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05-19-2014, 06:38 PM - 1 Like   #241
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QuoteOriginally posted by yorik Quote
This thread gives people who have experienced a problem like this a resource - information, suggestions etc. This thread is also collecting data on a fairly large number of episodes which, as I understand it, will be collected and forwarded to Ricoh via one of their representatives to help them figure out how to fix it. Anybody who has experienced this problem can also return it to the store from which it came, and at least some have. But it does no harm to also submit their data to a collective pool.

If you don't like the point of the thread, why do you keep coming back? I don't think that anyone submitting their data here needs to be scolded by you. Surely there is public house somewhere in Hampshire at whose denizens you can rail.

Full disclosure - I only come back to this thread because of the you and the other `scolders'. I don't have a K3. (And there is no decent public house where I live )
BTW, I have no idea who you were addressing with this response, but regardless:

So, you coming back and responding for your own reasons is ok, but it is not ok for others to come back and post for their own reasons? Really? Did you really just write that? You do realize how silly that sounds, don't you?

BTW, I own a K3, so at least I have a stake in this discussion as I have spent my hard-earned money on the product being discussed rather than those who just pontificate about problems with a product they do not own and have zero experience with, good or bad.

Thanks for posting, though as posts like this just make my point even more clear.

Nothing in this thread is going to help anyone fix whatever is wrong with these cameras. How many cameras have been fixed using all of the "resources" and "information" in this thread? Zero, nada, zip, zilch. How many cameras have been fixed by returning it for warranty repair? One that we know of in this thread.

So the score is:

Internet forum posts fixed my mirror flop: 0

Returning the camera for warranty repair fixed my mirror flop: 1

Yes, this problem popping up yet again on the K3 isn't encouraging and is frustrating for those that have had it happen, I am sure. However, the best way to get this problem fixed is for cameras to be returned under warranty, or returned for credit if they have this problem. That way Pentax gets back actual cameras that exhibit the problem so they can troubleshoot the issue and find the root cause and eliminate it. Returned cameras also cost money to fix or replace, and such costs have far greater impact than anything posted here.

Ray

05-19-2014, 08:28 PM   #242
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The post you quoted was directed at Awaldram (the reference to Hampshire was a clue), and yes I was aware of the double-standard implicit in my post - hence the emoticon at the end.

In any case, it is time for me to respect the wishes of the OP, and stop posting in this thread, as I have no information about the problem to contribute. Might I suggest that you do the same?
05-19-2014, 09:04 PM   #243
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I came back over here to see if there had been a fix by Ricoh, and was astounded that there is no fix to date and no official acknowledgement that a problem even exists. More astounding was the downplaying of the problem by some, as if it is not anything serious.

I was at a graduation on Friday evening and a guy a few rows over was shooting with a Pentax, which in itself was a little surprising...you don't see too many Pentax cameras out in the wild. Anyhow, he exited during one of those long speeches and I followed him to the main floor. He had a new K3 and it was the first one I have actually seen "in the real". Very nice camera, better than what you can tell in the photos of them by far. He loved it and had a couple of stellar lenses he was using to shoot a relative that was graduating too. During the course of the conversation he did bring up a few glitches he had found and most were minor...but then he mentioned the "whizzing" he had encountered a few times. Yes, it was what we are calling the flapping, and he was unaware that others have had this problem. He is not on any forums, so I pointed him here and was thinking I might see him show up as a new poster...he may still. He clearly saw this as a deal killer and planned to return the camera on Monday for a new one and go from there.

There may be many more like him out there, not all Pentax shooters are on this forum, or any forum. More the reason that this needs to be addressed quickly. He also mentioned that the shop he bought the K3 at tried to steer him toward a Nikon, but he had owned a Kx and was very happy with it. He may end up with a Nikon yet...but I sort of doubt it, he was very impressed with the K3 IQ and handling, but the "whizzing" greatly disturbed him.

I urge those here that genuinely care about the Pentax brand to stop making excuses and citing this as some minor glitch. Send your camera back for a new one or to be repaired, what's in this thread matters little to Ricoh, after all it hasn't cost hem a dime so far...except for one guy that did the right thing and sent his back.

