My new K-3 suffers from "early shutter penalty"

asp1880 · 08-21-2014, 01:41 PM

I've had a K-5 classic for a couple of years now. When in single shot mode, it's always been able to shoot as fast as I could stab the shutter button repeatedly. Several shots per second, no problem, with AF, lens corrections and everything.

My K-3 doesn't behave like that. When in single shot mode, the camera makes a pronounced pause after every shot. It's shooting only on every second or third shutter button stab, approximately.

I've learned that Imaging Resource calls the phenomenon "early shutter penalty". Their K-3 review found that the K-3 didn't suffer from this. But they found the K-30 did.

I've tried a camera reset. That didn't help.
I've tried with manual focus. That didn't help either.

Is my K-3 behaving oddly? If it is, I'll have it serviced under warranty.

Rats. Other than this "issue" (hate that term), the camera is great.

Regards,
--Anders.

panoguy · 08-21-2014, 02:31 PM - **1 Like**

(Trying not to suggest Viagra... and failing!)

JinDesu · 08-21-2014, 02:33 PM

For clarity, can you provide a little more detail as for the function you are expecting?

Are you saying that on your k-5, you press the shutter button, the camera focuses, shoots, and you press the shutter button again, it focuses, and shoots? Or are you saying the camera focuses, shoots, and you press the shutter button again and it shoots without needing to focus a second time?

And on your k-3, with the above sequence - where is the pause?

For reference, I just tested on my k-3 in green mode:
Press shutter and hold down. Camera focuses and fires.
Press shutter again and hold down immediately after. Camera checks focus and fires.

stevebrot · 08-21-2014, 02:34 PM

Originally posted by asp1880

Is my K-3 behaving oddly?

I can't say for sure. Mine seems to be similarly sluggish, though I am not sure if that is outside specification. I believe that my (now sold) K10D was similar, however.

Steve

---------- Post added 08-21-14 at 02:37 PM ----------

Originally posted by JinDesu

And on your k-3, with the above sequence - where is the pause?

The way I read it, the OP is saying that on his K-5 he was able to take photos as quickly as he liked in single shot mode and on his K-3 he is no longer able to do this.

Steve

JinDesu · 08-21-2014, 02:39 PM

Originally posted by stevebrot

The way I read it, the OP is saying that on his K-5 he was able to take photos as quickly as he liked in single shot mode and on his K-3 he is no longer able to do this.

Steve

If so, mine does not have that issue and I would consider it a fault unless he has some setting that makes it take longer to process. Mine's almost instant if the focus is spot on - it does a quick check and fires on my next immediate press.

amoringello · 08-21-2014, 02:44 PM

Yeah, same here. Seems to fire at most 2 per second. Whereas my K5 will shoot just about as fast as I can stab at it.
Disappointing. I am surprised I haven't noticed on my own yet.

stevebrot · 08-21-2014, 02:52 PM

Originally posted by amoringello

Seems to fire at most 2 per second.

Yes, and the conditions where this is the case are hard to predict. I am seriously puzzled.

Steve

Tanzer · 08-21-2014, 02:57 PM

Maybe something to do with the AA filter simulator? With the K-5, it is easy to outpace the SR, if you don't wait for the little "hand" icon to appear. I'd imagine the K-3 might force you to wait for the SR mechanism to be ready, since it is used for the AA simulator.

fgaudet · 08-21-2014, 02:59 PM

Same thing here with the K3.

The K5 doesn't behave like this, it will fire every time, as fast as I can press the shutter and as long as the focus is confirmed.

But I must say, I had the K3 for a few months, shot about 4000 to 5000 pictures with it and never noticed that behaviour until you mentioned it

amoringello · 08-21-2014, 03:04 PM

I have in manual mode, fast shutter speed, no SR and no AA filter.
All of the other image-altering configurations (high dynamic range, etc...) are also off although I notice no difference when they are on.
Even writing only to slot 1, in either RAW or JPG, no difference from RAW+ or writing RAW to 1 and JPG to 2.

