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11-15-2013, 10:29 AM   #1
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NR response

Has anyone tried to compare some of the NR programs with the k3 yet? I ordered a k5iis the other day, because I felt for my style it would be good enough, and I could buy some new glass too. I don't know if I'll send the k5iis back (unopened if I do) and get a k3 or not, but TD does a great job with my k7 up to ISO3200. I realize there are still a lot of unanswered questions and experiments to be done, but as we've seen before, there may be some surprises. Good ones I mean, like TD, or NN or LR etc may be matched nicely to help eliminate the characteristics of noise the k3 is exhibiting.

Also, I'm wondering if there is a way to take two quick bracket shots with the AA on then off to maybe mix the two into a type of composite like HDR, in camera to suppress some of the moire' if it's even a real problem. Pentax has some great ideas, I bet they could make that work.

11-15-2013, 10:51 AM   #2
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I think there were comparison shots of the AA functions in the Pentax forums K-3 review (on main page). The shots are encouraging. You can turn AA function off, normal and strong. And its results are comparable to K-5 and K-5IIs. If you shoot jpeg, the camera also has an in-camera digital moire removal tool, which is supposedly pretty good, too. And if you shoot raw, many post processing software allows moire reduction.

Here is the chapter on AA and moire:
https://www.pentaxforums.com/reviews/pentax-k-3-review/moire.html
Look at the rest of the review, too, its pretty thorough.

Oh, and the bracketing with AA and without is a good idea, some have already mentioned it, but I dont think there is that type of function in the K-3. You have to take a photo, go into menu, change setting, take another photo.

Last edited by Na Horuk; 11-15-2013 at 10:56 AM.
11-29-2013, 07:16 AM   #3
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Thanks Na Horuk, I'll check them out.
With all the angst about the noise in the k3 I'm surprised I haven't seen more NR analysis. Shooting high school sports and indoor mostly with my k7 I'm very happy with what Topaz is able to do for me.

Bill
11-29-2013, 07:43 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by Snydly Quote
the angst about the noise in the k3
It's pretty empty angst. Forums are usually full of worry-worts.

Having shot for a few days with the K-3 now, I'm not seeing anything to worry about, or indeed, anything much different from the K-5, noise wise, even at 6400 ISO. I'm even quite impressed by the how adequately the built-in K-3 JPEG noise reduction works.

11-29-2013, 08:59 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
It's pretty empty angst. Forums are usually full of worry-worts.

Having shot for a few days with the K-3 now, I'm not seeing anything to worry about, or indeed, anything much different from the K-5, noise wise, even at 6400 ISO. I'm even quite impressed by the how adequately the built-in K-3 JPEG noise reduction works.
I'll second this. I'm in the dark month, where I'm at the edge of the capabilities of what I'm shooting. I find the K3 noise pretty similar to the K5. It is different noise, different characteristics, but I've had terribly noisy shots with my K5. Not much different.
11-29-2013, 09:36 PM   #6
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I've been using DeNoise for any noise I notice, and it has had no trouble dealing with it.
11-30-2013, 08:06 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by Snydly Quote
Has anyone tried to compare some of the NR programs with the k3 yet? I ordered a k5iis the other day, because I felt for my style it would be good enough, and I could buy some new glass too. I don't know if I'll send the k5iis back (unopened if I do) and get a k3 or not, but TD does a great job with my k7 up to ISO3200. I realize there are still a lot of unanswered questions and experiments to be done, but as we've seen before, there may be some surprises. Good ones I mean, like TD, or NN or LR etc may be matched nicely to help eliminate the characteristics of noise the k3 is exhibiting.

Also, I'm wondering if there is a way to take two quick bracket shots with the AA on then off to maybe mix the two into a type of composite like HDR, in camera to suppress some of the moire' if it's even a real problem. Pentax has some great ideas, I bet they could make that work.
As for NR... if you can bracket, you can try Oloneo. It works awesome at reducing noise if you can give it a couple of shots at high ISO. It also creates HDRs if you want to, lets you take photos of a scene with different lights on and lets you switch them on and off at free will (just watch their demo), etc. I'm really quite impressed by that software.