Regards!
05-20-2014, 12:16 AM   #244
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Hmm. This has happened to me once now, after using live view. I did not record the settings - will if it happens again.

I had my K-5 repaired for mirror flip, and for the lens-release-button-dropoff-problem too. But - in both cases it meant being without a camera for three to four weeks!

I broke my K-5 this easter, dropping it from the pram onto the tarmac, and I had to wait a few weeks before having a K-3 to replace it. The insurance supposedly covers my accident, but I haven't seen the insurance money yet...

At the moment there is no way I am returning it. Maybe when I get a used K-5ii as a backup. After all it only happened once, it might be firmware fixable, and I always have my two year warranty to fall back on if the problem gets worse.

05-20-2014, 08:08 PM   #245
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QuoteOriginally posted by yorik Quote
The post you quoted was directed at Awaldram (the reference to Hampshire was a clue), and yes I was aware of the double-standard implicit in my post - hence the emoticon at the end.

In any case, it is time for me to respect the wishes of the OP, and stop posting in this thread, as I have no information about the problem to contribute. Might I suggest that you do the same?
Yet you could not help but respond, and now respond again, but now it is time for you to respect the OPs wishes. Why now?

Suggest anything you want, but note that the OP could not even follow her own wishes. Not even close. She was far too enamored of the attention, it seems to me, so why should anyone else do as she asked?

Ray
05-21-2014, 07:52 AM   #246
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Update:

Just to let you all know, I am still keeping track of reports that are posted here and updating the original post, I'm just not interested in getting into arguments with people who want to minimize the issue or somehow vilify me, so I won't reply to them.

I did hear from my contact on Ricoh USA this morning. The exact response was: "We have not received any information from Ricoh Imaging in Japan regarding the mirror-flop issue. I will let you know when we do."

I know that fcrespo posted earlier in the thread that his K3 had been fixed under warranty. Though his ticket didn't specifically address the mirror-flapping, a lot of parts were replaced. It would be interesting to test his camera and put it through it's paces to see if it is really fixed. At least according to Ricoh USA, there is no direct answer to the problem (yet), if there will ever be one publicly.

And let me address their warranty service directly. I know some people have suggested I should have had my camera fixed. I had my first one replaced and that had the problem too. I was also not advised to send it in for repair since they didn't know what was causing the issue. And lets not even mention that their repair service, at least in the USA is notoriously slow as slugs. I actually had a lens replacement approved in March for the dreaded SDM failure... a well known issue... and sent my broken one to them on 3/24. This is for a replacement, which should be much easier than fixing. I still don't have a new lens back yet. So you can see why some people might be hesitant to send a new camera in to be fixed, for fear of being without it for weeks or even months, such as was the case for fcrespo.

That's it for now. All along I have encouraged everyone to contact Ricoh directly even just to report their problem. I've posted this link before, but here it is again. I suggest everyone who has had the problem use the form to report the issue and include in the notes a link back to this thread, to back up your experience with other users who have had similar experiences.
Ricoh Imaging Support

To date, I still have not had one issue with either of the K5-IIs bodies I bought. They have performed exactly as expected, and flawlessly... the way the K3 should have performed. For all of those who think I caused the problem, or that it's "normal" or that I was outside the normal specs of the camera -- regardless of all the other reports from other people -- well, it seems the K5-II and K5-IIs can handle it all just fine.

Last edited by DRabbit; 05-21-2014 at 08:06 AM.
05-21-2014, 09:07 AM   #247
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A more impressive thread and one that might get more response from Ricoh would be one that lists the K3 owners that returned their K3 for a new one, a refund, or sent it in for repairs. Ricoh is apparently not responsive to "talk" but like all corporations, they are all ears when they start losing money.

Read this article and note the lack of communication by camera makers, it is apparent that Ricoh is one of the offenders...although not alone.
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/76-non-pentax-cameras-canon-nikon-etc/262...ml#post2821738

Money talks. Complaining in a thread does little, and I recall when Hoya stated they never even monitored camera forums for feedback......looks like Ricoh might not either?

