Optimal Noise reduction setting

wpompen · 12-12-2013, 06:35 AM

Hi guys!
My excuse if this is addressed already: I'm curious if there is someone who can explain what the influence of the noise reduction settings really is.
I've tried several variations but can't say that I'm convinced about which is the best combination of settings. (low iso/1-2-3 etc, p44 of the manual which I actually read haha..)

Thanks a lot for the info!

klkitchens · 12-12-2013, 06:53 AM

Originally posted by wpompen

Hi guys!
My excuse if this is addressed already: I'm curious if there is someone who can explain what the influence of the noise reduction settings really is.
I've tried several variations but can't say that I'm convinced about which is the best combination of settings. (low iso/1-2-3 etc, p44 of the manual which I actually read haha..)

Thanks a lot for the info!

If you're shooting RAW, it won't matter.

mamethot · 12-12-2013, 06:55 AM

Originally posted by klkitchens

If you're shooting RAW, it won't matter.

I've read somewhere that Pentax used to apply NR on the RAW files in the past...maybe it does matter. Or maybe you know they don't. Just saying.

TinaS · 12-12-2013, 07:11 AM

I think if you have it turned on it does affect RAW, but can be changed in PP (that's why it won't matter). Someone can correct me if I'm wrong.
The influence of that setting is that it reduces noise in the photo, but can also cause you to lose detail or sharpness. If you are shooting in RAW, all that can be fixed. I shoot in RAW most of the time now, but I still have my noise reduction set to the medium setting and sharpening turned on. I thought it would save time in PP, but I'm not sure it does.
I'll add, I'm certainly not an expert. I'm still learning my camera, but I keep experimenting to see what works best.

Last edited by TinaS; 12-12-2013 at 07:16 AM.

wpompen · 12-12-2013, 07:18 AM

Okay, let's put it like this:
I'm shooting RAW, does it make sense to use NR at all? You'll end up losing detail whichever way of softening to recover from noise you choose I suspect.
Plus, in-cam PP slows it down also?

TinaS · 12-12-2013, 07:32 AM

It probably doesn't make sense to use it. That was the point I was making: I have it on, and I still make adjustments in PP. So it hasn't saved me any time. I've been thinking about just turning it off (but I was experimenting). The other point was that when I'm using it, I use sharpening too, to save detail. And I have read that in-camera processing will slow it down. I think those settings are more for people who don't want to get into PP. Again, I'm not claiming to be an expert, or anything.

Giklab · 12-12-2013, 08:00 AM

Originally posted by klkitchens

If you're shooting RAW, it won't matter.

Like bloody clockwork. Where exactly did the OP say he's shooting raw?

Anyway: Raw files get the equivalent of Low applied above ISO1600. Any other settings only affect JPEGs and the raw preview JPEG.

IchabodCrane · 12-12-2013, 08:00 AM

Unless I'm mistaken, NR settings do not influence the RAW image as whatever NR is applied to RAW is baked into the camera and not changeable by the user. What you can change in the menu system only affects OOC JPEG images.

audiobomber · 12-12-2013, 08:03 AM

Originally posted by TinaS

I think if you have it turned on it does affect RAW, but can be changed in PP (that's why it won't matter). Someone can correct me if I'm wrong.

Some processing software reads the camera NR setting and interprets it in the raw preview. Some software ignores the camera setting. Either way, you are correct, the amount of NR can be increased or decreased in p-p.

I shoot raw or raw+. For raw conversion, I use DCU5 and LR4, both of which read the camera NR setting. With my K20D, K-x and Q, I did formal testing and set the NR to a level I was comfortable with (Weak on the K20D, Low on the other two). The are more settings and more complication on the K-3, but one of these days I will do the same thing, shoot a series of tests and select a level for each ISO. Then I will forget about it.

rawr · 12-12-2013, 08:14 AM

A lot of the current [DPR based] discussion of 'high ISO NR settings cause softness' is confusing the impact of Pentax's JPG rendering options like 'Bright' (the default), 'Natural', 'Vivid' etc, and the impact of in camera noise processing in JPEG.

Just something to think about ... Boost the sharpness and contrast of any of those rendering options, and 'softness' disappears in K-3 JPG's, almost independent of any NR settings.

TinaS · 12-12-2013, 08:14 AM

Originally posted by audiobomber

Some processing software reads the camera NR setting and interprets it in the raw preview. Some software ignores the camera setting. Either way, you are correct, the amount of NR can be increased or decreased in p-p.

