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05-26-2016, 11:06 PM   #16
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I think that there are many other reasons to buy a K1 over most other 35mm cameras other than pixelshift... for example build quality, very well damped shutter, controls and ergonomics, colour output, class leading dynamic range, excellent noise handling, great shot to shot AF, top quality zooms and some very interesting focal lengths available. The price too makes it an interesting option. It's not perfect but it's extremely compelling.

I've been experimenting with relatively cheap continuous lights. I tried pixel shift with a model and soft box lighting. Worked a charm. My only "complaint" is that reading in 14bit luminance information for each pixel in red, green, blue gives you much meatier files than any medium format I've ever tried (I have not tried the newer 100mp systems though). You get phenomenal skin tones and HUGE detail when using top quality glass in a well lit studio situation. However, there is just so much data in terms of the details and tonality that it can make editing a bit of a pain on an older computer. Kind reminds me of the pains if editing a sigma DP2 on sigma photo pro. Where it can be used I think you would be hard pressed to find a medium format camera sub 100mp that can produce better results in terms of color and accuity.

05-27-2016, 01:19 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
what would prevent you from using a floodlight along with a longer exposure time instead?
The quality of light from Common floodlight bulbs is atrocious. that's what.
05-27-2016, 02:19 AM   #18
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You can. In fact LED lights are just about poweful enough now, and are getting more powerful by the day. No good for freezing action however.

---------- Post added 05-27-16 at 02:23 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by tomO2013 Quote
I think that there are many other reasons to buy a K1 over most other 35mm cameras other than pixelshift... for example build quality, very well damped shutter, controls and ergonomics, colour output, class leading dynamic range, excellent noise handling, great shot to shot AF, top quality zooms and some very interesting focal lengths available. The price too makes it an interesting option. It's not perfect but it's extremely compelling.

I've been experimenting with relatively cheap continuous lights. I tried pixel shift with a model and soft box lighting. Worked a charm. My only "complaint" is that reading in 14bit luminance information for each pixel in red, green, blue gives you much meatier files than any medium format I've ever tried (I have not tried the newer 100mp systems though). You get phenomenal skin tones and HUGE detail when using top quality glass in a well lit studio situation. However, there is just so much data in terms of the details and tonality that it can make editing a bit of a pain on an older computer. Kind reminds me of the pains if editing a sigma DP2 on sigma photo pro. Where it can be used I think you would be hard pressed to find a medium format camera sub 100mp that can produce better results in terms of color and accuity.
Agree completely, including your comments on the Sigma DP2M (and DP1M)
which I used extensively.
05-27-2016, 04:23 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
Since pixel shift requires a stationary subject, what would prevent you from using a floodlight along with a longer exposure time instead? Just curious regarding practical use cases.
It's a completely different set of equipment, and would represent a substantial cost to somebody who already has a compliment of strobe lights and accessories. Good, bright, studio-quality continuous lighting is expensive. And if somebody wants to shoot at f10 and base ISO, as I frequently do with my strobes, and still get tack-sharp images every time, you're gonna need some very bright lights.

05-27-2016, 04:57 AM - 1 Like   #20
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Surely it couldn't be that hard to implement a 'stationary' or 'studio' mode whereby pixel shift is slightly delayed between frames and a flash sync output is delivered at the appropriate time before/during each of the 4 exposures. What am I missing?
05-27-2016, 09:45 AM   #21
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I would put forth that the cost of a good fiilex or similar studio quality LED setup is still considerably cheaper (by a factor of multiples) relative to say H5D60 or H6D100, never mind Ricohs own 645Z. There are considerable versatility options provided by the hassleblad, leaf shutters etc... that cannot be matched without truly doing lighting acrobatics.... However for most portraiture, still life , product - sensorshift is a very viable alternative to strobes + medium format for the photographer who doesn't want to either carry around all that equipment or spend the money on all that equipment!

However, consider a number of things before dismissing LED studio options and lack of power.
1. Modern CMOS sensors like the one in the K1 have remarkable noise handling. For practical purposes you can shoot ISO400 and even ISO800 in places today that you could not 5 years ago.
2. Sensor shifts benefit goes much further than color, tonality and edge accuity - there is a substantial benefit to dynamic range and ISO performance. ISO performance itself is close to 2 stops over non sensor shift. So the 2 stops that you might loose at ISO 400 in a studio with LED over ISO100 with strobes you can gain back with sensor shift.
3. Also consider that where you need to shoot at F10 on a medium format and lots of lighting power illuminating your scene, you are going to be shooting much more open on a 35mm format for a similar DOF and so will require less lighting.


