[MarkO2001]

For thirty plus years I shot 35 mm film. I made the switch to digital when I purchased the K7, then I bought the K3. I love both cameras and finally feel as comfortable shooting digital as I did with film. But a few things nag at me with digital.

1. I keep reading from experts that white balance settings do not affect RAW images, but in my experience changing the white balance settings on camera certainly affects the image in Lightroom. Granted you can easily adjust WB in LR but the original imported image will display whatever WB you have selected on camera. Am I missing something with this comment? I ask this question because I love to shoot nature shots, especially during the golden hour or slightly afterwards. I always find it a challenge to match the colors in LR with what I have seen with my eyes. So, what is the best way to preserve white balance especially with sunsets or other light where the color of the light is so critical.

2. I have my camera color space set to adobe RBG. Does this actually make any difference when shooting using a raw file format?

3. Is there any advantage to using PEF file format rather than the Adobe DNG format? I primarily use LR or Photoshop to PP my photos.

Thanks,

Mark

[johnyates]

The images you see in LR are the jpg previews created in camera and depend on your jpg settings.

I suggest you set your white balance for 'daylight' to help preserve colour casts.

[jatrax]

1) You are correct. Most people when they say it does not matter with RAW, just mean that it is easily changed so no big deal. I usually leave WB on auto and fix in post if it looks wrong, but auto has been quite accurate for me. If I am working in weird light I will use a grey card and take a couple of readings, then adjust one image in Lightroom and sync the WB to the rest.

2) I have mine the same. And no I do not believe it does. As I understand it the RAW file has all the data and a colorspace is only applied when the file is exported to TIF or JPEG or other format.

3) No. Especially if you are using Lightroom / PS. We are fortunate Pentax already provides DNG as a native format so no conversion is needed. The only reason to use PEF (IMHO) would be if you are using the Pentax supplied software. With Lightroom, don't even look back.

[johnyates]

I usually leave WB on auto

Auto white balance will tend to neutralize the the end of day colour cast the OP wishes to preserve.

[jatrax]

Auto white balance will tend to neutralize the the end of day colour cast the OP wishes to preserve.

Yes it will. Which is why I use a grey card for sunsets / sunrises or any other 'weird' light. Sorry if that was not clear from my post.

[johnyates]

Will that not tend to neutralise the colour balance as well? How do you use the grey card?

[MarkO2001]

1) You are correct. Most people when they say it does not matter with RAW, just mean that it is easily changed so no big deal. I usually leave WB on auto and fix in post if it looks wrong, but auto has been quite accurate for me. If I am working in weird light I will use a grey card and take a couple of readings, then adjust one image in Lightroom and sync the WB to the rest.

2) I have mine the same. And no I do not believe it does. As I understand it the RAW file has all the data and a colorspace is only applied when the file is exported to TIF or JPEG or other format.

3) No. Especially if you are using Lightroom / PS. We are fortunate Pentax already provides DNG as a native format so no conversion is needed. The only reason to use PEF (IMHO) would be if you are using the Pentax supplied software. With Lightroom, don't even look back.

Thanks for the nice response. Very helpful.

---------- Post added 04-19-17 at 02:50 PM ----------

Yes, what you said about the auto WB and sunset is my experience also.

---

Last edited by MarkO2001; 04-19-2017 at 03:30 PM. Reason: duplicate message in error

[jatrax]

Will that not tend to neutralise the colour balance as well? How do you use the grey card?

Grey card shot will give you an accurate color balance. Then adjust to taste for how yellow or blue you want things. I find the grey card gives me a good, accurate base from which to work. Remember to turn around and shoot the grey card reflecting the sun's light not in the direction you might be shooting. Works for me, but there are many ways to achieve the same thing.

[Adam]

There are lots of PEF vs DNG threads on the forum, the TL;DR is that you can always use DNG in favor of PEF and that the data stored is otherwise identical.

[Bruce Clark]

I find Auto WB works fine in most situations for the "average" scene. However I normally use Daylight White Balance and switch to Shade, Cloudy, or Tungsten when it is obvious that these situations exist. I shoot RAW and tweak the WB in post to correct any obvious or unpleasant colour casts.

One thing I and others on this forum have found is that a feature called "WB Adjustable Range" Menu C>2>10 in K5IIs can affect the RAW image in certain circumstances. I found it impossible to photograph a grey card and get it to appear grey with this feature on. It appeared to introduce some colour noise in RAW files. . This was a project as part of of a course I did some time ago to test the dynamic range of the camera by photographing a grey card at +/- EV to get pure black and pure white. In normal use on "average" scenes I can not detect any effect this setting has.The manual states it can affect colour balance even if a manual white balance has been set. I emailed Pentax Australia about the issue but they denied it could have any effect on RAW files. Just what the point of this feature is is quite beyond my understanding. However as a result of my experiences I have this set this to OFF in all my cameras.

Before adjusting WB in post it is vital to have your monitor calibrated.

[johnyates]

Grey card shot will give you an accurate color balance.

Yes, it will remove the colour cast from the 'weird' light you get at the end of the day.

If you want an end of day shot to retain it's unique colour characteristics, you're best off shooting with Daylight WB.

If you are shooting a product and need to show its actual colour, but are forced to shoot in 'weird' light, then using a grey card is the way to go.

[SpecialK]

I always shoot AWB, but on a few occasions it would have been much easier to PP if I had chosen a particular setting.

Most people recommend sRGB over Adobe RGB if you are shooting for web display.

PEF vs DNG discussed to death in the software thread as Adam mentioned. No real difference except the processing settings are stored in a small separate file for PEFs.

[jatrax]

If you want an end of day shot to retain it's unique colour characteristics, you're best off shooting with Daylight WB.

I think we will have to disagree on this, and we are straying from the OP's question. I have tried your method, it does not work for me as well as using a grey card. But as I already said there are many ways to do this.

[MarkO2001]

Thanks for the thoughtful comments. Very helpful and also reassuring that what I've been doing is correct.

[dms]

Using daylight setting (5500K) for sunrise/sunset will give you the warmer version--and thus (maybe)** a closer match to what you saw--but using AWB will not make any difference so long as you use the raw image and (in ACR) reset the color temperature to daylight.

Again using raw file, using Prophoto RGB will give you more headroom to blowing highlights, than sRGB, and again you set the color space when working on the image in ACR. I don't specifically note the difference--but my guess/feeling is 0.3 e.v. I don't know if it will do same as compared to Adobe RGB, but seems like it should some. The difference is (probably) academic for web use and the like (as you would reset to sRGB), but not if you print yourself.
_____
** As far as the discussion about gray card vs. AWB vs. daylight--the light we typically see at sunset is no longer black body radiation--it having much more blue removed by the atmosphere--thus getting a temperature correction (by AWB or gray card) will not make the scene look like normal day light. Thus it may be the sense of reality is somewhere between them. Anyway the color appearance was/is always subject to adjusting to what our memory/emotional response was.