I shoot raw or raw+. For raw conversion, I use DCU5 and LR4, both of which read the camera NR setting. With my K20D, K-x and Q, I did formal testing and set the NR to a level I was comfortable with (Weak on the K20D, Low on the other two). The are more settings and more complication on the K-3, but one of these days I will do the same thing, shoot a series of tests and select a level for each ISO. Then I will forget about it.

I use LR3. I've noticed that it does read the NR from my K-x. I've been thinking about turning it off, but haven't decided. I will try the low setting like you mentioned, before I decide. I know I won't completely avoid PP, but I would like if I can cut out some steps.

TinaS · 12-12-2013, 08:17 AM

Originally posted by rawr

A lot of the current [DPR based] discussion of 'high ISO NR settings cause softness' is confusing the impact of Pentax's JPG rendering options like 'Bright' (the default), 'Natural', 'Vivid' etc, and the impact of in camera noise processing in JPEG.

Just something to think about ... Boost the sharpness and contrast of any of those rendering options, and 'softness' disappears in K-3 JPG's, almost independent of any NR settings.

Agreed. That does make a big difference.

audiobomber · 12-12-2013, 08:45 AM

Originally posted by TinaS

I have read that in-camera processing will slow it down.

I've heard that too, but I don't believe it. The only noticeable slowing I've ever seen is on older cameras with Lens Corrections enabled, and even that is negligible on the K-3.

audiobomber · 12-12-2013, 08:48 AM

Originally posted by TinaS

I use LR3. I've noticed that it does read the NR from my K-x. I've been thinking about turning it off, but haven't decided. I will try the low setting like you mentioned, before I decide. I know I won't completely avoid PP, but I would like if I can cut out some steps.

That's my thinking. If the in-camera NR setting is reasonable, it's one less step in post.
BTW, on the K-x I also set "Noise Reduction is activated when the sensitivity is higher than ISO 800".

TinaS · 12-12-2013, 08:57 AM

Originally posted by audiobomber

That's my thinking. If the in-camera NR setting is reasonable, it's one less step in post.
BTW, on the K-x I also set "Noise Reduction is activated when the sensitivity is higher than ISO 800".

Thanks. I will check my settings and try that too.

12-12-2013, 06:35 AM	#1
wpompen Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 64	Optimal Noise reduction setting Hi guys! My excuse if this is addressed already: I'm curious if there is someone who can explain what the influence of the noise reduction settings really is. I've tried several variations but can't say that I'm convinced about which is the best combination of settings. (low iso/1-2-3 etc, p44 of the manual which I actually read haha..) Thanks a lot for the info!

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12-12-2013, 06:53 AM	#2
klkitchens Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Allanta, GA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 480	Originally posted by wpompen Hi guys! My excuse if this is addressed already: I'm curious if there is someone who can explain what the influence of the noise reduction settings really is. I've tried several variations but can't say that I'm convinced about which is the best combination of settings. (low iso/1-2-3 etc, p44 of the manual which I actually read haha..) Thanks a lot for the info! If you're shooting RAW, it won't matter.

12-12-2013, 06:55 AM	#3
mamethot Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Greater Montreal Area Posts: 736	Originally posted by klkitchens If you're shooting RAW, it won't matter. I've read somewhere that Pentax used to apply NR on the RAW files in the past...maybe it does matter. Or maybe you know they don't. Just saying.

12-12-2013, 07:11 AM	#4
TinaS Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,164	I think if you have it turned on it does affect RAW, but can be changed in PP (that's why it won't matter). Someone can correct me if I'm wrong. The influence of that setting is that it reduces noise in the photo, but can also cause you to lose detail or sharpness. If you are shooting in RAW, all that can be fixed. I shoot in RAW most of the time now, but I still have my noise reduction set to the medium setting and sharpening turned on. I thought it would save time in PP, but I'm not sure it does. I'll add, I'm certainly not an expert. I'm still learning my camera, but I keep experimenting to see what works best. Last edited by TinaS; 12-12-2013 at 07:16 AM.

12-12-2013, 07:18 AM	#5
wpompen Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 64 Original Poster	Okay, let's put it like this: I'm shooting RAW, does it make sense to use NR at all? You'll end up losing detail whichever way of softening to recover from noise you choose I suspect. Plus, in-cam PP slows it down also?

12-12-2013, 07:32 AM	#6
TinaS Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,164	It probably doesn't make sense to use it. That was the point I was making: I have it on, and I still make adjustments in PP. So it hasn't saved me any time. I've been thinking about just turning it off (but I was experimenting). The other point was that when I'm using it, I use sharpening too, to save detail. And I have read that in-camera processing will slow it down. I think those settings are more for people who don't want to get into PP. Again, I'm not claiming to be an expert, or anything.

