[MarkJerling]

Sesamy Street was / is banned in our house for annoyance value. If I ever encounter Big Bird, Elmo, Bert, Ernie or any other muppet in the wild there will be petrol and matches and carnage.

[tim60]

Exactly.

I've always been fascinated by history and very old books. Back in 1970 I was a first year university student. The university library at that time was about 100 years old (not old in European terms, but getting on in age in North America) and I spent quite a bit of time doing research in this musty, old library.

I came across some rather old books, that I was frankly surprised that they were in circulation and not put away carefully in a locked reference area. One tome in particular was book that indicated on one of the first few pages, that it had been printed during the reign of Queen Anne in the year 1709 A.D.

To me that alone spiked my curiosity to go through it, and when I did, I noticed a liberal use of the letter 'F' in place of where I felt the letter 'S' should be. This was over half a century ago, so the details are a bit fuzzy and I quite probably have my letters a bit mixed up.

Other things noted were archaic spellings of words still in common use in the English language.....also words used that would be considered well out of use nowadays , so much so that these words were difficult to understand their meaning... because they have long fallen out of fashion....from a time where memory is so distant that their meaning is difficult to ascertain in these modern days.

A book that I picked up awhile and I'm currently reading, does touch on some of these issues. The Oxford History Of English, by Lynda Mugglestone.

That was the old calligraphy of S, hence the integral symbol in maths, which was an S for sum, not to be confused with the sigmoid symbol used in discrete maths.

Books older than 1800 are held in a special place in the Bodleian, you need special permission to use them. Newer books are in either open stacks or offsite stacks where you request delivery. Sometimes you ask for one that is fragile. Those are sent to a counter where you need to ask for them, not put into a shelf for self collect.

[tim60]

I was at an outdoor car show in North Dakota a few years ago and there were some Mustang 5 liters, but the show was short on Camaros. I was talking to a North Dakotan and said...geez some nice Mustangs here...but I don't see any Zed-28's.

He replied....'What ?'

I quickly realized that what we have here ...is a failure to communicate....and shifted into American and said...'Zee- 28's '. Message received.

I notice Americans expect everyone else to be flexible to understand American usage while fiercely refusing to understand others terminology, even, for example formal definitions of technical terms used in other US companies in the same industry.

[tim60]

We used to in Oz too
Until blasted Sesame Street corrupted our kids.

(Just joking - after few years of proper schooling most of them are almost convinced that their parents were right all along and the correct English pronunciation is Zed.)

Which it is.

Why would a singer call himself Jay Zed.

[mkgd1]

I notice Americans expect everyone else to be flexible to understand American usage while fiercely refusing to understand others terminology, even, for example formal definitions of technical terms used in other US companies in the same industry.

That was learned from the British Empire. British refused to learn native languages in their colonies. If a foreigner did not understand a Brit, all they had to do was speak slower and louder..

[savoche]

Savoche, you're a genius! I was declared insane by my friends when, lacking a kitchen torch, I pondered whether to caramelise Crème brûlées by turning my MSR Pocket Rocket upside down!

Hmm, but the Pocket Rocket doesn't have a pre-heater loop, does it? It might misbehave if you feed it liquid gas without a (hot) pre-heater.

Be that as it may, I'm sure your friends are right anyway

[savoche]

In Canuckistan they pronounce it "zed".

I think it's only in the US they don't.

Btw, it's zebra, not zeebra

[lesmore49]

That was the old calligraphy of S, hence the integral symbol in maths, which was an S for sum, not to be confused with the sigmoid symbol used in discrete maths.

Books older than 1800 are held in a special place in the Bodleian, you need special permission to use them. Newer books are in either open stacks or offsite stacks where you request delivery. Sometimes you ask for one that is fragile. Those are sent to a counter where you need to ask for them, not put into a shelf for self collect.

Thx for the info.

There were a couple of books in the old university library that were published in the 1700's, although 1709 was the oldest, that I found way back 50 years ago.

I believe (assumption on my part) these books had probably been donated by individuals ....sometime in the 1870 to 1900 period and had simply been put into the circulation stacks. I graduated from this U. in 1974 and haven't been back to the library since that time. The library in 1970 was still largely the old library that started in 1870. In 1971 the university built a new building to house the library and my hope is that during the transfer of books these older books were discovered and taken out of the regular circulation stacks and placed somewhere safer within the university.

[savoche]

I notice Americans expect everyone else to be flexible to understand American usage while fiercely refusing to understand others terminology, even, for example formal definitions of technical terms used in other US companies in the same industry.

I'm not so sure it's ill will. I think it's more lack of exposure. You'll see the same in Scandinavia; Swedes generally struggle more with understanding Norwegian than the other way around. This is partly due to there being twice as many Swedes, and partly because of a greater variety (or at least use of) dialects in Norway. We're simply more exposed to hearing a varied vocabulary and pronuciation - and to hearing Swedish.

It's interesting how most countries have an "official" way of speech. You rarely hear officials at a national level in Germany speak anything but Hochdeutsch. In Norway people would think it pretentious if you didn't stick to your original dialect.

[savoche]

Covering up for Bob.

[Racer X 69]

I notice Americans expect everyone else to be flexible to understand American usage while fiercely refusing to understand others terminology, even, for example formal definitions of technical terms used in other US companies in the same industry.

That was learned from the British Empire. British refused to learn native languages in their colonies. If a foreigner did not understand a Brit, all they had to do was speak slower and louder..

Yes, we learned and retained many customs from our British forefathers.

[MarkJerling]

Yes, we learned and retained many customs from our British forefathers.

[CharLac]

You're just not trying hard enough... you need to de pressurise the fuel a bit

Oh I know, but the Dragonfly, with it's second valve makes it easy. Very nice when baking corn bread...no threat of burning.

[CharLac]

Which it is.

Why would a singer call himself Jay Zed.

And what about Zed Leppelin ...oh, never mind

[CharLac]

I'm not so sure it's ill will. I think it's more lack of exposure. You'll see the same in Scandinavia; Swedes generally struggle more with understanding Norwegian than the other way around. This is partly due to there being twice as many Swedes, and partly because of a greater variety (or at least use of) dialects in Norway. We're simply more exposed to hearing a varied vocabulary and pronuciation - and to hearing Swedish.

It's interesting how most countries have an "official" way of speech. You rarely hear officials at a national level in Germany speak anything but Hochdeutsch. In Norway people would think it pretentious if you didn't stick to your original dialect.

I have now seen, more than once, folks from the American South speaking English on a news broadcast or a documentary with english subtitles. And for the most part, those subtitles are required!