Will you leave APS-C for the K1?

One3rdEV · 02-19-2016, 08:02 PM

At Redrockcoulee- here, here, regarding Hasselblad as a favorite film system! In digital I'm sure I could really love the 645z (although I'd miss the awesome convenience of a square format), but I'm also thinking the K-1 could have some mighty fine potential.

madbrain · 02-19-2016, 08:03 PM

With those K-1 video specs, not a chance. Maybe K-1 III, or K-0 ?

**crewl1** · 02-19-2016, 08:09 PM

(This should be a poll.)

Since I like shooting telephoto I will always have an APS-C camera especially since crop mode on the K-1 is 15MP vs the 24 MP of my K-3.
Will still eventually get a K-1 though, just because I want it

Probably will sell my K-5iiS

**monochrome** · 02-19-2016, 08:19 PM

No. I like my SMC DA15/4 Limited on my K-3 and my SMC 40/2.8 Limited on my K-01 too much to leave them.

SteveM · 02-19-2016, 09:31 PM

So my first thought was to standardize on FF and replace my crop cameras, but I have to agree, it’s hard to leave behind the benefits a crop has to offer.

Lenses complicate the issue which caused my thought for this post. I love the Zeiss 135/2.0 Apo Sonnar which I can’t get in K mount. For the life of me, I can’t find the Zeiss Distagon 21/2.8 in K mount. After 35 years, I’m not interested in leaving Pentax but even if I was, how I am supposed to replace my Pentax 1200/8 with Nikon or Canon?

So instead of a crop vs FF issue, perhaps I can keep the bodies and drop the duplicate lenses. I could sell the telephoto Nikon glass and standardize on Pentax crop for tele work and then move over to Pentax for a good chunk of the FF work I am doing now. I could also sell the duplicate glass in Nikon mount.

I guess what I am realizing is that there are benefits to having both formats.

skierd · 02-20-2016, 07:18 AM

Originally posted by yusuf

No, what will I do with my 50-135 then?

This! It's my favorite lens, and I feel that the k-1 + DFA*70-200 might be too much more weight for the same FOV.

Plus wither my 20-40?!

Plus, some recent printing experience is showing me that my k30 is great for the sizes I print.

Plus, hard drive space! Storage is cheap yeah, but I've already shot half a TB this year with raw only mostly.

normhead · 02-20-2016, 07:41 AM

Back in the good old days, we used to have our Minoxes, and our Half frames, and our 35mm, and our 120 and 220 and our 4x5 and 5x7 and sometimes an 8x10 in the studio. But usually you did the best compromise for your work. In many of the sets of my wildlife images, there were wildlife photographers there with heavy equipment, who didn't get the images I did, because they couldn't easily move. So, in many cases, the choice is the same image every other photographer in the photographers bay is getting, or a much more compelling image taken lying in a snow bank hand held.

SO for me, the combination of IQ, plus the availability of good long glass, and being able to carry shorter lighter long glass for the same result will always make FF a no go for the wildlife portion of my shooting. And I have to be prepared for wildlife at all times. Occurrences are random, and infrequent. So unless I'm shooting in a zoo, FF will never be part of the equation for me. FF is something I might pull out for a landscape or a sunset, if there is a chance of a sellable image. If I'm looking at a scene (which is 99% of the time) which isn;t going to produce a sellable image APS_c or a point and shoot are the ways to go. Most of my images are as much documentary as anything else.

But for me, most of the time it will be K-3 in my hand, probably with the 18-135 or 60-250 on it and K-1 in the camera bag, where my K-01 now sits.

SO we have this whole range of camera gear available from tiny to Phase 1 FF 645, and the question is will you ditch APS-c? It's completely a personal preference question. Personally I prefer to have as many formats as I can afford available, and I have no real preference, just an understanding of where each should be used. It makes no difference to me what anything else thinks, it's not a popularity contest, and the question shouldn't be answered as if it were.

I'm 67 years old waiting for a new hip, and have been told not to carry much weight because it will cause further degeneration, and I don't find a K-3 18-135, 60-250 set up too heavy. Makes me wonder about people who say they need lighter system.. how wrecked do you have to be?