12-12-2013, 08:00 AM	#7
Giklab Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Slovenia Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,182	Originally posted by klkitchens If you're shooting RAW, it won't matter. Like bloody clockwork. Where exactly did the OP say he's shooting raw? Anyway: Raw files get the equivalent of Low applied above ISO1600. Any other settings only affect JPEGs and the raw preview JPEG.

12-12-2013, 08:00 AM	#8
IchabodCrane Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,728	Unless I'm mistaken, NR settings do not influence the RAW image as whatever NR is applied to RAW is baked into the camera and not changeable by the user. What you can change in the menu system only affects OOC JPEG images.

12-12-2013, 08:03 AM	#9
audiobomber Veteran Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Sudbury, Ontario Photos: Albums Posts: 6,806	Originally posted by TinaS I think if you have it turned on it does affect RAW, but can be changed in PP (that's why it won't matter). Someone can correct me if I'm wrong. Some processing software reads the camera NR setting and interprets it in the raw preview. Some software ignores the camera setting. Either way, you are correct, the amount of NR can be increased or decreased in p-p. I shoot raw or raw+. For raw conversion, I use DCU5 and LR4, both of which read the camera NR setting. With my K20D, K-x and Q, I did formal testing and set the NR to a level I was comfortable with (Weak on the K20D, Low on the other two). The are more settings and more complication on the K-3, but one of these days I will do the same thing, shoot a series of tests and select a level for each ISO. Then I will forget about it.

12-12-2013, 08:14 AM	#10
rawr Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 11,913	A lot of the current [DPR based] discussion of 'high ISO NR settings cause softness' is confusing the impact of Pentax's JPG rendering options like 'Bright' (the default), 'Natural', 'Vivid' etc, and the impact of in camera noise processing in JPEG. Just something to think about ... Boost the sharpness and contrast of any of those rendering options, and 'softness' disappears in K-3 JPG's, almost independent of any NR settings.

12-12-2013, 08:14 AM	#11
TinaS Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,164	Originally posted by audiobomber Some processing software reads the camera NR setting and interprets it in the raw preview. Some software ignores the camera setting. Either way, you are correct, the amount of NR can be increased or decreased in p-p. I shoot raw or raw+. For raw conversion, I use DCU5 and LR4, both of which read the camera NR setting. With my K20D, K-x and Q, I did formal testing and set the NR to a level I was comfortable with (Weak on the K20D, Low on the other two). The are more settings and more complication on the K-3, but one of these days I will do the same thing, shoot a series of tests and select a level for each ISO. Then I will forget about it. I use LR3. I've noticed that it does read the NR from my K-x. I've been thinking about turning it off, but haven't decided. I will try the low setting like you mentioned, before I decide. I know I won't completely avoid PP, but I would like if I can cut out some steps.

12-12-2013, 08:17 AM	#12
TinaS Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,164	Originally posted by rawr A lot of the current [DPR based] discussion of 'high ISO NR settings cause softness' is confusing the impact of Pentax's JPG rendering options like 'Bright' (the default), 'Natural', 'Vivid' etc, and the impact of in camera noise processing in JPEG. Just something to think about ... Boost the sharpness and contrast of any of those rendering options, and 'softness' disappears in K-3 JPG's, almost independent of any NR settings. Agreed. That does make a big difference.

12-12-2013, 08:45 AM	#13
audiobomber Veteran Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Sudbury, Ontario Photos: Albums Posts: 6,806	Originally posted by TinaS I have read that in-camera processing will slow it down. I've heard that too, but I don't believe it. The only noticeable slowing I've ever seen is on older cameras with Lens Corrections enabled, and even that is negligible on the K-3.

12-12-2013, 08:48 AM	#14
audiobomber Veteran Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Sudbury, Ontario Photos: Albums Posts: 6,806	Originally posted by TinaS I use LR3. I've noticed that it does read the NR from my K-x. I've been thinking about turning it off, but haven't decided. I will try the low setting like you mentioned, before I decide. I know I won't completely avoid PP, but I would like if I can cut out some steps. That's my thinking. If the in-camera NR setting is reasonable, it's one less step in post. BTW, on the K-x I also set "Noise Reduction is activated when the sensitivity is higher than ISO 800".

12-12-2013, 08:57 AM	#15
TinaS Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,164	Originally posted by audiobomber That's my thinking. If the in-camera NR setting is reasonable, it's one less step in post. BTW, on the K-x I also set "Noise Reduction is activated when the sensitivity is higher than ISO 800". Thanks. I will check my settings and try that too.