Pentax K-1 in B&H

ColiNiloK · 05-02-2016, 07:36 PM

Originally posted by shardulm

The Canon - Joy stick is a pain to use. And I hate that round 4-way button. It sickens me when I am shooting with my partner who is in the canon eco-system. That thing just sucks I can tell you. I could never get used to it.[COLOR="Silver"]

As a former 5D3 user, I say its joystick it is both good and bad, the good thing about a joystick is you don't have to press a button to engage AF points change and then you start changing which is SLOW, it can cause one to loose shots especially following moving subjects. This allows you can quickly cycle through AF points and move them around quickly, this is especially good when you choose a group of AF points and just move them around without going to use the 4 way pad/wheel. However, Canon's joystick is not smooth, meaning the feel of it it's not that good plus you still have to click the joystick every step to make each directional change the AF points so it is still not fast enough.

On most Nikon's where there is no joystick. You use and press and hold the on side pad to change the AF points, which works ok speed wise, but I find holding it it's still not fast and sometimes you overshoots, plus the biggest flaw is can't see all the AF points when you choose choose a group of them, only the center of the group appears until the subject is in the area of the focus points chosen which I found counter-intuitive.

I assume on the K-1 from what I have seen on Youtube it is similar to how the way Nikon moves the AF points around-by using the 4 way buttons, but by first press the AF points button next to the 4 way buttons. And it seems like you have to click the button with each step you move those AF points around, not sure you can hold the button to allow click-less quick move of single or group of AF points( can someone please confirm, at where I live, the K-1 is not here yet). At least from what I saw, when you choose a group of AF points, unlike Nikon, the K-1 shows them all, which is what it suppose to be.

The best joystick operation I have used are form Sony A77/A77II, A850,A900 and A99, there is no press a button then I can change AF points nonsense, and there is no I need to keep on clicking the joystick to move the AF points step by step nonsense, just simply move the joystick and the AF points changes smoothly and instantly, and you can press the joystick down to go straightaway to center AF point. This is so quick and convenient to when you want to change the placement where you want the subject to be in both group and single AF point modes to change the place of focus quickly without focus and recompose and possibly lose the focus plane using large aperture lenses wide open.

I still think a well designed joystick like the one on the the above Sony bodies combined with a 4 way buttons is the best operation, it allows quick change of AF smoothly and quick change of settings without go into the camera menu.

Last edited by ColiNiloK; 05-02-2016 at 07:44 PM.

**monochrome** · 05-02-2016, 07:55 PM - **1 Like**

Pentax 4-way pad on K-3 has 8 directions (you can combine the motion of two adjacent buttons to move diagonally).

Rico · 05-02-2016, 08:37 PM

Here are two images from the B&H display K-1:

1/100 sec ƒ5.6 ISO 640

1/320 sec ƒ6.3 ISO 12,500

**Quartermaster James** · 05-02-2016, 09:00 PM

Okay, call me a Luddite but I am still confused as to how and when moving focus points around on the fly like this is useful; especially needing to do so quickly, and how it can be quicker than focus>compose?

PS: Feel free to direct me to tutorials. I know my K-3 has far more capability than I know how to use.

**WPRESTO** · 05-03-2016, 05:44 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Quartermaster James

Okay, call me a Luddite but I am still confused as to how and when moving focus points around on the fly like this is useful; especially needing to do so quickly, and how it can be quicker than focus>compose?

PS: Feel free to direct me to tutorials. I know my K-3 has far more capability than I know how to use.

I generally agree that it's easier, quicker, more intuitive to half-press with the desired point of focus centered, then recompose and full press, but there are times when I've found moving the focus point useful Two come to mind: 1) when I've got a long tele on a tripod and a subject that twisting or moving slightly, such as a bird on a nest, where the face shifts a little so the eye is not at center and is in a different place from time to time; 2) when tracking a moving subject and the desired focus point is not dead center, such as a train approaching at an oblique angle where the front of the train, off to one side of the frame, is the desired focus point and the center of the frame is somewhere halfway down the length of the cars.

stevebrot · 05-03-2016, 10:01 AM

Originally posted by rlatjsrud

What I don't like about this camera are

I suggest that you start a new thread with that as a title. With the K-3 reaching EOL, there is a need to start a new thread to replace this one:

why I won't buy a k3

The OP on that discussion has acquired a significant following.

