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01-14-2016, 06:08 AM   #1
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New lenses for the FF ... Pentax and Third Party

Seems like new lenses will be required for the FF to appeal to those considering switching platforms from another vendor. For Pentaxians with a lot of glass already this may be less important, but over recent years we have (seemingly) lost the support of Sigma and Zeiss for new products.

While this might sound non-optimum, conversion of other platform lenses to the FF K mount such as Leitax may the the only alternative from native lenses.

Having access to the glass the photographer wants ... which is modern, updated and in some cases WR will be an important factor.

The recent post from Pentax announcing the FA Limiteds (existing) would work on the new FF is a good transition point, but may not be enough to bring new users to the platform.

It's a shame there is not a way for Pentax to offer an alternative mount on the FF (e.g. even a Sigma mount would gain access to a whole new world of modern relatively affordable lenses).

01-14-2016, 06:27 AM   #2
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Just another dispensable thread.


We have K lenses, M lenses, we have A lenses, we have F and FA lenses, we have D FA lenses. We have all these possible and unpossible third-party lenses. All of them FF.


If I'd count how many lenses in my collection are FF lenses, I could easily come to number higher than 50.


And Pentax (Ricoh) is that generous and good-hearted that the reverse compatibility will be retained.


So it's a shame to complain instead of being thankful.
01-14-2016, 06:31 AM   #3
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A sigma mount on a Pentax camera is an interesting concept, but if they were going to do something like that they might as well just put a Nikon or Canon mount on it. That would open up the most lens options. BUT, it will never happen for at least two reasons. First Ricoh has stated its commitment to the K-mount. An alternative mount would not be in line with that ethos. Of course the company could change its plans at any time.

Second, and more important, Ricoh will make more profit from selling lenses than they will selling bodies. If they sell a body with a Sigma or other mount they will make no more money from that user until it is time to upgrade, and they will have made it easier for that user to switch brands as the user has not invested in Pentax glass.

You are right, Pentax needs some more FF lenses, but if the 15-30 and 24-105 are coming soon, then we have a good start.
01-14-2016, 06:48 AM   #4
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Why do we need a Sigma mount when many useful Sigma's are already available for FF K?-mount - eg the 35 f1.4, 85 f1.4, the Bigma, 150-500, 300mm f2.8, 500 f4.5mm etc.

01-14-2016, 06:48 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by zzeitg Quote
If I'd count how many lenses in my collection are FF lenses, I could easily come to number higher than 50.
Thanks a lot, this is very helpful, we're all like you, we all have 50 old lenses from the film age, with more or less flare when mounted in digital sensor.
01-14-2016, 06:55 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by rangercarp Quote
You are right, Pentax needs some more FF lenses,
What we really need, even as a vague unformed thought from the minds of the Ricoh planners, is some idea of what's going to happen in terms of D-FA primes. We have had two (the 50 and 100mm macro) since forever, probably originally intended for the MZ-D (God rest its aborted soul), but they are somewhat specialised and the 50, for all its usefulness close-up, is one to two stops slower than a general-use 50mm prime ought to be. The recent announcement that the FF will work very well with the FA Limiteds is good news, but they are fiendishly expensive.

It would be reassuring to be told that we are guaranteed supply of the FA35 (if that's still being made) and the FA50 until optimised D-FA variants come along to replace them or until the DA35/2.4 and DA50/1.8 are officially confirmed as the optically compatible heirs apparent (in which case they will quite probably be uprated with metal mounts and HD coatings, possibly even WR and quickshift, and the current models will continue to be produced at low cost as "DA L" to differentiate them). The FA50 will probably drop quietly out at that point, with f/1.4 duties devolving upon the DA*55 or its D-FA successor.
01-14-2016, 06:58 AM - 1 Like   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by mikeodial Quote
Seems like new lenses will be required for the FF to appeal to those considering switching platforms from another vendor. For Pentaxians with a lot of glass already this may be less important, but over recent years we have (seemingly) lost the support of Sigma and Zeiss for new products.