I don't have a K3 but I am invested in Pentax and have an interest in their future, as well as in the hope that current K3 users get the camera they deserve for their not so small investment. We seem to have no problem defending a faulty product here...by a few...but what about defending our own friends and their interest? Send in those cameras, demand a repair of replacement that works as specified.
If a few dozen cameras start showing up for repair or replacement, a response will be rapid, you can count on it. Fuji tried a firmware fix on the X10, that didn't satisfy the "blob" problem...and quickly made a recall on all X10s and replaced the sensors. That was no small or inexpensive task, since I would venture to guess there were more X10s sold than there are K3s...but they did it to survive the bad publicity, and it worked. Should Ricoh be expected to do less, or to just remain silent?

Regards!
05-21-2014, 09:29 AM   #248
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QuoteQuote:
I know that fcrespo posted earlier in the thread that his K3 had been fixed under warranty. Though his ticket didn't specifically address the mirror-flapping, a lot of parts were replaced. It would be interesting to test his camera and put it through it's paces to see if it is really fixed. At least according to Ricoh USA, there is no direct answer to the problem (yet), if there will ever be one publicly.
Thanks for your post, DRabbit, it is informative.

I have news. I returned the K3 back again after 24 hours. The in-camera flash did not work. When opening the flash lid, the camera just would not take pictures. During repair they replaced the flash circuit, so maybe this is related. The guys of www.photo-univers.fr this time answered nicely "send us the camera and we will change it". So now I am waiting for a new K3, hopefully.

05-21-2014, 09:58 AM   #249
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QuoteOriginally posted by DRabbit Quote
Update:

That's it for now. All along I have encouraged everyone to contact Ricoh directly even just to report their problem. I've posted this link before, but here it is again. I suggest everyone who has had the problem use the form to report the issue and include in the notes a link back to this thread, to back up your experience with other users who have had similar experiences.
Ricoh Imaging Support

.
This is the best suggestion I've heard so far. I had not thought to do this, but am grateful for the link, and I just now used it. I suggest all K-3 owners who have had this problem use this link, report the problem, and thereby flood Ricoh with complaints from pissed-off owners. They need to wake up and do something.

John
05-21-2014, 11:49 AM   #250
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rupert Quote
A more impressive thread and one that might get more response from Ricoh would be one that lists the K3 owners that returned their K3 for a new one, a refund, or sent it in for repairs. Ricoh is apparently not responsive to "talk" but like all corporations, they are all ears when they start losing money.

Read this article and note the lack of communication by camera makers, it is apparent that Ricoh is one of the offenders...although not alone.
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/76-non-pentax-cameras-canon-nikon-etc/262...ml#post2821738

Money talks. Complaining in a thread does little, and I recall when Hoya stated they never even monitored camera forums for feedback......looks like Ricoh might not either?

I don't have a K3 but I am invested in Pentax and have an interest in their future, as well as in the hope that current K3 users get the camera they deserve for their not so small investment. We seem to have no problem defending a faulty product here...by a few...but what about defending our own friends and their interest? Send in those cameras, demand a repair of replacement that works as specified.
If a few dozen cameras start showing up for repair or replacement, a response will be rapid, you can count on it. Fuji tried a firmware fix on the X10, that didn't satisfy the "blob" problem...and quickly made a recall on all X10s and replaced the sensors. That was no small or inexpensive task, since I would venture to guess there were more X10s sold than there are K3s...but they did it to survive the bad publicity, and it worked. Should Ricoh be expected to do less, or to just remain silent?

Regards!
I've suggested people report to Ricoh directly in addition to here. This thread has been sent to several people at Ricoh (by me and others), and from what I was told, Japan is also aware it exists. I also suggested in the original thread that people post a review on Amazon about the problem, if they feel inclined to do so. When it hurts their sales, that is when they will do something. I've done everything I can reasonably do to draw attention to the issue and all the reports from others about this issue. I'm nearly 100% confident Ricoh is quite aware of this problem and the talk that is going on about it.

I'm not about bashing Pentax here, just getting the issue addressed and solved. I'm still a Pentax owner!


QuoteOriginally posted by fcrespo Quote
Thanks for your post, DRabbit, it is informative.

