the Pentax is likely to be compared with the D750, i have to assume it will have a tiltable screen. 24mp(36mp?) with pixel shifting might sway some customers. I used my K3 with non-built in astrotracer last night and its surprising how well that works.
05-21-2015, 01:57 AM   #66
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
I strongly suggest you should reconsider your position
Claim, position?
I am just interpreting/speculating like everybody else, and what it means, in MY humble opinion, IF Pentax does indeed publish new news as late as closer to November.
05-21-2015, 02:45 AM - 1 Like   #67
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I wouldn't be surprised if they are running behind in the full frame development. I think they have been working on it for awhile -- longer probably than Falk thinks -- but that doesn't mean there aren't kinks to work out. The biggest thing from the Ricoh standpoint is that they need to make sure there are no big problems with the camera. You have one chance to make a big splash and if you do it right, the review sites and general buzz will give Pentax a boost. If there is some sensor stain issue or weird firmware problem, then that's something that would steal the thunder.

I don't think Ricoh is targeting a specific date. From all indications, they release products when they are ready -- whenever that happens.

Last edited by Rondec; 05-21-2015 at 05:57 AM. Reason: added a word to fix post
05-21-2015, 03:01 AM   #68
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
Claim, position?
I am just interpreting/speculating like everybody else, and what it means, in MY humble opinion, IF Pentax does indeed publish new news as late as closer to November.
Hi!
What if they reveals it earlier than expected? Let us wait and see, there is no problem if it will be desember or september. Those who want to by full frame Pentax have waited so long now, it doesen't matter that much. But maybe we will be suprised?

05-21-2015, 03:03 AM   #69
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
Claim, position?
I am just interpreting/speculating like everybody else
And that is yet another baseless assumption. A quite convenient one, "nobody could possibly know better than me, or have sounder reasoning".

Rondec, delays are one thing - and obviously such things do happen, the 70-200 being a recent example - and deciding if to start working on a product after promising a same-year release is something completely different.

Last edited by Kunzite; 05-21-2015 at 03:09 AM.
05-21-2015, 03:45 AM   #70
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Why don't we just wait and see what happens? it's not so far away now. Personally I will expect to have the FF reviewed and then decide if i really want one. I don't print so increased resolution is not that much for me, but I could benefit from less noise and maybe increased dynamic range, right? I mostly shoot landscapes. I wonder how my DA15 will perform on the FF with that crop function... any predictions?

If I decide I don't want a FF I might as well go with the K3 II.
05-21-2015, 04:01 AM   #71
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The thing is, the cat is out of the bag - but nobody noticed. Let's do it, let's wait. And let's remember in autumn who was right and who wasn't
05-21-2015, 05:09 AM   #72
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QuoteOriginally posted by Hattifnatt Quote
I wonder how my DA15 will perform on the FF with that crop function
That will depend on the megapixelage (is that a word?) of the full frame. If it is 36 MPx, I would expect it to perform much the same as it does on the K-5 IIs, if it is automatically cropped to APS-C size. This will cover an area of the FF sensor of approximately 15/16 Mpx.
05-21-2015, 06:09 AM   #73
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As Hattifnatt says, Ricoh has said they are releasing full frame, the only question is the exact date. I still wouldn't be suprised to see it late fall or early winter, but it wouldn't surprise me either to see it in January or February. It is a couple of months either way and as I said before, better to get it right and have it a month late than release it early and have it flop.
05-21-2015, 06:29 AM   #74
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
And that is yet another baseless assumption. A quite convenient one, "nobody could possibly know better than me, or have sounder reasoning".

Rondec, delays are one thing - and obviously such things do happen, the 70-200 being a recent example - and deciding if to start working on a product after promising a same-year release is something completely different.
My point was, the problem with all these "assumptions" is that the information coming from Pentax has been so ambiguous, multiple interpretations were possible. It may be that the Australian reference to November was made in good faith at the time. However, we don't know what's happened between now and then. Anyone who thinks a product launch announced 6 months before the date is written in stone is dreaming in technicolour. It goes without saying, given the time at which the prediction was made, there's ever possibility it could finally arrive a month or two before that, or a month or two later. When Pentax announced the FF had been pushed back back by the 645z, I didn't anticipate at that time that the K3ii would come out before the FF. But obviously altering the plan to push back the FF, also meant a K3ii for APS-c before the FF came out. These things become clear in hindsight, but are not apparent in the moment. Right now I wouldn't even bet on a date. There just isn't enough info from Pentax.

It is very likely the AF system for the K3ii was originally developed for the FF. And that the original FF release would have been when the K3II is being released.

After all a Pentax rep has said, you need the 70-200, 150-450 or 18-50 to take advantage of all the AF advances at Pentax, I'm sure they meant to release that AF system on the FF system first. At least no one else puts their latest greatest in an APS-c body if they have an FF product.

Last edited by normhead; 05-21-2015 at 06:40 AM.
05-21-2015, 07:02 AM   #75
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
likely the AF system for the K3ii was originally developed for the FF
Since the K-3 II AF system is essentially identical to the K-3's, aside from some algorithm improvements, I hope they get more ambitious with the FF. After all, if it is going to be sold as a pro tool, it's AF will face some stiff competition.

Re-using the K-3 SAFOX 11 AF system in a FF would result in a very small AF point spread, similar to what you see in the 645Z, which has also 're-used' the K-3 AF. While the K-3 AF is still a good system, for the FF, they should be more ambitious - eg a new 'SAFOX 12' AF system with 54 points spread across a wide frame area. A new more 'sporty' AF system would also match up better with some of the new FF lenses they have released - specifically the 70-200 and the 150-450.
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