K3 manual - What is Ricoh thinking?

**monochrome** · 01-02-2014, 06:49 PM

At last someone here has agreed with my observation of several pages back.

Good, I'm glad you claimed it. I couldn't find the post to quote you. But all manuals are this way now.

Thingo · 01-03-2014, 09:13 AM

Yes, I've read the K-3 manual cover to cover. I've managed to nut out most of the relevant points -- well, the ones with which I played around.

But what's happening with the focus setting AF.A ? When does it choose .S or .C ? If there's some camera movement relative to the subject as focus is attempted, then it seems to veer towards AF.C. But then focus is often missed, anyway. Am I missing some fundamental point?

It would be good to have some idea of the differences between the two anti-aliasing sensor movement settings.

I did accidentally find that it is possible to have a RAW file produced from a HDR capture. That's interesting.

Certainly a capable camera. But perhaps doomed to have many features never used, except by accident.

Jan67 · 01-03-2014, 09:25 AM

Pentax should create white paper, application list or whatever name of document, covering new features, mainly AF.
K3 is their 1000usd flag ship and they are not able to describe its functionality in detail.
There are such documents from other vendors.
The only reason for that is, that current firmware did not reached expected level of functionality yet.

I write this as moreless happy user of K3.

**monochrome** · 01-03-2014, 09:40 AM

Pentax has donea few White Papers in the past - most notoably I think on WR.

vonBaloney · 01-03-2014, 11:08 AM

It is ok for the manual to be mainly technical, it can't be 800 pages long, and I find some of this criticism a bit over the top. (When you buy a car, does the manual teach you to drive and tell you what to do in each situation?) But they should have supplementary material, videos, etc especially showing off the newer features and pointing out useful ways of doing things that might not be obvious. Part of this is just the curse of small market share -- with any Canon or Nikon product there is plenty of third-party stuff supporting it even if the manufacturer doesn't explain everything. With Pentax, we get one third-party e-book and this forum. (Any of you, feel free to create some more material.)

Unregistered User · 01-03-2014, 03:38 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by vonBaloney

It is ok for the manual to be mainly technical, it can't be 800 pages long, and I find some of this criticism a bit over the top. (When you buy a car, does the manual teach you to drive and tell you what to do in each situation?) But they should have supplementary material, videos, etc especially showing off the newer features and pointing out useful ways of doing things that might not be obvious. Part of this is just the curse of small market share -- with any Canon or Nikon product there is plenty of third-party stuff supporting it even if the manufacturer doesn't explain everything. With Pentax, we get one third-party e-book and this forum. (Any of you, feel free to create some more material.)

In the past the Pentax manual was all you needed to understand your new photographic tool. With this manual you may need to call someone, e-mail someone or use the forum to, maybe, get the correct answer for how a function is supposed to work. I have the Sony RX100 and that manual really is the worst shit ever concuted. It is full of features and the manual tells you how to turn on or off a function but does not explain any of them.

I hate my smartphone because there is no manual and there is a ton off functionality in this small super computer but I find them out as time passes by and this should not be an issue. If I buy a car the manual has to tell me how to turn on or off the parking break but it does not have to tell me what a parking break is because that I should know because I have a drivers license. But the anti spin, for instance, has to be explained in more detail when and how it is supposed to work so that I know if it is working as it should.

With the K-3 I find functions not mentioned in the manual. For instance: When you are making a Multi exposure with self timer it does not tell you that if you first choose 2 seconds self timer this will be used here as well or the 12 s if that is choosen. Knowing that this feature is not in the manual makes me wonder everytime if there is some other way to configure some other feature.

Also the translation to Swedish in both the menu and in the manual is a real embarrassment. Did they use Google translate?

Apart from that, this camera is a real keeper.

tim60 · 01-03-2014, 08:42 PM

The only feature of my car I am not happy with is the manual.

Examples: one day I wanted to be sure what grade of petrol to use (92, 95 or 98 unleaded). The manual had all kinds of general information about the petrol in general and lots of "Auchtung!" notices - but I could not find a straight forward statement what kind of petrol to put in my car, with which the manual shipped.