Just my 0.02
05-27-2016, 11:08 AM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by qdfb Quote
You can. In fact LED lights are just about poweful enough now, and are getting more powerful by the day. No good for freezing action however.
Neither is pixel shift.


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05-27-2016, 12:46 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by Edgar_in_Indy Quote
It's a completely different set of equipment, and would represent a substantial cost to somebody who already has a compliment of strobe lights and accessories. Good, bright, studio-quality continuous lighting is expensive. And if somebody wants to shoot at f10 and base ISO, as I frequently do with my strobes, and still get tack-sharp images every time, you're gonna need some very bright lights.
Pixel shift works fine with longer shutter speeds, though I've used it for 4 second exposures and the results were great. Since everything has to be perfectly still anyway for PS to do any good, is there any other significant drawback to this?


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05-27-2016, 05:18 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by Edgar_in_Indy Quote
if somebody wants to shoot at f10 and base ISO, as I frequently do with my strobes, and still get tack-sharp images every time, you're gonna need some very bright lights.
I agree, for a studio photographer it is hard to surpass the efficiency and versatility of xenon arc flash bulbs. There are some situations where using continuous lights simply isn't an option - and there is the small matter of meeting the energy requirements - the higher the power setting you have the lights on: the more power they chew through.

My biggest issue with LEDs is the current issues with colour rendering at all power settings, lack of creative lightshaping tools designed for them and the low level of peak light output compared to the 1200ws Elinchrom flash heads I work with.



---------- Post added 2016-05-28 at 11:05 AM ----------

A brief addendum: I have been using the strobe mode of my Godox flash units with pixel shift on the K-1. The Godox flash units allow you to set the number of flashes fired, the power level and the duration over which the strobe will fire. There are some limits on the level of power and how many flash pulses you can fit into 4 seconds but the recycle times of the Godox flash units are very fast so this is looking like a usable workaround.

Last edited by Digitalis; 05-27-2016 at 05:32 PM.
05-28-2016, 01:57 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote

[/COLOR]A brief addendum: I have been using the strobe mode of my Godox flash units with pixel shift on the K-1. The Godox flash units allow you to set the number of flashes fired, the power level and the duration over which the strobe will fire. There are some limits on the level of power and how many flash pulses you can fit into 4 seconds but the recycle times of the Godox flash units are very fast so this is looking like a usable workaround.
How did you get the flashes in sync with the exposures? I tried a setup with the Yongnuos but it didn't work (as I posted earlier).
05-28-2016, 09:58 AM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
I agree, for a studio photographer it is hard to surpass the efficiency and versatility of xenon arc flash bulbs. There are some situations where using continuous lights simply isn't an option - and there is the small matter of meeting the energy requirements - the higher the power setting you have the lights on: the more power they chew through.

My biggest issue with LEDs is the current issues with colour rendering at all power settings, lack of creative lightshaping tools designed for them and the low level of peak light output compared to the 1200ws Elinchrom flash heads I work with.



---------- Post added 2016-05-28 at 11:05 AM ----------

A brief addendum: I have been using the strobe mode of my Godox flash units with pixel shift on the K-1. The Godox flash units allow you to set the number of flashes fired, the power level and the duration over which the strobe will fire. There are some limits on the level of power and how many flash pulses you can fit into 4 seconds but the recycle times of the Godox flash units are very fast so this is looking like a usable workaround.
I'm looking in to Fiilex LED lights, but they are very expensive. I have one Rotolight to test but it's just not powerful enough.
05-28-2016, 10:07 AM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by wizofoz Quote
Surely it couldn't be that hard to implement a 'stationary' or 'studio' mode whereby pixel shift is slightly delayed between frames and a flash sync output is delivered at the appropriate time before/during each of the 4 exposures. What am I missing?
I may be mistaken, but flash triggering is still mechanical in Pentax cameras. I expect for this dream to come true, there will be quite a lot of redesigning.
05-28-2016, 10:44 AM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by sbh Quote
How did you get the flashes in sync with the exposures?
I didn't, I manually triggered the strobes to fire - and because they were firing multiple times they might as well have been continuous.
05-28-2016, 11:01 AM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
I may be mistaken, but flash triggering is still mechanical in Pentax cameras.
Pardon my ignorance, but what does that mean?
05-28-2016, 01:48 PM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
I manually triggered the strobes to fire - and because they were firing multiple times they might as well have been continuous.
My Nikon sb-26 has a repeating flash mode, you can set the number of flashes per second, power and so on. Just tried it with the K-1 in PS mode. The flash mode works and generates a number of flashes, I set it to 5 flashes at 10hz which means 5 flashes spaced over 1/2 second. Triggered manually it worked but unfortunately the K-1 refuses to trigger the flash when in PS mode.
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