I don't know, maybe some people were just born wrecked.

Just thinking out loud here, nobody have a bird.

Here I've moved around so the sun is behind me, what are all those FF shooters with their big heavy long glass and huge tripods shooting into the sun? Ive moved around to get the sun behind me, they may have the FF cameras, but I know who's getting the better images. And it's not them. Pick your camera for what you do. telling people what camera you have without explaining the parameters involved in the selection doesn't help much.

And by the way, I am lying in a snow bank, with one elbow rested on the ground framing this image. I'm probably the only APS-c, and the only one who left the parking lot where these guys are set up to get good light, yet my images will be higher resolution than many of the FF shooters, as they are shooting lower res, high frame rate cameras. Know what your gear is good for, you won't end up in this kind of comparison. You just grab what you need when you need it. Just my two cents worth.

And yes sometimes I get to see the images of the guys I shoot with, mine are higher res, and better. I really get tired of the FF is always better crowd, and the FF gets you better IQ crowd. What I think, is, if you aren't producing better images than what i'm producing you shouldn't be running off your mouths about your gear. If I see something I think is spectacular I'll ask what you took it with and how, but, I'll ask. I don't need the FF shoved in my face with the "my camera is better" attitude. Maybe you should be looking at what I'm shooting and how. Just maybe the guy with the FF isn't the guy who knows what he's doing.

I don't need status, I need great images.

Last edited by normhead; 02-20-2016 at 08:08 AM.

**wtlwdwgn** · 02-20-2016, 09:08 AM

A very cogent post Norm. To add to the weight of that long glass required on FF is the weight of the money to buy it! I'm 73 and carrying heavy gear is a no go for me too. I've been shooting with Pentax for 50 years now and though I've tried some of the Canikon cameras I keep coming back. I do like the FF for wide angle shooting so I'll have a K-1 for that but out in the field in Yellowstone it'll be the K-3 for me.

**Digitalis** · 02-20-2016, 09:15 AM

Originally posted by wtlwdwgn

I'm 73 and carrying heavy gear is a no go for me too.

My grandfather was still carrying his 8X10 camera around at your age, he downsized to 5X7 when he turned 80, and went to 4X5 and when he was in his early 90s.He was also fond of 6X6 and 67 formats. He still used the same heavy wooden tripod and leveling base for all of those cameras though.

**wtlwdwgn** · 02-20-2016, 09:22 AM

My hat's off to the old gentleman.

biz-engineer · 02-20-2016, 09:42 AM

For birding / supertele works, APSC still seem to have an edge over FF, until FF sensor at 50Mpixels and able to acquire as fast a 8FPS in crop mode: I refer to this video

You Tube

IMO , K-1 crop mode is there in case you want more reach and don't have a K-3 with you. I wouldn't mind if the K-1 did not have a crop mode. For me, the only important features of the K-1 is the 5 axis SR, AA filter less 36Mp sensor.

MadMathMind · 02-20-2016, 09:47 AM

Originally posted by Digitalis

My grandfather was still carrying his 8X10 camera around at your age, he downsized to 5X7 when he turned 80, and went to 4X5 and when he was in his early 90s.He was also fond of 6X6 and 67 formats. He still used the same heavy wooden tripod and leveling base for all of those cameras though.

People from that era were used to heavy things. Pretty much everything they bought and used growing up was made from cast iron and lead.

zzeitg · 02-20-2016, 09:59 AM

Originally posted by biz-engineer

For birding / supertele works, APSC still seem to have an edge over FF, until FF sensor at 50Mpixels

But who knows, maybe in the meantime we'll get a new generation APS-C with 36 MPx

normhead · 02-20-2016, 10:01 AM

Originally posted by MadMathMind

People from that era were used to heavy things. Pretty much everything they bought and used growing up was made from cast iron and lead.

When your mom came after you with a cast iron frying pan, it was a pretty serious issue. There was the quick and the dead.

biz-engineer · 02-20-2016, 10:47 AM

Originally posted by zzeitg

But who knows, maybe in the meantime we'll get a new generation APS-C with 36 MPx

Maybe it is too early / not aware of / but I'd think they come up with a 24M APSC and new AF , i.e would be the intermediate step to the next FF version 18 months later. On APSC, 24Mp is already pretty dense.