Same thing with changing a wheel (for a puncture). It could have used less pages AND been helpful to give me a picture which clearly indicated the support point.

And for tyre pressure - it did not tell me what pressure to use, nor give a straight forward direction to look inside the fuel filler flap for the table. But it did tell me all manner of horrid consequences for wrong pressures - along with plenty of "Auchtung!" notices.

BTW: the car is very nice to drive, so good I would replace it with another of the then current model.

**monochrome** · 01-04-2014, 03:51 AM

There was more "How To" information in a 32 page 70's KX manual than in any 200 page modern manual. And the old ones included D0F tables.

vonBaloney · 01-04-2014, 10:34 AM

Is the K-3 manual worse than the K5, K-01, Q? (Those are the most recent ones I have.) They all seem about the same...

**monochrome** · 01-04-2014, 10:46 AM

Originally posted by vonBaloney

Is the K-3 manual worse than the K5, K-01, Q? (Those are the most recent ones I have.) They all seem about the same...

It is physically smaller and printed 1/2 page, i.e. it is reduced so there are two pages of text fro every (smaller) printed page. The result is it is about 65% smaller than the K-01 manual.

rfg · 01-06-2014, 11:46 PM

Originally posted by vonBaloney

Is the K-3 manual worse than the K5, K-01, Q? (Those are the most recent ones I have.) They all seem about the same...

I'd say so: I upgraded from a k-r and the k-3 manual has less detail than the k-r book for a significantly more advanced camera. I downloaded the k-5II manual and I find it a very useful addition for many settings.

konquerian · 01-07-2014, 03:13 PM

I just received my K-3 yesterday. Naturally, I got out the manual to check out some of the functions and setting options of camera. Needless to say, I was disappointed in the lack of details on a lot of the options and info on how to setup those options. I am glad that I brought the detailed PDF manual that one of the site members recommended me.

01-03-2014, 09:13 AM	#77
Thingo Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: UFTG, Oz Photos: Gallery Posts: 77	Focus? Yes, I've read the K-3 manual cover to cover. I've managed to nut out most of the relevant points -- well, the ones with which I played around. But what's happening with the focus setting AF.A ? When does it choose .S or .C ? If there's some camera movement relative to the subject as focus is attempted, then it seems to veer towards AF.C. But then focus is often missed, anyway. Am I missing some fundamental point? It would be good to have some idea of the differences between the two anti-aliasing sensor movement settings. I did accidentally find that it is possible to have a RAW file produced from a HDR capture. That's interesting. Certainly a capable camera. But perhaps doomed to have many features never used, except by accident.

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01-02-2014, 06:49 PM	#76
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	At last someone here has agreed with my observation of several pages back. Good, I'm glad you claimed it. I couldn't find the post to quote you. But all manuals are this way now.

01-03-2014, 09:25 AM	#78
Jan67 Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Prague Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 84	Pentax should create white paper, application list or whatever name of document, covering new features, mainly AF. K3 is their 1000usd flag ship and they are not able to describe its functionality in detail. There are such documents from other vendors. The only reason for that is, that current firmware did not reached expected level of functionality yet. I write this as moreless happy user of K3.

01-03-2014, 09:40 AM	#79
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Pentax has donea few White Papers in the past - most notoably I think on WR.

01-03-2014, 11:08 AM	#80
vonBaloney Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 6,029	It is ok for the manual to be mainly technical, it can't be 800 pages long, and I find some of this criticism a bit over the top. (When you buy a car, does the manual teach you to drive and tell you what to do in each situation?) But they should have supplementary material, videos, etc especially showing off the newer features and pointing out useful ways of doing things that might not be obvious. Part of this is just the curse of small market share -- with any Canon or Nikon product there is plenty of third-party stuff supporting it even if the manufacturer doesn't explain everything. With Pentax, we get one third-party e-book and this forum. (Any of you, feel free to create some more material.)