To be honest though I rarely ever worry about noise... all I do to denoise is use Lightroom, and I don't mind shooting 51200 with my K-5.
11-30-2013, 09:09 AM   #8
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Higher MP on the same sized sensor can mean higher noise, true. But the technology is also improving. The 24MP sensor is much newer than the 16MP sensor. This means it probably has better high-ISO performance. So the higher pixel density/noise probably gets cancelled out by "new tech." The main drawback of the K-3 is that it doesn't allow ISO 80 - something the K-5 (almost miraculously) did. I am not aware of any current DSLR that allows ISO lower than 100, so the K-3 is no slouch, its just that the K-5 was so out of the ordinary. I really doubt the K-3 would have problems with noise, especially if you consider all the modern noise reduction software and plugins.

11-30-2013, 06:38 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by kadajawi Quote
As for NR... if you can bracket, you can try Oloneo. It works awesome at reducing noise if you can give it a couple of shots at high ISO. It also creates HDRs if you want to, lets you take photos of a scene with different lights on and lets you switch them on and off at free will (just watch their demo), etc. I'm really quite impressed by that software.


To be honest though I rarely ever worry about noise... all I do to denoise is use Lightroom, and I don't mind shooting 51200 with my K-5.
Never heard of Oloneo. Is it a plug in or stand alone?

Are you saying it will combine 2 high ISO shots and cancel similar noise?

I'll do a search, thanks,

Bill
11-30-2013, 09:27 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Snydly Quote
Never heard of Oloneo. Is it a plug in or stand alone?

Are you saying it will combine 2 high ISO shots and cancel similar noise?

I'll do a search, thanks,

Bill
Oloneo is a company that produces HDR software that does more than just HDRs (though the 32 bit file creation works much better than Photoshop or Photomatix, both of which create artifacts). It IS a bit costly if you don't make use of everything, so so far I have only played with the trial, but that has impressed me quite a bit. It will combine 2 or more high ISO shots and remove the noise. There should be as much overlap as possible, so if possible shoot stabilized or at least do a burst trying to hold the camera in the same position. I've tried it at 51200 on a tripod (yeah, I know, stupid, might as well expose longer) and it works great. Not sure how well it would work handheld.


I have tried it stand alone, not sure if there is a plug-in version (they do have a Lightroom plug-in).
12-01-2013, 02:17 AM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by kadajawi Quote
It works awesome at reducing noise if you can give it a couple of shots at high ISO.
How does a tool like Oloneo compare with setting the K-3's Drive Mode to Multiple Exposure: 'Average or 'Additive' and firing off a burst?
12-01-2013, 04:55 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
How does a tool like Oloneo compare with setting the K-3's Drive Mode to Multiple Exposure: 'Average or 'Additive' and firing off a burst?
rawr I know that question isn't for me, but does the k3 have those mode selections available in camera, e.g. the in-cam RAW processor, or are you talking post processing?
12-01-2013, 10:21 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by Snydly Quote
does the k3 have those mode selections available in camera
Yes. 'Multiple Exposure' is one of the K-3 'Drive Mode' settings, next to the 'Continuous Shooting', 'Self Timer', 'Mirror Lockup', 'Interval Shooting' etc modes.

'Multiple Exposure' mode has three options: 'Average', 'Additive' or 'Bright'. I haven't played with them yet, but they seem to have the potential of working like the Sony NEX/Cybershot in-camera 'Handheld Twilight' or 'Anti-Motion Blur' modes.
12-01-2013, 12:08 PM   #14
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I see that some users find the noise no worse than on the K-5. The question I have is whether the noise is worse than on the K-5iis.
12-01-2013, 12:22 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by sholtzma Quote
The question I have is whether the noise is worse than on the K-5iis.
I can't see much reason why there would be any difference between k-5 vs K-5 IIs noise performance, at the sensor level, in RAW or in the JPEG output.
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