I have news. I returned the K3 back again after 24 hours. The in-camera flash did not work. When opening the flash lid, the camera just would not take pictures. During repair they replaced the flash circuit, so maybe this is related. The guys of www.photo-univers.fr this time answered nicely "send us the camera and we will change it". So now I am waiting for a new K3, hopefully.
Sorry to hear it -- that is quite unfortunate. I can imagine your frustration quite well. Hopefully you will get a new K3 soon and it won't have issues.


QuoteOriginally posted by PALADIN85020 Quote
This is the best suggestion I've heard so far. I had not thought to do this, but am grateful for the link, and I just now used it. I suggest all K-3 owners who have had this problem use this link, report the problem, and thereby flood Ricoh with complaints from pissed-off owners. They need to wake up and do something.
Agreed John. I had suggested it in an earlier update, and I've used the form myself several times to send a copy of this link and ask for updates, in addition to the specialist I've been dealing with at Ricoh USA directly.

Last edited by DRabbit; 05-21-2014 at 11:56 AM.
05-21-2014, 12:32 PM   #251
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QuoteOriginally posted by DRabbit Quote
That's it for now. All along I have encouraged everyone to contact Ricoh directly even just to report their problem. I've posted this link before, but here it is again. I suggest everyone who has had the problem use the form to report the issue and include in the notes a link back to this thread, to back up your experience with other users who have had similar experiences.
Ricoh Imaging Support
The link is for Ricoh Imaging Americas, so it would just be for cameras that were sold through that distributor, not through Pentax Canada, Australia, UK, Japan, etc.
05-21-2014, 12:52 PM - 1 Like   #252
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QuoteOriginally posted by audiobomber Quote
The link is for Ricoh Imaging Americas, so it would just be for cameras that were sold through that distributor, not through Pentax Canada, Australia, UK, Japan, etc.
At last! Some constructive criticism.
05-22-2014, 04:51 AM - 2 Likes   #253
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For those of you that live somewhere other than USA and lack google.

Support | RICOH IMAGING
05-22-2014, 05:40 AM   #254
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Reply from Ricoh. At least they acknowledge it, but I wish they would have indicated they would follow up with me:

QuoteQuote:
Dear Bruce,

Thank you for contacting RICOH.

We have had a few customer reports of a possible issue with their K-3s. Occasionally, when shooting in either single-frame or time-lapse mode, the camera mirror will start moving rapidly up and down separate from the shutter opening and closing. Turning off the camera does not stop the "mirror flop" and the only way to restore the camera to normal operation is to turn off the camera, remove the battery, then put the battery back in and turn the camera back on. This issue can occur with a fully or partially-charged battery and with/without a battery grip attached.

A summary of these reports have already been submitted to RICOH in Japan for review and evaluation. Thank you for providing the details about the camera settings and shooting conditions when this happened with your camera. I will forward this information to our product manager in the corporate office.

This issue is currently being tested and reviewed, with a goal of identifying a possible cause and developing a solution.

If you are in need of further assistance, please respond to this email or call our technical support center at 800-877-0155.

Sincerely,
Randall S.
RICOH IMAGING AMERICAS CORPORATION
PHONE: 800.234.0276 / 800.877.0155
05-22-2014, 06:34 AM   #255
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QuoteOriginally posted by fcrespo Quote
Thanks for your post, DRabbit, it is informative.

I have news. I returned the K3 back again after 24 hours. The in-camera flash did not work. When opening the flash lid, the camera just would not take pictures. During repair they replaced the flash circuit, so maybe this is related. The guys of www.photo-univers.fr this time answered nicely "send us the camera and we will change it". So now I am waiting for a new K3, hopefully.
I am sorry to hear that the repair was so badly done. Hopefully you will have better luck with your new K3.

I guess we will never know if they managed to solve the flop issue or not.

As someone who has managed electronics manufacturing operations for 30+ years, including RMAs and field return/repair, I will never understand how a completely non-functioning item leaves the repair facility. It is possible that something went astray in shipping it, but these cameras get shipped all the time, so if the repair is done right and then tested fully, it should work properly after shipping. Of course, I have never worked where we relied on 3rd parties to perform the repairs either. We do them ourselves and have all of the company resources available (Technicians, Engineering, tools, fixtures, etc...) that would also be involved in the design and build of the product.

Good luck.

Ray
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