[Racer X 69]

I went to a Catholic school from grades 1 through 8. This in the late 50's early 60's. Never saw or experienced any corporal punishment a school. The nuns all had Masters Degrees and were New York State certified. The few lay teachers the same. 52 kids in my class and one teacher. There were 104 parents on her side and we all knew it. Any problems were referred to the parents to handle.

I actually have come to think that uniforms are a good thing for students. They break down class barriers and when you have one on you know what is expected of you. You tend to behave better. Much less expensive for the parent too.


Unlike you I do have pretty good handwriting. That old Palmer Method of teaching handwriting actually did pretty good for me. Pages and pages of swirls. As I get older my handwriting has gotten a bit more sloppy and it ticks me off.

My family lived in Philadelphia for a short time when I was a boy. My daily walk to school had me passing a Catholic school. Every time I passed by the kids were playing in the school yard, and the nuns were beating the daylights out of some of them.

I was always thankful I attended public school, although it was not without the corporal punishment. In fact, my teacher took after me once, and after smacking me around some he tried to smother me in the cloak room. I broke free after a swift kick to his jewels (I was ten years old, and he had me by the neck, and had grabbed a knit cap off the shelf and had it pressed over my face, my feet several feet off the floor). He let go just long enough for me to escape. I didn’t stop running until I got home.

Dad was in the Navy, and he transferred back to Norfolk, Virginia. No more inner city school with heavy handed teachers.

[gaweidert]

Imagine having to feed, clothe and otherwise care for 26 kids!

Actually, counter to what may seem logical, we had four kids and found that having four was easier than having two. They start forming their own little mob and no longer look to mom and dad for every little thing.


I knew a woman who was one of 16. When her mother died at age 94 the funeral was impressive to say the least. After the family processed, and processed, and processed into the church the priest faces the crown and smiles. Then makes the comment that in his 40 years of priesthood this was the first funeral he had presided at where they had to reserve pews for the guests and not the family. The woman had 16 children, 48 grandchildren and I forget how a dozen of so great grandchildren. Add in her surviving siblings and their kids etc and it was quite event.

[LensBeginner]

Actually, counter to what may seem logical, we had four kids and found that having four was easier than having two. They start forming their own little mob and no longer look to mom and dad for every little thing.

*snip*

You're not the first one I hear this from... plus, there's the added value of hand-me-downs

[StiffLegged]

Actually, counter to what may seem logical, we had four kids and found that having four was easier than having two. They start forming their own little mob and no longer look to mom and dad for every little thing.


I knew a woman who was one of 16. When her mother died at age 94 the funeral was impressive to say the least. After the family processed, and processed, and processed into the church the priest faces the crown and smiles. Then makes the comment that in his 40 years of priesthood this was the first funeral he had presided at where they had to reserve pews for the guests and not the family. The woman had 16 children, 48 grandchildren and I forget how a dozen of so great grandchildren. Add in her surviving siblings and their kids etc and it was quite event.

Good one! I knew someone whose mother was one of 15 or 16, of whom 13? survived childhood. Correspondingly, this person had a lot of relations, one of which was known as her 42nd cousin.

[lesmore49]

Not that long ago, particularly in rural areas, people generally had more kids. If you're a farmer/rancher you needed many hands just to get all the stuff done, especially in a dairy farm. Imagine all those dairy cattle needing to be milked . Then of course there is lots of clean up required.

I'm the first generation off the farm. My family were tillers of the soil for years, ten generations alone in North America . Both in Canada and before that, the American Colonies. And before North America in England where they were known as planters. Think early farmers in North America were also known as planters.

But I digress.

Anyways I found out all this family history stuff from getting involved in tracing the family tree. Amazing the stuff you do, when you're retired. As I was tracing generation after generation I noted that past ancestors ......farmers.....all had very large families...right up to the last generation on the farm , previous to me.....which had 7 kids. Without exception, previous (all of them ) farming generations had anywhere from about 6 to 11 kids.

I think the reasons are many. Some come to mind.

Before the advent of penicillin (1940's ?) death among younger people was more common than it is now. Infections that got out of control, etc. So you have to have family extras as likely you know that there will be death among the younger family members, back then. I read somewhere that our life expectancy has gone up in developed countries, not just because some are living longer, but also because there is a lot less infant and youngster mortality.

Another reason ...aforementioned...was the need for people to work on the family farm/ranch, etc. Machines that lessened labour...combines, tractors, etc....have just been around for , and in general use for the past 120 plus years. Increased prevalence of machines also had an effect on how many people you need for manual labour. After awhile if you do much of the farming by machine...the extra people just become more mouths to feed.

And then of course ...birth control....or lack thereof ...comes to mind. Devices , medicines (The Pill) , operations are more effective now then they were back then. And really, there was not much in the way of effective birth control years ago.

Anyway 'Bobservations' (#2) for today.

