My über-brief K-3 II review

Zafar Iqbal · 08-19-2015, 07:59 AM

ogl: I've disabled any effect or processing related stuff, so that shouldn't be it

5teve · 08-19-2015, 06:18 PM

Re lens compatibility (admittedly on a K3) , I have a tamron 70-200 and in liveview its focus is a mile off.. but with normal focusing, i have dialled it in fairly well with a -2 adjustment. neither of my tamrons 28-75 or 70-200 seem to focus quite like my 16-45 pentax. the pentax is real quick, the tamrons are much faster than on my k20, but liveview focus sucks with them, but not with the pentax.

Tamron have been contacted and dont want to know about it.

Steve

Bromberger · 08-29-2015, 05:05 AM

Originally posted by Zafar Iqbal

Thumb pad = blister on thumb
Lower right corner (back side) = very sore thumb muscle
Lower right corner (front side) = blister on my palm
Grip just below the front dial = blister on middle finger in progress

It sounds to me like you support the weight of the camera with your right hand.
I suggest you try to support the weight with your left hand (under middle of the body and under the lens) and have the right hand only control the camera, not hold it.
Afaik that's a healthier way to hold any camera.

Nicolas06 · 08-29-2015, 05:52 AM

Originally posted by Bromberger

It sounds to me like you support the weight of the camera with your right hand.
I suggest you try to support the weight with your left hand (under middle of the body and under the lens) and have the right hand only control the camera, not hold it.
Afaik that's a healthier way to hold any camera.

how do you do if you have a flash with diffuser in one hand and the camera in the other hand? Also how do you explain the OP didn't have the issue with K30?

Bromberger · 08-29-2015, 08:58 AM

Hi Nicolas,

Originally posted by Nicolas06

how do you do if you have a flash with diffuser in one hand and the camera in the other hand?

Mh i guess you can't...?
But neither did the OP (or anybody else) mention a flash or diffuser, nor that he would hold them himself.
Also, i think my advice is still good advice, regardless of whether you might be able to follow it in every situation imaginable.

Originally posted by Nicolas06

Also how do you explain the OP didn't have the issue with K30?

The OP's health problems might come from the new camera 100% like he suggested. Or the camera might only account for say 30%, and the other 70% come from holding the camera(s) wrong... who knows. Might be worth a try if it helps with his health.
Also, the OP wrote he DID have health problems with the K30, too - just not as much.

Sincerely,
Bromberger

Zafar Iqbal · 08-30-2015, 05:09 PM

While shooting, the weight is more often than not distributed across both hands. The left has a bigger share as it's used to stabilize the camera.

Most of the issues are a result of raising, lower and especially tilting the bodies from hip height. If I'm holding for instance the body with 70-200 mounted on it, it's often held in vertical position as this is much easier than to keep the lens horizontal. Most of the time I use both hand even when idling, but I can't do it all the time.

I might be able to improve how I use the bodies here and there, but overall I think it's my shooting style which means I'm always on alert for the next shot. For instance, I was out for 14 hours yesterday and can barely feel the effects on my hand today. On the other hand (uhm :P ), I can be out on a 6 hour job and come home with a much worse hand.

Bromberger · 08-30-2015, 05:43 PM

Originally posted by Zafar Iqbal

While shooting, the weight is more often than not distributed across both hands. The left has a bigger share as it's used to stabilize the camera.

Most of the issues are a result of raising, lower and especially tilting the bodies from hip height. If I'm holding for instance the body with 70-200 mounted on it, it's often held in vertical position as this is much easier than to keep the lens horizontal. Most of the time I use both hand even when idling, but I can't do it all the time.

I might be able to improve how I use the bodies here and there, but overall I think it's my shooting style which means I'm always on alert for the next shot. For instance, I was out for 14 hours yesterday and can barely feel the effects on my hand today. On the other hand (uhm :P ), I can be out on a 6 hour job and come home with a much worse hand.

I see. I hope your symptoms get better with time, good luck

tabl10s · 09-01-2015, 03:20 PM

Originally posted by Zafar Iqbal

This is a quick rundown of my opinions of the camera with a list of pros and cons.

I cover lot's of wedding so most of this revolves around the way I use the camera, and not so much about every single thing the camera features.

I previously used K-30's - I had intended to buy K-5, but kept experiencing bad focusing issue with several bodies.

I've shot 7 weddings since I got K-3 II - just to put things a bit in perspective. Body 1 is at some 14k exposures and body 2 at some 8k exposures.

Pro's:
- Pro feeling
Doesn't really matter too much but hey :P

- Silent shutter
- Large buffer
- Fast burst-rate
- Dual SD card slot

- 1/8000 shutterspeed
Especially now that I have a f1.8 zoom as my workhorse lens

- Mode dial lock
Very nice!