Steve

henryp · 05-03-2016, 10:05 AM

Originally posted by rlatjsrud

What I don't like about this camera are 3. B&H staff(...)

I'm, very sorry of anything about any of our staff was unsatisfactory. My email is in my sig. Please send details so we can address this internally.

Originally posted by johnmflores

3. He probably has sales incentives from Canon and Nikon.

Perhaps that was tongue-in-cheek, but just in case -- we don't do that here.

Last edited by henryp; 05-03-2016 at 12:33 PM.

**monochrome** · 05-03-2016, 10:06 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by stevebrot

I suggest that you start a new thread with this as a title. With the K-3 reaching EOL, there is a need to start a new thread to replace this one:

why I won't buy a k3

The OP on that discussion has acquired a significant following.

Steve

Jeebus! Don't encourage him!!

Rico · 05-03-2016, 11:11 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Quartermaster James

Okay, call me a Luddite but I am still confused as to how and when moving focus points around on the fly like this is useful; especially needing to do so quickly, and how it can be quicker than focus>compose?

PS: Feel free to direct me to tutorials. I know my K-3 has far more capability than I know how to use.

Quartermaster James you luddite I am as confused as you. I can understand and appreciate the concept and benefit of being able to move the AF point around but the lenses I most often use don't have autofocus. The ones that do I normally am manually focusing them. I generally shot wider angles so there is not that much focus depth to begin with as generally at 10 feet or less is focusing to infinity. Stopped down I am just shooting in hyperlocal length were I have less of a need to focus at all.

Maybe one day they will design an autofocus system that focuses to where your minds eye wants the focus to be without having to move AF points around. It is probably not as hard as it might seem. I believe researchers are able to scan a persons eye to see where they are looking while watching TV or an advertisement to understand the movement of the eye and the interest of the viewer. They could apply this to photography by taking the ability to track where the eye is looking as the focus point. Now that is an autofocus system I could embrace.

**monochrome** · 05-03-2016, 11:44 AM

I think ~~Minolta~~ had that technology in their viewfinders right ~~before Sony~~. Might have been someone else, but it existed. [Edit]: It was a late Canon film camera.

Kunzite · 05-03-2016, 12:10 PM

Canon had it on some of their film SLRs. For some reason, they gave up on that.

stevebrot · 05-03-2016, 02:09 PM

Originally posted by Rico

They could apply this to photography by taking the ability to track where the eye is looking as the focus point. Now that is an autofocus system I could embrace.

Originally posted by monochrome

I think Minolta had that technology in their viewfinders right before Sony. Might have been someone else, but it existed.

Originally posted by Kunzite

Canon had it on some of their film SLRs. For some reason, they gave up on that.

I don't know about Minolta, but Canon definitely had the ability to aim focus point by eye tracking on the EOS 5 and EOS-3 (and other?) film camera models There was a recent (last couple of months) comment on Gear Porn thread regarding the feature.

Steve

Not a Number · 05-03-2016, 07:29 PM

Originally posted by Rico

Here are two images from the B&H display K-1:

That's a pre-production model, correct? Does it have 1:1 crop mode? If it does, does it indicate the square crop frame in the viewfinder? Is the square red as shown in slide from one of the technical conferences around the time of CP+? Can you post a RAW or JPEG of the 1:1 cropped image?

I'll try to get over to Samy's Camera tomorrow and see if they have a pre-production model on display.

Rico · 05-04-2016, 12:56 PM

Originally posted by Not a Number

That's a pre-production model, correct? Does it have 1:1 crop mode? If it does, does it indicate the square crop frame in the viewfinder? Is the square red as shown in slide from one of the technical conferences around the time of CP+? Can you post a RAW or JPEG of the 1:1 cropped image?

I'll try to get over to Samy's Camera tomorrow and see if they have a pre-production model on display.

Not a Number, I am not sure if the B&H display model was pre-production. If I get back there I will have a better check list.

**WPRESTO** · 05-04-2016, 02:27 PM - **2 Likes**

B&H sent an Email that my K1 has been shipped. So I've actually lived long enough to get one. YIPPEE!

