Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
05-22-2016, 04:30 PM - 1 Like   #16
Site Supporter




Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 155
QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
How are you processing for B&W using pixel shift...anything special?


Steve
Truthfully - I'm still working my way around what will be my optimal workflow.

For obvious reasons, right now, in the absense of a working ACR and lightroom, the Pentax/Silkypix digital camera utility 5.5.1 is still the best option for converting pixel shift files.

Typically I open the pixel shift files in DCU, use normal profile, sometimes add a little shadow recovery, and then add in a little sharpening (fs mode rather than 's' on the sharpening slider) and then export out a TIFF that I now import and work within lightroom/Photoshop. Generally I use try and make sure that I have an even histogram when exporting so that I am exporting a full fat TIFF file to play around with in LR/PS.

05-23-2016, 04:33 PM   #17
Junior Member




Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 41
Original Poster
diglloyd: Motion Correction for Pentax K1 SuperRes Images via Pentax Digital Camera Utility

Not good .-(
05-23-2016, 05:16 PM   #18
Site Supporter




Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 155
That's a subscription required link. Can you provide a synopsis of what you've read???

05-23-2016, 05:18 PM   #19
Junior Member




Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 41
Original Poster
Sorry.
diglloyd: Motion Correction for Pentax K1 SuperRes Images via Pentax Digital Camera Utility

The link is not working here.

Google this:
Motion Correction for Pentax K1 SuperRes Images via Pentax Digital Camera Utility.

05-23-2016, 07:31 PM   #20
Site Supporter




Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 155
QuoteOriginally posted by Pansottin Quote
Sorry.
diglloyd: Motion Correction for Pentax K1 SuperRes Images via Pentax Digital Camera Utility

The link is not working here.

Google this:
Motion Correction for Pentax K1 SuperRes Images via Pentax Digital Camera Utility.
He basically says that it is a make it or break it feature for motion correction to work in order to allow pixel shift work with more types of work. I agree with him 100% on that point. It's important that it works to have much wider applicability than merely still life and scenes where there is zero motion.
However the key takeaway is that Pixel Shift MC does work, you just need to use Pentax digital camera utility to benefit.
Lloyd pins the blame for the lack of ACR support squarely on the shoulders of Pentax.
From a software development, nevermind business perspectives, this does not make any sense to me.

Let's be clear - unless Lloyd Chambers has evidence to prove otherwise, we cannot say for definite whether or not it was a case that Ricoh reached out to Adobe previously to aid support in ACR or whether Ricoh simply did not bother contacting Adobe to let them know the direction that they were going with Pixel Shift.
I feel that the more likely scenario is that Adobe simply does not feel like this is a feature worth expending additional development effort on until there is a bigger market penetration in the number of devices supporting the feature - chicken and egg.

Adobe has a history of lacklustre support for new technologies that stray from the traditional bayer demosaicing process - look at Fuji's XTrans. If we make an educated guess, this time based on past software development history over at Adobe, particularly with respect to Fuji's XTrans support, this is likely to be very far down Adobe's list of priorities given the market penetration. https://forums.adobe.com/thread/1493324
To wire support for Pixel Shift into ACR, Ricoh would need to have access to the source code that provides support for demosaicing inACR. Guess who owns that - yes, Adobe.

I really enjoy Lloyd Chambers articles , but this time I personally feel that his statement of blame is somewhat unbalanced.

Last edited by tomO2013; 05-23-2016 at 08:44 PM.
05-25-2016, 11:25 AM   #21
Forum Member




Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 63
QuoteOriginally posted by tomO2013 Quote
To wire support for Pixel Shift into ACR, Ricoh would need to have access to the source code that provides support for demosaicing inACR. Guess who owns that - yes, Adobe.
This line should read Pixel Shift MC (motion control) as ACR does, indeed, support pixel shift files with no movement. Also, Ricoh would need to provide the motion correction algorithm and/or actual source code to Adobe and then it would be Adobe's job to incorporate that into ACR. Like you say, we have no way of knowing what, if any, collaboration was done between Pentax and Adobe. From what I have read on Adobe forums, their response is that motion correction is not supported at this time with no mention on whether they will include it in the future.

If we can learn anything from Adobe's support of X-Trans, we should not hold our breath...
06-01-2016, 10:25 AM   #22
Forum Member




Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 85
Hey everyone. I'm still working out the kinks/features of the k1, among them the pixel shift.