- 24MP
Perceptually sharper image and less noise - I even apply less sharpening in post now

- GPS
Though I haven't used it much

- Lacking flash
Yes, it's a plus as I no longer can accidentally make it pop up.

- Size
Still small enough to carry around on everyday basis.

- 14bit RAW/Dynamic range
What can I say. Coming from K-30 it's yum yum yum!

- Shake Reduction
I've read so-so comments about SR and in my experience, the improvement is huge. I rely a lot on my 70-200 but it's the first lens to go, as there will at some point be too little light, and with slower shutterspeeds, handholding a tele is very tricky. Apparently no longer. I've been doing sub 1/100 shots and had tack sharp photos at 100+ mm.

- Low light focusing
Another reason I've been able to keep using the 70-200 is the lower light focusing capabilities. Before, the micro shakes would be too severe and the poorer ability to lock in low light would cause it to be very slow - but no longer

- Larger viewfinder
Not only is it larger, but even though I wear glasses, I can see all edges and corners without having to move from side to side, up and down. Not being able to do so with the K-30 was very frustrating as I often got a compositions wrong even though I thought they were OK.

- User modes
User modes actually remembers exposure settings. K-30 doesn't do that and correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think the K-5 did either.

Con's:
- Thumb rest-pad
I suspected it would cause problem the very first time I held the camera, and sure enough, after having used the camera for less than 2 months, I have a blister on my thumb

- Buttons
I generally prefer lot's and lot's of buttons but I've had a hard time getting used to them:
AF mode and switch are "OK" but I prefer the K-30 switch. It's way faster.
AF lock is super weird for me. Often I find myself having to keep the camera few cm further away from me when shooting in portrait mode.
ISO/Green button - I'm getting there, but I used the green button a lot on the K-30 and now it's not where I was used to have it

- Top display
I don't use it, but I think chances for using it would be greater if it would show exactly which AF point I have selected. It also does not tell me if I'm in selective AF mode or not

- Back display
Slightly laggy compared to K-30 - this is mostly noticeable when trying to change between different display modes. It can be laggy enough to sometimes confuse and irritate me.

- Focus point overlay in viewfinder
I really find this to be a joke. It's often very hard to notice and there have been times where I tried to really look for it, but couldn't find it because it's smaller and/or dimmer. I never had that problem with K-30

- Previews
Panning while previewing is much slower than K-30. Feel's like I was used to a Ferrari and now got me a sloppy family car. Changing shooting format, image size and compression does not affect this

- Too many AF points
Yeah, I said it. An option to decrease the amount would have been very nice. I often need to compose fast so it's helps to get the AF in the right ball-park. That's typically center or corner points. Now, I have to click more times which takes longer and increases chances to miss shots

- Ergonomics
I slightly touched this but a quick round up:
Thumb pad = blister on thumb
Lower right corner (back side) = very sore thumb muscle
Lower right corner (front side) = blister on my palm
Grip just below the front dial = blister on middle finger in progress

None of above would be any problem if I shot now and then, but with hours and hours of shooting, the k-3 II is seriously messing up my hand. K-30 wasn't perfect, but I've been shooting with K-30 for 2 years and had less problems

- Focusing
I have two K-3 II bodies:

The first fails especially when trying to focus at stuff far away. This is true across several lenses

The second body is better and gets closer. The AF on my K-30 bodies got worse over time for whatever reason, but I'd bet they were more accurate than these K-3 II's, when I first got them

Because of this I've been relying *a lot* on liveview, but I simply can't keep doing that.

- Lens compatibility?
I'm not sure what exactly this is, but the 70-200 no longer works as it used to. When the camera introduces focus double-check, the lens goes way out of focus before going back into focus again. In practical terms it means It can take much longer to get a lock - if I use AF.C and FPS priority, then this double-check thingy gets completely out of control and is not useful at all. I have not noticed this behavior on other lenses

- Soft lock-up
Lens wont focus but camera appears to be functional. On/off solves the issue

- Hard lock-up
Camera is still on but I can't do anything. Need to replace the battery before it will function again

- Mirror flapping

- High ISO
At higher ISO's the noise starts to look very artificial

Conclusion:
I need gloves and/or batterygrip and will then hopefully be fine. The focusing accuracy is a different matter and I no longer trust repairshops due to past experiences. I will none the less send it in anyways and hope they won't worsen the AF accuracy, which has happened before (K-5).

Beside that, the K-3 II is a fine camera and it's mostly or only because I really work hard at weddings, that I'm having ergonomic problems.

In all fairness I must add, that I've been using Sigma 18-35 which is way heavier than Sigma 17-50 that I used to use.

Relax and stop gripping the body so tightly. On a cold day, if you keep licking your lips, guess what happens?