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02-19-2016, 08:02 PM	#61
One3rdEV Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: So-central, MI Posts: 285	At Redrockcoulee- here, here, regarding Hasselblad as a favorite film system! In digital I'm sure I could really love the 645z (although I'd miss the awesome convenience of a square format), but I'm also thinking the K-1 could have some mighty fine potential.

02-19-2016, 08:03 PM	#62
madbrain Veteran Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 1,341	With those K-1 video specs, not a chance. Maybe K-1 III, or K-0 ?

02-19-2016, 08:09 PM	#63
crewl1 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Los Angeles, CA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,807	(This should be a poll.) Since I like shooting telephoto I will always have an APS-C camera especially since crop mode on the K-1 is 15MP vs the 24 MP of my K-3. Will still eventually get a K-1 though, just because I want it Probably will sell my K-5iiS

02-19-2016, 08:19 PM	#64
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	No. I like my SMC DA15/4 Limited on my K-3 and my SMC 40/2.8 Limited on my K-01 too much to leave them.

02-19-2016, 09:31 PM	#65
SteveM Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Vancouver Island, BC, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,294 Original Poster	So my first thought was to standardize on FF and replace my crop cameras, but I have to agree, it’s hard to leave behind the benefits a crop has to offer. Lenses complicate the issue which caused my thought for this post. I love the Zeiss 135/2.0 Apo Sonnar which I can’t get in K mount. For the life of me, I can’t find the Zeiss Distagon 21/2.8 in K mount. After 35 years, I’m not interested in leaving Pentax but even if I was, how I am supposed to replace my Pentax 1200/8 with Nikon or Canon? So instead of a crop vs FF issue, perhaps I can keep the bodies and drop the duplicate lenses. I could sell the telephoto Nikon glass and standardize on Pentax crop for tele work and then move over to Pentax for a good chunk of the FF work I am doing now. I could also sell the duplicate glass in Nikon mount. I guess what I am realizing is that there are benefits to having both formats.

02-20-2016, 07:18 AM	#66
skierd Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Fairbanks, AK Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,472	Originally posted by yusuf No, what will I do with my 50-135 then? This! It's my favorite lens, and I feel that the k-1 + DFA*70-200 might be too much more weight for the same FOV. Plus wither my 20-40?! Plus, some recent printing experience is showing me that my k30 is great for the sizes I print. Plus, hard drive space! Storage is cheap yeah, but I've already shot half a TB this year with raw only mostly.