If its a setting, it seems to be something rather obscure.

zekewhipper · 08-21-2014, 03:04 PM

Are you sure you don't have the self-timer function on?

chimpwithagun · 08-21-2014, 03:07 PM

Just tested my K-3. Here are my results:

In burst mode - shoots continuously with no lag. I get a ton of frames and can capture clear frames of a friend doing a kickflip on a skateboard.
In single shot mode - no lag with shutter button focusing OFF (I use the back button).
If I hold the focus button down while firing in semi-auto (one press, one image) I will occasionally get shutter lag if I change composition or when my subject moves.
When the pop-up flash is up, there is considerable lag between shots.
When using radio triggers to pop off-camera flash, this lag is not present.
In green mode, tav, av, and tv - the same results as above were found.

I have instant review turned off - this might cause your lag (OP didn't mention whether instant review was used).
In all cases, I was shooting in RAW. I HAVE found intense buffering issues when shooting in JPG with digital filters applied. These do not effect the performance of the camera until I try to review the images on the lcd screen. I have to wait longer than I would like.
I also have shake reduction, and just about every other thing, like lens correction, highlight correction, etc. - turned off. I don't know if any of that would cause lag.

amoringello · 08-21-2014, 03:09 PM

HA! It seems to be a internal dampening timer, perhaps? (maybe other issues as Steve seems to see inconsistent behavior)
Set continuous shooting mode to H and leave in continuous mode.

Now stab at the shutter as fast as you want.
It is not due to the shutter being held down, as I can shoot faster than 2 per second, but definitely not 8 per second!!
It *seems* like Pentax has put some sort of delay for single-shot mode.

**crewl1** · 08-21-2014, 03:10 PM

Originally posted by asp1880

Is my K-3 behaving oddly? If it is, I'll have it serviced under warranty.

Mine does the same. Tested and compared to K-5, exactly as you describe. (SR off, MF switched, no AA, no lens)

Never noticed because I use continuous shutter for sports. Otherwise one at a time is fine.

Oh by the way the K-30 works just like the K-5, single shots shutter press has no wait.

Tanzer · 08-21-2014, 03:19 PM

Sorry to hear about this. I love how I can fire off a burst of shots on the K-5, just by wiggling my shutter finger a little, and I never feel the need to go into burst mode.

08-21-2014, 01:41 PM	#1
asp1880 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Lyngby, Copenhagen Photos: Albums Posts: 742	My new K-3 suffers from "early shutter penalty" I've had a K-5 classic for a couple of years now. When in single shot mode, it's always been able to shoot as fast as I could stab the shutter button repeatedly. Several shots per second, no problem, with AF, lens corrections and everything. My K-3 doesn't behave like that. When in single shot mode, the camera makes a pronounced pause after every shot. It's shooting only on every second or third shutter button stab, approximately. I've learned that Imaging Resource calls the phenomenon "early shutter penalty". Their K-3 review found that the K-3 didn't suffer from this. But they found the K-30 did. I've tried a camera reset. That didn't help. I've tried with manual focus. That didn't help either. Is my K-3 behaving oddly? If it is, I'll have it serviced under warranty. Rats. Other than this "issue" (hate that term), the camera is great. Regards, --Anders.

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08-21-2014, 02:31 PM - 1 Like	#2
panoguy Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Washington, D.C. Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,327	(Trying not to suggest Viagra... and failing!)

08-21-2014, 02:33 PM	#3
JinDesu Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: New York City Photos: Gallery Posts: 5,638	For clarity, can you provide a little more detail as for the function you are expecting? Are you saying that on your k-5, you press the shutter button, the camera focuses, shoots, and you press the shutter button again, it focuses, and shoots? Or are you saying the camera focuses, shoots, and you press the shutter button again and it shoots without needing to focus a second time? And on your k-3, with the above sequence - where is the pause? For reference, I just tested on my k-3 in green mode: Press shutter and hold down. Camera focuses and fires. Press shutter again and hold down immediately after. Camera checks focus and fires.

08-21-2014, 02:34 PM	#4
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by asp1880 Is my K-3 behaving oddly? I can't say for sure. Mine seems to be similarly sluggish, though I am not sure if that is outside specification. I believe that my (now sold) K10D was similar, however. Steve ---------- Post added 08-21-14 at 02:37 PM ---------- Originally posted by JinDesu And on your k-3, with the above sequence - where is the pause? The way I read it, the OP is saying that on his K-5 he was able to take photos as quickly as he liked in single shot mode and on his K-3 he is no longer able to do this. Steve

08-21-2014, 02:39 PM	#5
JinDesu Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: New York City Photos: Gallery Posts: 5,638	Originally posted by stevebrot The way I read it, the OP is saying that on his K-5 he was able to take photos as quickly as he liked in single shot mode and on his K-3 he is no longer able to do this. Steve If so, mine does not have that issue and I would consider it a fault unless he has some setting that makes it take longer to process. Mine's almost instant if the focus is spot on - it does a quick check and fires on my next immediate press.

