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10-29-2013, 04:25 AM   #196
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QuoteOriginally posted by Bolt Quote
I will definitely be putting my K3 up against my 1D X when I get it.
Why, does it keep falling over ?

10-29-2013, 04:26 AM   #197
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QuoteOriginally posted by awaldram Quote
Why, does it keep falling over ?
It does actually. Which is the most annoying thing about the full size body other than the fact it weighs as much as a small horse.
10-29-2013, 04:50 AM   #198
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QuoteOriginally posted by Bolt Quote
I will definitely be putting my K3 up against my 1D X when I get it.
2 members of my local photographic society have 1D X. I will be competing with them next year using my K-3.

I would love to see a comparison between those cameras!
10-29-2013, 05:38 AM   #199
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QuoteOriginally posted by Bolt Quote
I will definitely be putting my K3 up against my 1D X when I get it.
Test them both in low-light pls.

The -3 EV sensitivity of the K-3 in both exposure metering and AF betters the specs of the 1Dx, so it would be interesting to get a feel for the real-world impact of that.

10-29-2013, 06:41 AM   #200
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I had Tess take a look at bossa's photos, because they aren't labelled. We still are of the opinion both camera are in the same ballpark, and that the differences we observe in noise are pretty much a saw off and not noticeable in either comparison from a normal viewing distance.

Look at the card package in the second image because here is the crux of the difference between APS-c and FF from my perspective,perfectly illustrated. The words "Rider" are razor sharp even pixel peaking in the K-3 image. And out of focus on the D600. By the time you get to the word "Whitman's" the images are comparable. As are the images of the pen and behind the Pen. To me, that little extra DoF makes the K-3 image acceptable, and though the FF guys may argue that fuzzy lettering on the D600 image is artistic, to me it's just an inferior image. Unfortunately the back end of the DoF is not visible in either image, so it's not possible to tell if that's a focus issue or a format issue.

SO as I said, we see it as a saw off, and given the supposed superiority of FF over APS-c a saw off is actually a victory. K-3 all the way. SIx months from now when the K-3 is selling for $900 there will be a $600 price advantage to the K-3 , and based on these images, no discernible loss of IQ.

But I suspect, people will continue to buy D600's because of the FF advantage.
If these picture show anything it's that the FF advantage is a myth.
10-29-2013, 06:44 AM   #201
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
If these picture show anything it's that the FF advantage is a myth.
Sigh. If you say so, it must be true.
10-29-2013, 06:47 AM   #202
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QuoteOriginally posted by awaldram Quote
This means Penatax has more bits to play with and a better SNR before the data has even left the sensor.
I know the K-3 is going to be a well-received camera, because it got you to break your self-imposed boycott of this forum to come over here and talk about it. I thought you didn't like the folks here?
10-29-2013, 06:47 AM   #203
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QuoteOriginally posted by jsherman999 Quote
Sigh. If you say so.
I supplied a critique in favour of my position based on posted comparison images, and that's your response? I didn't just "say so", I provided a detailed analysis in support of my opinion. What have you provided? A back handed insult? Sad but typical.

10-29-2013, 06:51 AM   #204
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QuoteOriginally posted by jsherman999 Quote
Sigh. If you say so, it must be true.
+1
10-29-2013, 06:54 AM   #205
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QuoteOriginally posted by bossa Quote
+1
My god, a +1 for what amounts to a factless personal attack.. is that the state of the FF proponent world these days?... You guys are sinking to new lows.

Any chance of a discussion of details in the images you think would lead to different conclusions than mine?

Last edited by normhead; 10-29-2013 at 07:06 AM.
10-29-2013, 07:13 AM   #206
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Tunnel Vision

QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
My god, a +1 for what amounts to a personal attack.. is that the state of the FF proponent world these days?...
Calm down, Norm, it's just equipment.

You gave a subjective 'meh' based on a few images and a very limited use-case that doesn't involve low-light shooting in which the DR difference above base ISO can come into play, the chroma noise can be an issue, banding could appear, and luminance noise can become much more apparent. You didn't take into account the greater DOF control, the smoother tonalities that can sometimes be seen (even the best aps-c shots look 'crunchy' to me a lot of the time, more 'digital', especially when printed large,) and the requirement for aps-c lenses to be more sharp to be able to get the same acuity (physics, natch.) You're judging this all on a few images that have been 'smoothed' before the bits were even written to card, something I and a lot of others wish Pentax didn't do. And that's just the IQ, we still don't know how well a K-3 will do tracking a toddler through a dimly lit room, accurately, for example, or shooting a soccer game at dusk. Things like that can be very important to a lot of buyers.

I've said for a couple years now that for your uses - mosty, landcsape, well-lit static subjects - FF in general has less of an advantage. (FF with high MP (36+) would.) You have a hard time looking beyond your personal use case.

.

Last edited by jsherman999; 10-29-2013 at 07:22 AM.
10-29-2013, 07:15 AM   #207
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Ricoh is now featuring the article on Facebook

Name:  Screen Shot 2013-10-29 at 10.14.24 AM.png
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10-29-2013, 07:39 AM   #208
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QuoteOriginally posted by bossa Quote
I'm sure that the K-3 will be a much better photographic experience than the D600 anyway, and for a number of reasons,
That is also my impression. I still think that if I want a full frame, I'm best to buy the D800.
10-29-2013, 07:46 AM   #209
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QuoteOriginally posted by jsherman999 Quote
I know the K-3 is going to be a well-received camera, because it got you to break your self-imposed boycott of this forum to come over here and talk about it. I thought you didn't like the folks here?
Nah the opposite is true, why argue with folks you like

Didn't realize it was a self imposed boycott , hate to see what happens if I post in pentaxuser.co.uk
10-29-2013, 07:49 AM   #210
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QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
Ricoh is now featuring the article on Facebook

Attachment 193008
Good on em, looks like after many years they've realized facts and fiction makes no odds in the internet.
Its which group shouts loudest becomes the 'truth'
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