02-20-2016, 07:41 AM	#67
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	Back in the good old days, we used to have our Minoxes, and our Half frames, and our 35mm, and our 120 and 220 and our 4x5 and 5x7 and sometimes an 8x10 in the studio. But usually you did the best compromise for your work. In many of the sets of my wildlife images, there were wildlife photographers there with heavy equipment, who didn't get the images I did, because they couldn't easily move. So, in many cases, the choice is the same image every other photographer in the photographers bay is getting, or a much more compelling image taken lying in a snow bank hand held. SO for me, the combination of IQ, plus the availability of good long glass, and being able to carry shorter lighter long glass for the same result will always make FF a no go for the wildlife portion of my shooting. And I have to be prepared for wildlife at all times. Occurrences are random, and infrequent. So unless I'm shooting in a zoo, FF will never be part of the equation for me. FF is something I might pull out for a landscape or a sunset, if there is a chance of a sellable image. If I'm looking at a scene (which is 99% of the time) which isn;t going to produce a sellable image APS_c or a point and shoot are the ways to go. Most of my images are as much documentary as anything else. But for me, most of the time it will be K-3 in my hand, probably with the 18-135 or 60-250 on it and K-1 in the camera bag, where my K-01 now sits. SO we have this whole range of camera gear available from tiny to Phase 1 FF 645, and the question is will you ditch APS-c? It's completely a personal preference question. Personally I prefer to have as many formats as I can afford available, and I have no real preference, just an understanding of where each should be used. It makes no difference to me what anything else thinks, it's not a popularity contest, and the question shouldn't be answered as if it were. I'm 67 years old waiting for a new hip, and have been told not to carry much weight because it will cause further degeneration, and I don't find a K-3 18-135, 60-250 set up too heavy. Makes me wonder about people who say they need lighter system.. how wrecked do you have to be? I don't know, maybe some people were just born wrecked. Just thinking out loud here, nobody have a bird. Here I've moved around so the sun is behind me, what are all those FF shooters with their big heavy long glass and huge tripods shooting into the sun? Ive moved around to get the sun behind me, they may have the FF cameras, but I know who's getting the better images. And it's not them. Pick your camera for what you do. telling people what camera you have without explaining the parameters involved in the selection doesn't help much. And by the way, I am lying in a snow bank, with one elbow rested on the ground framing this image. I'm probably the only APS-c, and the only one who left the parking lot where these guys are set up to get good light, yet my images will be higher resolution than many of the FF shooters, as they are shooting lower res, high frame rate cameras. Know what your gear is good for, you won't end up in this kind of comparison. You just grab what you need when you need it. Just my two cents worth. And yes sometimes I get to see the images of the guys I shoot with, mine are higher res, and better. I really get tired of the FF is always better crowd, and the FF gets you better IQ crowd. What I think, is, if you aren't producing better images than what i'm producing you shouldn't be running off your mouths about your gear. If I see something I think is spectacular I'll ask what you took it with and how, but, I'll ask. I don't need the FF shoved in my face with the "my camera is better" attitude. Maybe you should be looking at what I'm shooting and how. Just maybe the guy with the FF isn't the guy who knows what he's doing. I don't need status, I need great images. Last edited by normhead; 02-20-2016 at 08:08 AM.

02-20-2016, 09:08 AM	#68
wtlwdwgn Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Billings, MT Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 13,838	A very cogent post Norm. To add to the weight of that long glass required on FF is the weight of the money to buy it! I'm 73 and carrying heavy gear is a no go for me too. I've been shooting with Pentax for 50 years now and though I've tried some of the Canikon cameras I keep coming back. I do like the FF for wide angle shooting so I'll have a K-1 for that but out in the field in Yellowstone it'll be the K-3 for me.

02-20-2016, 09:15 AM	#69
Digitalis Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Melbourne, Victoria Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,694	Originally posted by wtlwdwgn I'm 73 and carrying heavy gear is a no go for me too. My grandfather was still carrying his 8X10 camera around at your age, he downsized to 5X7 when he turned 80, and went to 4X5 and when he was in his early 90s.He was also fond of 6X6 and 67 formats. He still used the same heavy wooden tripod and leveling base for all of those cameras though.

02-20-2016, 09:22 AM	#70
wtlwdwgn Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Billings, MT Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 13,838	My hat's off to the old gentleman.

02-20-2016, 09:47 AM	#72
MadMathMind Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Houston, TX Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,717	Originally posted by Digitalis My grandfather was still carrying his 8X10 camera around at your age, he downsized to 5X7 when he turned 80, and went to 4X5 and when he was in his early 90s.He was also fond of 6X6 and 67 formats. He still used the same heavy wooden tripod and leveling base for all of those cameras though. People from that era were used to heavy things. Pretty much everything they bought and used growing up was made from cast iron and lead.

02-20-2016, 09:59 AM	#73
zzeitg Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: South Bohemia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,017	Originally posted by biz-engineer For birding / supertele works, APSC still seem to have an edge over FF, until FF sensor at 50Mpixels But who knows, maybe in the meantime we'll get a new generation APS-C with 36 MPx

02-20-2016, 10:01 AM	#74
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	Originally posted by MadMathMind People from that era were used to heavy things. Pretty much everything they bought and used growing up was made from cast iron and lead. When your mom came after you with a cast iron frying pan, it was a pretty serious issue. There was the quick and the dead.

02-20-2016, 10:47 AM	#75
biz-engineer Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 12,231	Originally posted by zzeitg But who knows, maybe in the meantime we'll get a new generation APS-C with 36 MPx Maybe it is too early / not aware of / but I'd think they come up with a 24M APSC and new AF , i.e would be the intermediate step to the next FF version 18 months later. On APSC, 24Mp is already pretty dense.