While this might sound non-optimum, conversion of other platform lenses to the FF K mount such as Leitax may the the only alternative from native lenses.

Having access to the glass the photographer wants ... which is modern, updated and in some cases WR will be an important factor.

The recent post from Pentax announcing the FA Limiteds (existing) would work on the new FF is a good transition point, but may not be enough to bring new users to the platform.

It's a shame there is not a way for Pentax to offer an alternative mount on the FF (e.g. even a Sigma mount would gain access to a whole new world of modern relatively affordable lenses).
As a Canon shooter in my wedding photography days, the 70-200 f2.8, a 24-70 f2.8 and a 16-35 f2.8 is all you needed to do professional work. Pentax is only missing the 15-30 which looks like is coming soon. There is also the issue of a pro level flash system. Pentax is good but not competitive with all the other guys having gone wireless with their flash systems.

For sport shooters, Pentax does not have the required fast and long telephoto lenses, ie. 300 f2.8, 400 f2.8, 600 f4, etc.

For nature shooters we are missing FF lenses on the wide angle side. Perhaps the 15-30 can fill that gap until some primes show up. For macro work we are covered with the 100 macro. Otherwise, there are enough high quality FF lenses to do most assignments. Can't wait to try my Three Amigos on the new FF camera.

Last edited by btnapa; 01-14-2016 at 07:07 AM. Reason: typo
01-14-2016, 07:11 AM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by btnapa Quote
As a Canon shooter in my wedding photography days, the 70-200 f2.8, a 24-70 f2.8 and a 16-35 f2.8 is all you needed to do professional work. Pentax is only missing the 15-30 which looks like is coming soon. There is also the issue of a pro level flash system. Pentax is good but not competitive with all the other guys having gone wireless with their flash systems.

For sport shooters, Pentax does not have the required fast and long telephoto lenses, ie. 300 f2.8, 400 f2.8, 600 f4, etc.

For nature shooters we are missing FF lenses on the wide angle side. Perhaps the 15-30 can fill that gap until some primes show up. For macro work we are covered with the 100 macro. Otherwise, there are enough high quality FF lenses to do most assignments. Can't wait to try my Three Amigos on the new FF camera.
Agreed, I think with them openly targeting the pro market with this camera, the 24-70, 70-200, and 16-35 or something similar, all f2.8. Then a macro lens and a good flash. We got the macro. a good flash is questionable. But I've been told a few times that the flash system will be updated along side the camera.

Sure it would be nice to have the 24, 35, 50, 85, 105, 135, 200 primes, and then the super longs for sports and wildlife, but those will get fleshed out in time. The most important stuff is getting the zoom trinity out at the same time as the new body. For a lot of pros, thats all they will need.

01-14-2016, 07:14 AM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
Thanks a lot, this is very helpful, we're all like you, we all have 50 old lenses from the film age, with more or less flare when mounted in digital sensor.


Honestly, I'm only fed up with all these "Pentax is doomed" threads. There are many of us who are able to get the best even out of these film age lenses. But it seems like there are also guys which - instead of going out to practise - prefer to complain about not having the right camera or the right lens or the right flash or the equivalent budget. It's like searching for reasons why it is no go.
01-14-2016, 07:18 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wired Quote
But I've been told a few times that the flash system will be updated along side the camera.
Putting TTL back in the body would be child's play; if they've done that, the only question is one of whether the camera can issue the appropriate orders to the existing flashes (i.e. whether the flashes are capable of accepting and acting on TTL shutdown orders from the body). If they haven't fitted an actual light-meter in the mirror box, there remains the question of whether they can somehow tap the exposure data directly from the sensor and do it through firmware.
01-14-2016, 07:20 AM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wired Quote
Agreed, I think with them openly targeting the pro market with this camera, the 24-70, 70-200, and 16-35 or something similar, all f2.8. Then a macro lens and a good flash. We got the macro. a good flash is questionable. But I've been told a few times that the flash system will be updated along side the camera.