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08-19-2015, 07:59 AM	#16
Zafar Iqbal Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,229 Original Poster	ogl: I've disabled any effect or processing related stuff, so that shouldn't be it

08-19-2015, 06:18 PM	#17
5teve Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Perth - Australia Photos: Albums Posts: 226	Re lens compatibility (admittedly on a K3) , I have a tamron 70-200 and in liveview its focus is a mile off.. but with normal focusing, i have dialled it in fairly well with a -2 adjustment. neither of my tamrons 28-75 or 70-200 seem to focus quite like my 16-45 pentax. the pentax is real quick, the tamrons are much faster than on my k20, but liveview focus sucks with them, but not with the pentax. Tamron have been contacted and dont want to know about it. Steve

08-29-2015, 05:05 AM	#18
Bromberger Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: Stuttgart, Germany Posts: 186	Originally posted by Zafar Iqbal Thumb pad = blister on thumb Lower right corner (back side) = very sore thumb muscle Lower right corner (front side) = blister on my palm Grip just below the front dial = blister on middle finger in progress It sounds to me like you support the weight of the camera with your right hand. I suggest you try to support the weight with your left hand (under middle of the body and under the lens) and have the right hand only control the camera, not hold it. Afaik that's a healthier way to hold any camera.

08-29-2015, 05:52 AM	#19
Nicolas06 Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 4,854	Originally posted by Bromberger It sounds to me like you support the weight of the camera with your right hand. I suggest you try to support the weight with your left hand (under middle of the body and under the lens) and have the right hand only control the camera, not hold it. Afaik that's a healthier way to hold any camera. how do you do if you have a flash with diffuser in one hand and the camera in the other hand? Also how do you explain the OP didn't have the issue with K30?

08-29-2015, 08:58 AM	#20
Bromberger Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: Stuttgart, Germany Posts: 186	Hi Nicolas, Originally posted by Nicolas06 how do you do if you have a flash with diffuser in one hand and the camera in the other hand? Mh i guess you can't...? But neither did the OP (or anybody else) mention a flash or diffuser, nor that he would hold them himself. Also, i think my advice is still good advice, regardless of whether you might be able to follow it in every situation imaginable. Originally posted by Nicolas06 Also how do you explain the OP didn't have the issue with K30? The OP's health problems might come from the new camera 100% like he suggested. Or the camera might only account for say 30%, and the other 70% come from holding the camera(s) wrong... who knows. Might be worth a try if it helps with his health. Also, the OP wrote he DID have health problems with the K30, too - just not as much. Sincerely, Bromberger

08-30-2015, 05:09 PM	#21
Zafar Iqbal Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,229 Original Poster	While shooting, the weight is more often than not distributed across both hands. The left has a bigger share as it's used to stabilize the camera. Most of the issues are a result of raising, lower and especially tilting the bodies from hip height. If I'm holding for instance the body with 70-200 mounted on it, it's often held in vertical position as this is much easier than to keep the lens horizontal. Most of the time I use both hand even when idling, but I can't do it all the time. I might be able to improve how I use the bodies here and there, but overall I think it's my shooting style which means I'm always on alert for the next shot. For instance, I was out for 14 hours yesterday and can barely feel the effects on my hand today. On the other hand (uhm :P ), I can be out on a 6 hour job and come home with a much worse hand.

08-30-2015, 05:43 PM	#22
Bromberger Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: Stuttgart, Germany Posts: 186	Originally posted by Zafar Iqbal While shooting, the weight is more often than not distributed across both hands. The left has a bigger share as it's used to stabilize the camera. Most of the issues are a result of raising, lower and especially tilting the bodies from hip height. If I'm holding for instance the body with 70-200 mounted on it, it's often held in vertical position as this is much easier than to keep the lens horizontal. Most of the time I use both hand even when idling, but I can't do it all the time. I might be able to improve how I use the bodies here and there, but overall I think it's my shooting style which means I'm always on alert for the next shot. For instance, I was out for 14 hours yesterday and can barely feel the effects on my hand today. On the other hand (uhm :P ), I can be out on a 6 hour job and come home with a much worse hand. I see. I hope your symptoms get better with time, good luck

