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11-20-2013, 05:18 PM   #676
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QuoteOriginally posted by Parallax Quote
This thread is epic! This may go down in PF history as the mother of all threads.
It has more than 600 pages to go before it passes this thread.
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/122-lens-clubs/55946-300mm-plus-lens-club...enses-661.html

11-20-2013, 05:23 PM   #677
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QuoteOriginally posted by bossa Quote
The fact is there are two names on that camera Pentax and Ricoh. I don't care who makes what but I find that branding unconventional and as such it is blurring the ID somewhat. If you didn't know that Ricoh is the manufacturer you would not have a clue if the camera was a Pentax or a Ricoh.

One more thing: How can you have a Ricoh Pentax K-3? It's either a Ricoh K-3 or a Pentax K-3.
Personally, I haven't seen any marketing or review referring to the K-3 as anything but a "Pentax K-3". Okay, just checked, and Google had 52 million hits for "Pentax K-3", compared to 134,000 hits for "Ricoh Pentax K-3". The top results for "Ricoh Pentax K-3" were a couple blogs and a couple personal video reviews. Only 39,000 hits for "Ricoh K-3". (and 1.17 million for "cheese sandwich"!)

I do think that Ricoh's relationship to the Pentax brand is in flux, and they are feeling their way through it. We will probably see further changes. But so long as the brand name has value, they will want to use it. I never thought of my first Pentax as anything but a Pentax, because that's what was in the big black letters on the front, and that's how everyone referred to it. And yet, when I go back and look at it now, it clearly has 'Asahi' on the front and back.
11-20-2013, 05:30 PM   #678
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QuoteOriginally posted by THoog Quote
Personally, I haven't seen any marketing or review referring to the K-3 as anything but a "Pentax K-3". Okay, just checked, and Google had 52 million hits for "Pentax K-3", compared to 134,000 hits for "Ricoh Pentax K-3". The top results for "Ricoh Pentax K-3" were a couple blogs and a couple personal video reviews. Only 39,000 hits for "Ricoh K-3". (and 1.17 million for "cheese sandwich"!)

I do think that Ricoh's relationship to the Pentax brand is in flux, and they are feeling their way through it. We will probably see further changes. But so long as the brand name has value, they will want to use it. I never thought of my first Pentax as anything but a Pentax, because that's what was in the big black letters on the front, and that's how everyone referred to it. And yet, when I go back and look at it now, it clearly has 'Asahi' on the front and back.
I have no objection to Ricoh placing their name on the camera I am only questioning the meaning/intention of the way they have done it.

Asahi never made Ricoh cameras as well as Pentax AFAIK.
11-20-2013, 05:30 PM   #679
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11-20-2013, 05:34 PM   #680
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
I'd say Ricoh and Pentax are right now equivalent in rank to General Motors and Chevrolet and K3 is equivalent to Impala.
In the garage below me is a 1992 Riviera (by Buick). There is only one place on the car where you find the word "Buick". That is in very small letters under Riviera on the front grill.

So, does that "Buick" labeling make my car less a Riviera? Does it make it less excellent or less exclusive?* No, it simply states fact. My Riv was designed, created, made, and sold by Buick.

The analogy breaks down since Buick originated the Riviera brand and it has not been passed to another company. That being said, I guess the best that we can ask for is that Ricoh be a good steward of the name and continue the tradition of excellence. It would be a shame to have the Pentax name disappear entirely.


Steve

* One could argue the excellence of the car. It has a striking appearance (black and silver touring package), but frequent electrical problems and due to its "exclusive" nature parts are hard to come by.

Last edited by stevebrot; 11-20-2013 at 05:41 PM.
11-20-2013, 05:35 PM   #681
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QuoteOriginally posted by bossa Quote
*Sigh* yourself. You seriously don't "get it" but you think it is me that doesn't. Asahi Pentax were both placed on the pentaprism and you knew it was a Pentax camera made by Asahi Optical Co. Ricoh have placed the two names on the camera separately and, as I already stated, if you didn't actually know that Ricoh owned Pentax you could be forgiven for wondering why there were two separate names on that camera.

By your definition of "brand" if Pepsi owned Coca Cola it'd be fine to put both names on the can.
The ME Super for example did not have Asahi on the prism housing. It had Pentax only on there and Asahi Optical Co on the back. (Exactly the same as the branding on the K3. Pentax on the prism housing and Ricoh on the back under the LCD screen.)

The definition of branding I am using isn't 'my definition', it is 'the definition'. It is a name or feature which uniquely identifies a product. In the case of these cameras, Pentax is the main branding which uniquely identifies these cameras. Ricoh adds to this main branding by identifying the company which makes the product. It is not at all unusual for this to happen with products.

And yeah, if Pepsi bought Coca Cola they could put 'Pepsi' on the cans in addition to Coke if they felt so inclined.
11-20-2013, 05:39 PM   #682
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QuoteOriginally posted by bossa Quote
Asahi never made Ricoh cameras as well as Pentax AFAIK.
An astute observation since the two companies were competitors during most of Ricoh's history.


Steve
11-20-2013, 05:47 PM   #683
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QuoteOriginally posted by Merts Quote
The ME Super for example did not have Asahi on the prism housing.
Nor did several other Asahi-made Pentax cameras.


Steve

11-20-2013, 05:49 PM   #684
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
An astute observation since the two companies were competitors during most of Ricoh's history.
I think I was confusing in bringing up the 'Asahi' stamps on my Pentax. What I was trying to say was that the presence of the maker's name, even in a prominent location, did not affect the strength of the Pentax brand - the camera was a Pentax so far as anyone was concerned. I suspect the effect of having Ricoh on the back will be similar, but I've been wrong before.
11-20-2013, 05:49 PM   #685
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
It has more than 600 pages to go before it passes this thread.
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/122-lens-clubs/55946-300mm-plus-lens-club...enses-661.html
This is discouraging news...


Steve
11-20-2013, 05:55 PM   #686
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QuoteOriginally posted by bossa Quote
Asahi never made Ricoh cameras as well as Pentax AFAIK.
I must have missed when someone said Asahi made Ricoh cameras.
11-20-2013, 05:56 PM   #687
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
It has more than 600 pages to go before it passes this thread.
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/122-lens-clubs/55946-300mm-plus-lens-club...enses-661.html
That is a lot of cheese sandwiches!
11-20-2013, 05:58 PM   #688
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QuoteOriginally posted by Merts Quote
I must have missed when someone said Asahi made Ricoh cameras.
It's unfortunate that you cannot see the point I am trying to make. I'll give up at this point.
11-20-2013, 05:58 PM   #689
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
It has more than 600 pages to go before it passes this thread.
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/122-lens-clubs/55946-300mm-plus-lens-club...enses-661.html
True, but that thread is in a completely different class. It's useful.
11-20-2013, 05:58 PM   #690
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nesster Quote
Perhaps a small sticker for the back of the K-3 with Ricola instead or Ricoh?


Steve
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