05-03-2016, 10:01 AM	#21
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by rlatjsrud What I don't like about this camera are I suggest that you start a new thread with that as a title. With the K-3 reaching EOL, there is a need to start a new thread to replace this one: why I won't buy a k3 The OP on that discussion has acquired a significant following. Steve Last edited by stevebrot; 05-03-2016 at 10:07 AM.

05-03-2016, 11:44 AM	#25
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	I think ~~Minolta~~ had that technology in their viewfinders right ~~before Sony~~. Might have been someone else, but it existed. [Edit]: It was a late Canon film camera. Last edited by monochrome; 05-03-2016 at 03:53 PM.

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05-02-2016, 07:36 PM	#16
ColiNiloK Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Melbourne Posts: 102	Originally posted by shardulm The Canon - Joy stick is a pain to use. And I hate that round 4-way button. It sickens me when I am shooting with my partner who is in the canon eco-system. That thing just sucks I can tell you. I could never get used to it.[COLOR="Silver"] As a former 5D3 user, I say its joystick it is both good and bad, the good thing about a joystick is you don't have to press a button to engage AF points change and then you start changing which is SLOW, it can cause one to loose shots especially following moving subjects. This allows you can quickly cycle through AF points and move them around quickly, this is especially good when you choose a group of AF points and just move them around without going to use the 4 way pad/wheel. However, Canon's joystick is not smooth, meaning the feel of it it's not that good plus you still have to click the joystick every step to make each directional change the AF points so it is still not fast enough. On most Nikon's where there is no joystick. You use and press and hold the on side pad to change the AF points, which works ok speed wise, but I find holding it it's still not fast and sometimes you overshoots, plus the biggest flaw is can't see all the AF points when you choose choose a group of them, only the center of the group appears until the subject is in the area of the focus points chosen which I found counter-intuitive. I assume on the K-1 from what I have seen on Youtube it is similar to how the way Nikon moves the AF points around-by using the 4 way buttons, but by first press the AF points button next to the 4 way buttons. And it seems like you have to click the button with each step you move those AF points around, not sure you can hold the button to allow click-less quick move of single or group of AF points( can someone please confirm, at where I live, the K-1 is not here yet). At least from what I saw, when you choose a group of AF points, unlike Nikon, the K-1 shows them all, which is what it suppose to be. The best joystick operation I have used are form Sony A77/A77II, A850,A900 and A99, there is no press a button then I can change AF points nonsense, and there is no I need to keep on clicking the joystick to move the AF points step by step nonsense, just simply move the joystick and the AF points changes smoothly and instantly, and you can press the joystick down to go straightaway to center AF point. This is so quick and convenient to when you want to change the placement where you want the subject to be in both group and single AF point modes to change the place of focus quickly without focus and recompose and possibly lose the focus plane using large aperture lenses wide open. I still think a well designed joystick like the one on the the above Sony bodies combined with a 4 way buttons is the best operation, it allows quick change of AF smoothly and quick change of settings without go into the camera menu. Last edited by ColiNiloK; 05-02-2016 at 07:44 PM.

05-02-2016, 07:55 PM - 1 Like	#17
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Pentax 4-way pad on K-3 has 8 directions (you can combine the motion of two adjacent buttons to move diagonally).

05-02-2016, 08:37 PM	#18
Rico Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1,205	Here are two images from the B&H display K-1: 1/100 sec ƒ5.6 ISO 640 1/320 sec ƒ6.3 ISO 12,500

05-02-2016, 09:00 PM	#19
Quartermaster James Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: Anchorage, Alaska Posts: 653	Okay, call me a Luddite but I am still confused as to how and when moving focus points around on the fly like this is useful; especially needing to do so quickly, and how it can be quicker than focus>compose? PS: Feel free to direct me to tutorials. I know my K-3 has far more capability than I know how to use.

05-03-2016, 05:44 AM - 1 Like	#20
WPRESTO Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Massachusetts Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 59,137	Originally posted by Quartermaster James Okay, call me a Luddite but I am still confused as to how and when moving focus points around on the fly like this is useful; especially needing to do so quickly, and how it can be quicker than focus>compose? PS: Feel free to direct me to tutorials. I know my K-3 has far more capability than I know how to use. I generally agree that it's easier, quicker, more intuitive to half-press with the desired point of focus centered, then recompose and full press, but there are times when I've found moving the focus point useful Two come to mind: 1) when I've got a long tele on a tripod and a subject that twisting or moving slightly, such as a bird on a nest, where the face shifts a little so the eye is not at center and is in a different place from time to time; 2) when tracking a moving subject and the desired focus point is not dead center, such as a train approaching at an oblique angle where the front of the train, off to one side of the frame, is the desired focus point and the center of the frame is somewhere halfway down the length of the cars.