09-01-2015, 03:20 PM	#23
tabl10s Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Sacramento(formerly from B'Ham, England). Posts: 1,424	Originally posted by Zafar Iqbal This is a quick rundown of my opinions of the camera with a list of pros and cons. I cover lot's of wedding so most of this revolves around the way I use the camera, and not so much about every single thing the camera features. I previously used K-30's - I had intended to buy K-5, but kept experiencing bad focusing issue with several bodies. I've shot 7 weddings since I got K-3 II - just to put things a bit in perspective. Body 1 is at some 14k exposures and body 2 at some 8k exposures. Pro's: - Pro feeling Doesn't really matter too much but hey :P - Silent shutter - Large buffer - Fast burst-rate - Dual SD card slot - 1/8000 shutterspeed Especially now that I have a f1.8 zoom as my workhorse lens - Mode dial lock Very nice! - 24MP Perceptually sharper image and less noise - I even apply less sharpening in post now - GPS Though I haven't used it much - Lacking flash Yes, it's a plus as I no longer can accidentally make it pop up. - Size Still small enough to carry around on everyday basis. - 14bit RAW/Dynamic range What can I say. Coming from K-30 it's yum yum yum! - Shake Reduction I've read so-so comments about SR and in my experience, the improvement is huge. I rely a lot on my 70-200 but it's the first lens to go, as there will at some point be too little light, and with slower shutterspeeds, handholding a tele is very tricky. Apparently no longer. I've been doing sub 1/100 shots and had tack sharp photos at 100+ mm. - Low light focusing Another reason I've been able to keep using the 70-200 is the lower light focusing capabilities. Before, the micro shakes would be too severe and the poorer ability to lock in low light would cause it to be very slow - but no longer - Larger viewfinder Not only is it larger, but even though I wear glasses, I can see all edges and corners without having to move from side to side, up and down. Not being able to do so with the K-30 was very frustrating as I often got a compositions wrong even though I thought they were OK. - User modes User modes actually remembers exposure settings. K-30 doesn't do that and correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think the K-5 did either. Con's: - Thumb rest-pad I suspected it would cause problem the very first time I held the camera, and sure enough, after having used the camera for less than 2 months, I have a blister on my thumb - Buttons I generally prefer lot's and lot's of buttons but I've had a hard time getting used to them: AF mode and switch are "OK" but I prefer the K-30 switch. It's way faster. AF lock is super weird for me. Often I find myself having to keep the camera few cm further away from me when shooting in portrait mode. ISO/Green button - I'm getting there, but I used the green button a lot on the K-30 and now it's not where I was used to have it - Top display I don't use it, but I think chances for using it would be greater if it would show exactly which AF point I have selected. It also does not tell me if I'm in selective AF mode or not - Back display Slightly laggy compared to K-30 - this is mostly noticeable when trying to change between different display modes. It can be laggy enough to sometimes confuse and irritate me. - Focus point overlay in viewfinder I really find this to be a joke. It's often very hard to notice and there have been times where I tried to really look for it, but couldn't find it because it's smaller and/or dimmer. I never had that problem with K-30 - Previews Panning while previewing is much slower than K-30. Feel's like I was used to a Ferrari and now got me a sloppy family car. Changing shooting format, image size and compression does not affect this - Too many AF points Yeah, I said it. An option to decrease the amount would have been very nice. I often need to compose fast so it's helps to get the AF in the right ball-park. That's typically center or corner points. Now, I have to click more times which takes longer and increases chances to miss shots - Ergonomics I slightly touched this but a quick round up: Thumb pad = blister on thumb Lower right corner (back side) = very sore thumb muscle Lower right corner (front side) = blister on my palm Grip just below the front dial = blister on middle finger in progress None of above would be any problem if I shot now and then, but with hours and hours of shooting, the k-3 II is seriously messing up my hand. K-30 wasn't perfect, but I've been shooting with K-30 for 2 years and had less problems - Focusing I have two K-3 II bodies: The first fails especially when trying to focus at stuff far away. This is true across several lenses The second body is better and gets closer. The AF on my K-30 bodies got worse over time for whatever reason, but I'd bet they were more accurate than these K-3 II's, when I first got them Because of this I've been relying a lot on liveview, but I simply can't keep doing that. - Lens compatibility? I'm not sure what exactly this is, but the 70-200 no longer works as it used to. When the camera introduces focus double-check, the lens goes way out of focus before going back into focus again. In practical terms it means It can take much longer to get a lock - if I use AF.C and FPS priority, then this double-check thingy gets completely out of control and is not useful at all. I have not noticed this behavior on other lenses - Soft lock-up Lens wont focus but camera appears to be functional. On/off solves the issue - Hard lock-up Camera is still on but I can't do anything. Need to replace the battery before it will function again - Mirror flapping - High ISO At higher ISO's the noise starts to look very artificial Conclusion: I need gloves and/or batterygrip and will then hopefully be fine. The focusing accuracy is a different matter and I no longer trust repairshops due to past experiences. I will none the less send it in anyways and hope they won't worsen the AF accuracy, which has happened before (K-5). Beside that, the K-3 II is a fine camera and it's mostly or only because I really work hard at weddings, that I'm having ergonomic problems. In all fairness I must add, that I've been using Sigma 18-35 which is way heavier than Sigma 17-50 that I used to use. Relax and stop gripping the body so tightly. On a cold day, if you keep licking your lips, guess what happens?