01-03-2014, 03:38 PM - 1 Like	#81
Unregistered User Guest	Originally posted by vonBaloney It is ok for the manual to be mainly technical, it can't be 800 pages long, and I find some of this criticism a bit over the top. (When you buy a car, does the manual teach you to drive and tell you what to do in each situation?) But they should have supplementary material, videos, etc especially showing off the newer features and pointing out useful ways of doing things that might not be obvious. Part of this is just the curse of small market share -- with any Canon or Nikon product there is plenty of third-party stuff supporting it even if the manufacturer doesn't explain everything. With Pentax, we get one third-party e-book and this forum. (Any of you, feel free to create some more material.) In the past the Pentax manual was all you needed to understand your new photographic tool. With this manual you may need to call someone, e-mail someone or use the forum to, maybe, get the correct answer for how a function is supposed to work. I have the Sony RX100 and that manual really is the worst shit ever concuted. It is full of features and the manual tells you how to turn on or off a function but does not explain any of them. I hate my smartphone because there is no manual and there is a ton off functionality in this small super computer but I find them out as time passes by and this should not be an issue. If I buy a car the manual has to tell me how to turn on or off the parking break but it does not have to tell me what a parking break is because that I should know because I have a drivers license. But the anti spin, for instance, has to be explained in more detail when and how it is supposed to work so that I know if it is working as it should. With the K-3 I find functions not mentioned in the manual. For instance: When you are making a Multi exposure with self timer it does not tell you that if you first choose 2 seconds self timer this will be used here as well or the 12 s if that is choosen. Knowing that this feature is not in the manual makes me wonder everytime if there is some other way to configure some other feature. Also the translation to Swedish in both the menu and in the manual is a real embarrassment. Did they use Google translate? Apart from that, this camera is a real keeper.

01-03-2014, 08:42 PM	#82
tim60 Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2011 Photos: Albums Posts: 8,755	The only feature of my car I am not happy with is the manual. Examples: one day I wanted to be sure what grade of petrol to use (92, 95 or 98 unleaded). The manual had all kinds of general information about the petrol in general and lots of "Auchtung!" notices - but I could not find a straight forward statement what kind of petrol to put in my car, with which the manual shipped. Same thing with changing a wheel (for a puncture). It could have used less pages AND been helpful to give me a picture which clearly indicated the support point. And for tyre pressure - it did not tell me what pressure to use, nor give a straight forward direction to look inside the fuel filler flap for the table. But it did tell me all manner of horrid consequences for wrong pressures - along with plenty of "Auchtung!" notices. BTW: the car is very nice to drive, so good I would replace it with another of the then current model.

01-04-2014, 03:51 AM	#83
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	There was more "How To" information in a 32 page 70's KX manual than in any 200 page modern manual. And the old ones included D0F tables.

01-04-2014, 10:34 AM	#84
vonBaloney Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 6,029	Is the K-3 manual worse than the K5, K-01, Q? (Those are the most recent ones I have.) They all seem about the same...

01-04-2014, 10:46 AM	#85
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Originally posted by vonBaloney Is the K-3 manual worse than the K5, K-01, Q? (Those are the most recent ones I have.) They all seem about the same... It is physically smaller and printed 1/2 page, i.e. it is reduced so there are two pages of text fro every (smaller) printed page. The result is it is about 65% smaller than the K-01 manual.

01-06-2014, 11:46 PM	#86
rfg Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Sydney Posts: 139	Originally posted by vonBaloney Is the K-3 manual worse than the K5, K-01, Q? (Those are the most recent ones I have.) They all seem about the same... I'd say so: I upgraded from a k-r and the k-3 manual has less detail than the k-r book for a significantly more advanced camera. I downloaded the k-5II manual and I find it a very useful addition for many settings.

01-07-2014, 03:13 PM	#87
konquerian Inactive Account Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: California, USA Posts: 18	I just received my K-3 yesterday. Naturally, I got out the manual to check out some of the functions and setting options of camera. Needless to say, I was disappointed in the lack of details on a lot of the options and info on how to setup those options. I am glad that I brought the detailed PDF manual that one of the site members recommended me.