05-03-2016, 10:05 AM	#22
henryp B&H Photo Representative Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: New York, NY Posts: 491	Originally posted by rlatjsrud What I don't like about this camera are 3. B&H staff(...) I'm, very sorry of anything about any of our staff was unsatisfactory. My email is in my sig. Please send details so we can address this internally. Originally posted by johnmflores 3. He probably has sales incentives from Canon and Nikon. Perhaps that was tongue-in-cheek, but just in case -- we don't do that here. Last edited by henryp; 05-03-2016 at 12:33 PM.

05-03-2016, 10:06 AM - 1 Like	#23
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Originally posted by stevebrot I suggest that you start a new thread with this as a title. With the K-3 reaching EOL, there is a need to start a new thread to replace this one: why I won't buy a k3 The OP on that discussion has acquired a significant following. Steve Jeebus! Don't encourage him!!

05-03-2016, 11:11 AM - 1 Like	#24
Rico Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1,205	Originally posted by Quartermaster James Okay, call me a Luddite but I am still confused as to how and when moving focus points around on the fly like this is useful; especially needing to do so quickly, and how it can be quicker than focus>compose? PS: Feel free to direct me to tutorials. I know my K-3 has far more capability than I know how to use. Quartermaster James you luddite I am as confused as you. I can understand and appreciate the concept and benefit of being able to move the AF point around but the lenses I most often use don't have autofocus. The ones that do I normally am manually focusing them. I generally shot wider angles so there is not that much focus depth to begin with as generally at 10 feet or less is focusing to infinity. Stopped down I am just shooting in hyperlocal length were I have less of a need to focus at all. Maybe one day they will design an autofocus system that focuses to where your minds eye wants the focus to be without having to move AF points around. It is probably not as hard as it might seem. I believe researchers are able to scan a persons eye to see where they are looking while watching TV or an advertisement to understand the movement of the eye and the interest of the viewer. They could apply this to photography by taking the ability to track where the eye is looking as the focus point. Now that is an autofocus system I could embrace.

05-03-2016, 12:10 PM	#26
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	Canon had it on some of their film SLRs. For some reason, they gave up on that.

05-03-2016, 02:09 PM	#27
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by Rico They could apply this to photography by taking the ability to track where the eye is looking as the focus point. Now that is an autofocus system I could embrace. Originally posted by monochrome I think Minolta had that technology in their viewfinders right before Sony. Might have been someone else, but it existed. Originally posted by Kunzite Canon had it on some of their film SLRs. For some reason, they gave up on that. I don't know about Minolta, but Canon definitely had the ability to aim focus point by eye tracking on the EOS 5 and EOS-3 (and other?) film camera models There was a recent (last couple of months) comment on Gear Porn thread regarding the feature. Steve

05-03-2016, 07:29 PM	#28
Not a Number Moderator Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Venice, CA Posts: 10,526	Originally posted by Rico Here are two images from the B&H display K-1: That's a pre-production model, correct? Does it have 1:1 crop mode? If it does, does it indicate the square crop frame in the viewfinder? Is the square red as shown in slide from one of the technical conferences around the time of CP+? Can you post a RAW or JPEG of the 1:1 cropped image? I'll try to get over to Samy's Camera tomorrow and see if they have a pre-production model on display.

05-04-2016, 12:56 PM	#29
Rico Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1,205	Originally posted by Not a Number That's a pre-production model, correct? Does it have 1:1 crop mode? If it does, does it indicate the square crop frame in the viewfinder? Is the square red as shown in slide from one of the technical conferences around the time of CP+? Can you post a RAW or JPEG of the 1:1 cropped image? I'll try to get over to Samy's Camera tomorrow and see if they have a pre-production model on display. Not a Number, I am not sure if the B&H display model was pre-production. If I get back there I will have a better check list.

05-04-2016, 02:27 PM - 2 Likes	#30
WPRESTO Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Massachusetts Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 59,137	B&H sent an Email that my K1 has been shipped. So I've actually lived long enough to get one. YIPPEE!