Looking at files from it, I'm seeing a massive (3.5x) increase in filesize, but no huge difference in imagery via lightroom. I assume having the color information on every pixel (among other moire/aliasing benefits) is that you can push/pull the file a bit further? Please correct me if there's a more important benefit. With all the hype surrounding it, I'm excited to use this feature to full benefit.

But also I noticed some of you have written that adobe isn't supporting it, via lightroom. How so? Is my lightroom file different from it should be on a pixelshift image?
06-01-2016, 10:37 AM   #23
Site Supporter
enoeske's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Surprise, Az
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,908
QuoteOriginally posted by dflorez Quote
Hey everyone. I'm still working out the kinks/features of the k1, among them the pixel shift.

Looking at files from it, I'm seeing a massive (3.5x) increase in filesize, but no huge difference in imagery via lightroom. I assume having the color information on every pixel (among other moire/aliasing benefits) is that you can push/pull the file a bit further? Please correct me if there's a more important benefit. With all the hype surrounding it, I'm excited to use this feature to full benefit.

But also I noticed some of you have written that adobe isn't supporting it, via lightroom. How so? Is my lightroom file different from it should be on a pixelshift image?
The file is 3.5x (closer to 4x) bigger because its just 4 RAW images stacked together. The camera isn't really doing anything other than putting all 4 files into 1 DNG wrapper. Its up to the RAW development software to create the final pixel shift image. And ACR does not do it correctly. As of now, you can use a few different programs, like the included DCU5 or DCRAW to do it right.

06-01-2016, 12:08 PM   #24
Site Supporter
stevebrot's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Vancouver (USA)
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 26,636
QuoteOriginally posted by dflorez Quote
Looking at files from it, I'm seeing a massive (3.5x) increase in filesize, but no huge difference in imagery via lightroom.
Which version LR? The version must be 6.x and up-to-date. Older versions only process the first image in the stack. As enoeske noted above, LR's pixel shift implementation is faulty and not generally recommended. PDCU 5.5.1 does a good job on the merge followed by a save as a 16-bit TIFF for processing in LR.


Steve
07-17-2016, 02:36 AM   #25
Pentaxian
Class A's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 9,063
QuoteOriginally posted by dflorez Quote
I assume having the color information on every pixel (among other moire/aliasing benefits) is that you can push/pull the file a bit further? Please correct me if there's a more important benefit.
The main advantage of the PixelShift approach is that it obviates the need for demosaicing.

Demosaicing is the process of reconstructing full RGB values for each pixel based on only having captured either R, G, or B at each pixel position. Being able to replace this (necessarily incomplete) reconstruction process with actual R, G, and B measurements means
  1. there is an increase in colour resolution. Note that red and blue are captured with only half the resolution of green in a conventional capture.
  2. colour moiré and other colour artefacts resulting from chroma undersampling are avoided.
  3. pixel locations that normally would only be sampled for one colour (say, red), will now also be sampled with green (twice) and blue, meaning that more luminance information is available. Each colour filter has different transition properties so it helps to also switch in the ones with the highest transparency, in particular, if the subject only provided information in a range that the originally assigned colour filter completely blocked.
  4. each pixel location is sampled four times, resulting in a doubling of SNR (signal to noise ratio).
07-17-2016, 05:52 PM   #26
Loyal Site Supporter




Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 5,623
The big question is.... Can Ricoh implement the Olympus/Hassy version of pixel shift with firmware. This would give us one more option.
07-17-2016, 06:51 PM   #27
Pentaxian
Class A's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 9,063
QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
The big question is.... Can Ricoh implement the Olympus/Hassy version of pixel shift with firmware.
They already did during development and did not see sufficient improvement.

This was mentioned in one of the Ricoh interviews/presentations a while ago.
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
24x36mm, capture, file, files, full-frame, mode, pentax, pixel, shift, size
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Pixel shift results from DPreview rlatjsrud Pentax Full Frame 35 05-07-2016 11:55 AM
Can't use Pixel Shift Resolution in B mode astrojim Photographic Technique 14 03-29-2016 04:11 PM
Request Adobe to support Pentax HDR and Pixel Shift RAW files Pentor Digital Processing, Software, and Printing 16 06-24-2015 01:49 PM
Is there a difference between shooting b&w and processing as b&w? justtakingpics Digital Processing, Software, and Printing 5 04-25-2010 07:10 PM
For Sale - Sold: DA 50-200mm, B&W Polarizer, B&W Step Up Ring camperguy01 Sold Items 5 02-15-2009 08:39 PM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:05 PM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top