Sure it would be nice to have the 24, 35, 50, 85, 105, 135, 200 primes, and then the super longs for sports and wildlife, but those will get fleshed out in time. The most important stuff is getting the zoom trinity out at the same time as the new body. For a lot of pros, thats all they will need.
Totally agree. Traditional wisdom said to make sure you have pro quality glass in front of whatever camera you have. Pentax has pro glass and then some. Now with a high end FF added to the mix, Pentax has the combo to deliver very high end pro-class images. I am psyched.
01-14-2016, 07:27 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wired Quote
Agreed, I think with them openly targeting the pro market with this camera, the 24-70, 70-200, and 16-35 or something similar, all f2.8. Then a macro lens and a good flash. We got the macro. a good flash is questionable. But I've been told a few times that the flash system will be updated along side the camera.

Sure it would be nice to have the 24, 35, 50, 85, 105, 135, 200 primes, and then the super longs for sports and wildlife, but those will get fleshed out in time. The most important stuff is getting the zoom trinity out at the same time as the new body. For a lot of pros, thats all they will need.
This is a very valid point, perhaps overlooked in my initial post. Most of my work is static and the only zoom I own is a Sigma 24-35 (which is more like a couple of primes). Lots of what I do takes time to capture the photo so manual focus is also not a problem for me.

I guess my point while there are millions of Pentax lenses out there, most were not designed for digital, or for a sensor of this resolution. All companies who make lenses recognize they need new designs, coating and systems to ensure their glass is not out-resolved by these powerful sensors. (Zeiss has just redesigned it's Milvus and Otus line with this in mind). The lens, next to the sensor, is the most important part of rendering the images we create. (Not excluding technique of course)

From my 40 years of shooting Pentax cameras (I still have my first), the FA Limited (the trio) lenses produced the best results for me. (Not forgetting the wonderful 6 x 7 film images) I can immediately identify a photo I took with one of these lenses versus the others I had in my bag.

I would just welcome the opportunity to see some more of the world's best optics on the platform; and being a fan of Sigma's ART series and Zeiss manual focus lenses they would draw other's to see how the new FF performs.

Last edited by mikeodial; 01-14-2016 at 07:33 AM. Reason: Grammar
01-14-2016, 07:33 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by pathdoc Quote
Putting TTL back in the body would be child's play; if they've done that, the only question is one of whether the camera can issue the appropriate orders to the existing flashes (i.e. whether the flashes are capable of accepting and acting on TTL shutdown orders from the body). If they haven't fitted an actual light-meter in the mirror box, there remains the question of whether they can somehow tap the exposure data directly from the sensor and do it through firmware.
? How so? The reason it was pulled was inconsistent results, low degree of granularity, very simple metering vs. matrix metering models, etc. No other manufacturer uses "pure" ttl all use a form of ttl that requires a preflash as far as I understand it. Pentax's issues with flash are that they are overly simple. Look at Nikon's model with several groups of flashes all controlled centrally.
01-14-2016, 08:07 AM   #14
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1. There is a good number of Sigma lenses available for use on a Pentax.
The 12-24; 24/1.8; 28/1.8; 35/1.4, 50/1.4, etc..

2. If its to attract new users from changing from other systems to Pentax, and that means using a 3rd party lens like a Sigma, then why not just buy a Sigma for the user's current system?

3. Pentax is unique not for some macho big heavy encumbering lens setup. The smallish primes do provide a uniqueness to the Pentax line
In fact, this and the nice full featured camera bodies with good interface should be emphasized as the selling points.
01-14-2016, 08:20 AM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by UncleVanya Quote
The reason it was pulled was inconsistent results, low degree of granularity, very simple metering vs. matrix metering models, etc.
But that was then and this is now, and ten years is a long time in digital photography. You may be right, but it would still be interesting to see how things might have evolved.
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