[mkgd1]

Soceity has invested a lot in you in your first decades in life. You pay back through being productive, pay taxes, spend your money so other people can be productive and pay taxes. If you die before you've paid your "debt" you're a net loss.

But if you stay healthy and die just before retirement, they make a profit

[jeallen01]

@lesmore49

And then there was issue of "entertainment" in the evenings with no radio, "telly", streaming and so on - thus they "entertained" themselves as best they could at the time.

[savoche]

But if you stay healthy and die just before retirement, they make a profit

They, as in those of us who live on, make a profit, sure. How else should we pay for the next generation? And for those already retired who refuse to die

[normhead]

went to a Catholic school from grades 1 through 8. This in the late 50's early 60's. Never saw or experienced any corporal punishment a school.

I taught in both systems here in Canada. From my childhood, some of the stories I heard from my Catholic friends were truly terrifying when mentioning some of the behaviours of the Nuns.

My experience here in Canada was after 10 years in the pubic system, and 15 years in the Catholic system, the Catholic system had incredibly lax discipline standards. As for the uniforms, I never got on board. They were waste of my time. Once again, as far as I was concerned the public system had better polices. The uniform was consistent, however, when a kid tells you he's not going to respect the dress code, and the office refuses to enforce the policy, it just dumps work onto the teachers.

I remember my first week in the catholic system, I confronted a senior student about being out of uniform in the cafeteria. Eventually after a long hard attempt at persuasion I took the kid down to the office. On the way he intimated "I don't know why you're doing this, you're going to get in more trouble than me." He was right he was there 5 minutes, I was there 15, getting a lecture on how to suck up to the kids so they might do what I asked. The inmates were running the asylum. In the next 15 years I never took another kid to the office for uniform.

I found the Catholic system to be great at projecting a disciplinary environment, but pretty horrible at actually enforcing it. As a teacher I got much more support in the public system. The absolute worst principle and senior administration was in a school run by an ex-Priest in the catholic system. But I had great Principals in both systems. And over all, both systems did great work. I'd argue that a school takes it's direction from it's Principal, and I had good and bad Principals in both systems.

[lesmore49]

@lesmore49

And then there was issue of "entertainment" in the evenings with no radio, "telly", streaming and so on - thus they "entertained" themselves as best they could at the time.

You are quite right. I don't know how I didn't say that.

It might of been because I'm shy.

But shy or not, nature and ...entertainment.... will take it's course.

[robtcorl]

Wordy dudes on here today, at least those with new shoulders.

Norm,
It's good to see you appear be healing well, typing wise at least.

[lesmore49]

" I do have pretty good handwriting. That old Palmer Method of teaching handwriting actually did pretty good for me. Pages and pages of swirls. As I get older my handwriting has gotten a bit more sloppy and it ticks me off. "

My handwriting has always been poor. I remember in a chemistry class in grade eleven , getting a test back from my chemistry teacher. He asked me to come back after school classes, at the end of the day to meet with him.

At the meeting, he said that my mark in this test was 65. but that he felt that there was probably about another 20 marks or so, that he had missed. Because of my terrible handwriting.

He said that his handwriting was also poor and he had come up with an idea to address this, and maybe I would benefit from following his example.

He indicated that by the time he reached my age, instead of continuing to try to write in a cursive style, he began to, as he called it 'print write'. He essentially printed out his words to the point that they flowed somewhat.

I thanked him and took his advice and that is the way I 'write' , pretty well from that day forward.

[lesmore49]

Wordy dudes on here today, at least those with new shoulders.

Right you are #1. It is the novelty, to be able to get the old right arm towards doing more and more. It is still a novelty. I still can't raise my right arm fully, nor can I do any hard labour, which even after I'm fully healed....I will make every attempt to avoid.

My surgeon said, when I met with him some weeks ago I could start typing, driving and a whole assortment of other functions, but not go nuts doing all this stuff. Just get into it gradually.

[robtcorl]

My handwriting has always been poor. I remember in a chemistry class in grade eleven , getting a test back from my chemistry teacher. He asked me to come back after school classes, at the end of the day to meet with him.

At the meeting, he said that my mark in this test was 65. but that he felt that there was probably about another 20 marks or so, that he had missed. Because of my terrible handwriting.

He said that his handwriting was also poor and he had come up with an idea to address this, and maybe I would benefit from following his example.

He indicated that by the time he reached my age, instead of continuing to try to write in a cursive style, he began to, as he called it 'print write'. He essentially printed out his words to the point that they flowed somewhat.

I thanked him and took his advice and that is the way I 'write' , pretty well from that day forward.

My cursive writing has always been very poor also. Maybe we should have been doctors?
Surveying field notes are printed, so that's how I've rolled for handwriting since 1965.

[robtcorl]

They say we might be able to see the Northern Lights tonight.
Problem is, we have the city of St Louis to the north of us, so it ain't gonna happen down here.