08-21-2014, 02:44 PM	#6
amoringello Veteran Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Virginia, USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,562	Yeah, same here. Seems to fire at most 2 per second. Whereas my K5 will shoot just about as fast as I can stab at it. Disappointing. I am surprised I haven't noticed on my own yet.

08-21-2014, 02:52 PM	#7
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by amoringello Seems to fire at most 2 per second. Yes, and the conditions where this is the case are hard to predict. I am seriously puzzled. Steve

08-21-2014, 02:57 PM	#8
Tanzer Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Perrineville, NJ Posts: 1,375	Maybe something to do with the AA filter simulator? With the K-5, it is easy to outpace the SR, if you don't wait for the little "hand" icon to appear. I'd imagine the K-3 might force you to wait for the SR mechanism to be ready, since it is used for the AA simulator.

08-21-2014, 02:59 PM	#9
fgaudet Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Ontario Posts: 726	Same thing here with the K3. The K5 doesn't behave like this, it will fire every time, as fast as I can press the shutter and as long as the focus is confirmed. But I must say, I had the K3 for a few months, shot about 4000 to 5000 pictures with it and never noticed that behaviour until you mentioned it

08-21-2014, 03:04 PM	#10
amoringello Veteran Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Virginia, USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,562	I have in manual mode, fast shutter speed, no SR and no AA filter. All of the other image-altering configurations (high dynamic range, etc...) are also off although I notice no difference when they are on. Even writing only to slot 1, in either RAW or JPG, no difference from RAW+ or writing RAW to 1 and JPG to 2. If its a setting, it seems to be something rather obscure.

08-21-2014, 03:04 PM	#11
zekewhipper Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Photos: Albums Posts: 307	Are you sure you don't have the self-timer function on?

08-21-2014, 03:07 PM	#12
chimpwithagun Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: California Posts: 57	Just tested my K-3. Here are my results: In burst mode - shoots continuously with no lag. I get a ton of frames and can capture clear frames of a friend doing a kickflip on a skateboard. In single shot mode - no lag with shutter button focusing OFF (I use the back button). If I hold the focus button down while firing in semi-auto (one press, one image) I will occasionally get shutter lag if I change composition or when my subject moves. When the pop-up flash is up, there is considerable lag between shots. When using radio triggers to pop off-camera flash, this lag is not present. In green mode, tav, av, and tv - the same results as above were found. I have instant review turned off - this might cause your lag (OP didn't mention whether instant review was used). In all cases, I was shooting in RAW. I HAVE found intense buffering issues when shooting in JPG with digital filters applied. These do not effect the performance of the camera until I try to review the images on the lcd screen. I have to wait longer than I would like. I also have shake reduction, and just about every other thing, like lens correction, highlight correction, etc. - turned off. I don't know if any of that would cause lag.

08-21-2014, 03:09 PM	#13
amoringello Veteran Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Virginia, USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,562	HA! It seems to be a internal dampening timer, perhaps? (maybe other issues as Steve seems to see inconsistent behavior) Set continuous shooting mode to H and leave in continuous mode. Now stab at the shutter as fast as you want. It is not due to the shutter being held down, as I can shoot faster than 2 per second, but definitely not 8 per second!! It seems like Pentax has put some sort of delay for single-shot mode.

08-21-2014, 03:10 PM	#14
crewl1 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Los Angeles, CA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,807	Originally posted by asp1880 Is my K-3 behaving oddly? If it is, I'll have it serviced under warranty. Mine does the same. Tested and compared to K-5, exactly as you describe. (SR off, MF switched, no AA, no lens) Never noticed because I use continuous shutter for sports. Otherwise one at a time is fine. Oh by the way the K-30 works just like the K-5, single shots shutter press has no wait.

08-21-2014, 03:19 PM	#15
Tanzer Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Perrineville, NJ Posts: 1,375	Sorry to hear about this. I love how I can fire off a burst of shots on the K-5, just by wiggling my shutter finger a little, and I never feel the need to go into burst mode.