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09-05-2014, 12:51 AM   #31
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When I looked thru a K3 it seemed that the viewfinder image was a lot bigger than the K5. Is this true? If so that would be a great reason to buy K3 over K5. Also the fact you can turn AA filter on or off seems much better.
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barondla (considering a K3 after Photokina).

09-05-2014, 01:28 AM   #32
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I recently bought a K-3 as a smaller/lighter alternative to the Leica S reflex, and both can use Pentax lenses from my stash. I'm glad to have the K-3, it's working out very well.
09-05-2014, 03:37 AM   #33
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I now recall where the 12.3 EV number I had in mind came from; not the A/D converter but system total RAW dynamic range at base ISO. There are various results for the K5 but it's somewhere around that number. I shoot only in RAW and so this is an important parameter to me.


So this morning, I looked at some results for K5 II, K5 IIs and K3, and I don't see any significant advantage for the K3, however all three appear better than the K5. So I'm glad I started this thread and that my mistaken perception that the K3 would offer a significant advantage over the KII/KIIs in terms of dynamic range was corrected. In my decision process, then, this leaves me asking whether going to a new sensor with 50% more pixels/sq mm is worth the $400 increment in price, especially for the hobbyist applications I use it for.


At this point, I'm inclined to send it back today, unopened, and buy a K5 IIs instead. Again, I want to particularly thank those here who helped straighten out my mistake.
09-05-2014, 04:16 AM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by chicagojohn Quote
I now recall where the 12.3 EV number I had in mind came from; not the A/D converter but system total RAW dynamic range at base ISO. There are various results for the K5 but it's somewhere around that number. I shoot only in RAW and so this is an important parameter to me.


So this morning, I looked at some results for K5 II, K5 IIs and K3, and I don't see any significant advantage for the K3, however all three appear better than the K5. So I'm glad I started this thread and that my mistaken perception that the K3 would offer a significant advantage over the KII/KIIs in terms of dynamic range was corrected. In my decision process, then, this leaves me asking whether going to a new sensor with 50% more pixels/sq mm is worth the $400 increment in price, especially for the hobbyist applications I use it for.


At this point, I'm inclined to send it back today, unopened, and buy a K5 IIs instead. Again, I want to particularly thank those here who helped straighten out my mistake.
As someone who has jumped from the K5ii to the K3, very recently. I would make the following observations that make me want to stick with the K3.


* Faster drive mode. Very useful for bracketing.
* Less PP with wonderful AWB direct out of the camera
* Colors are wonderful from both cameras, just more of them (pixels) on the K3
* Focus peaking (great for landscapes)
* Large Screen (useful for composition)
* Remote editing of files (deleting) with FluCard (faster and easier workflow)
* The grip is good and free with the current special deal
* More user modes for presetting your favorite applications without having to think about it


Here are my first unedited pictures with the machine.


https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/172-pentax-k-3/241198-k3-sample-shots-pos...ml#post2931051


I am sure I will find many more reasons, the K5ii is also a great camera.


Mike

09-05-2014, 04:47 AM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by mikeodial Quote
As someone who has jumped from the K5ii to the K3, very recently. I would make the following observations that make me want to stick with the K3.


* Faster drive mode. Very useful for bracketing.
* Less PP with wonderful AWB direct out of the camera
* Colors are wonderful from both cameras, just more of them (pixels) on the K3
* Focus peaking (great for landscapes)
* Large Screen (useful for composition)
* Remote editing of files (deleting) with FluCard (faster and easier workflow)
* The grip is good and free with the current special deal
* More user modes for presetting your favorite applications without having to think about it


Here are my first unedited pictures with the machine.


https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/172-pentax-k-3/241198-k3-sample-shots-pos...ml#post2931051


I am sure I will find many more reasons, the K5ii is also a great camera.


Mike


The feature differences you cite are certainly significant. Since the grip offer at B&H applies to both the iis and the 3, the difference in price is essentially $400. RAW dynamic range at low ISO is rated a little higher for the iis at 14.1 versus 13.4 for the K3, a small difference in exponents but a 62% improvement for the iis over the 3. So if you shoot in RAW and are a simple hobbyist like me, does your experience with both systems lead you to feel the price difference is justified for you (realizing you can't answer that question for someone else.) Let me know as I still have some time to decide. Coming from a K5, I think either would be an improvement.
09-05-2014, 05:11 AM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by chicagojohn Quote
The feature differences you cite are certainly significant. Since the grip offer at B&H applies to both the iis and the 3, the difference in price is essentially $400. RAW dynamic range at low ISO is rated a little higher for the iis at 14.1 versus 13.4 for the K3, a small difference in exponents but a 62% improvement for the iis over the 3. So if you shoot in RAW and are a simple hobbyist like me, does your experience with both systems lead you to feel the price difference is justified for you (realizing you can't answer that question for someone else.) Let me know as I still have some time to decide. Coming from a K5, I think either would be an improvement.
Yes it was, and is. While there is nothing wrong with any of the other cameras, its more of a matter if you can tell the difference and whether it will make you want to take either more pictures, or better pictures. For me the answer is both. Or at least I will die trying!


While the technical comparison is important at some level, these specs are features, which turn into tools for us as photographers. There are more tools there in the K3. I think I will produce pics that need less post processing, at least that's my gut feel, and that's important as you can spend more time on planning and creating images in the field.
09-05-2014, 05:15 AM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by mikeodial Quote
Yes it was, and is. While there is nothing wrong with any of the other cameras, its more of a matter if you can tell the difference and whether it will make you want to take either more pictures, or better pictures. For me the answer is both. Or at least I will die trying!


While the technical comparison is important at some level, these specs are features, which turn into tools for us as photographers. There are more tools there in the K3. I think I will produce pics that need less post processing, at least that's my gut feel, and that's important as you can spend more time on planning and creating images in the field.


Excellent points, Mike. Thanks so much for sharing your perspective.
09-05-2014, 05:36 AM   #38
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From a few minutes ago...maybe not as much DR as a k-5 but still very good.... I used the widest selective focus point and it's focussed on the vehicle....try that with a K-5, 640 ISO and still good DR



09-05-2014, 05:55 AM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
... I used the widest selective focus point and it's focussed on the vehicle....try that with a K-5, 640 ISO and still good DR
K-3 is all about the AF. Everything else is gravy.
09-05-2014, 06:15 AM   #40
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More and smaller AF points. Faster AF. Faster saving to memory cards. Better predictive AF. Best low light AF. All benefits to K3

Personally, slow saving of files is one of the most annoying things of the K5 classic. This also isn't fixed by going to a K5 ii.
09-05-2014, 06:27 AM   #41
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Though I think the OP is trying to determine for himself whether the particular mix of feature upgrades for the K-3 are wortth $400 to him.
09-05-2014, 06:35 AM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Though I think the OP is trying to determine for himself whether the particular mix of feature upgrades for the K-3 are wortth $400 to him.
Ya, but he asked us.... and we are known for going on about these things.... it's not like we're an unknown quantity around here... The OP is lucky we aren't talking more about cheese, beer and bacon.

When my tax return comes, $400 will not be a lot of money... right now it's a fortune. All we can do is tell him what we think when we read his question. Whether that actually has anything to do with his question is a matter of blind luck.
09-05-2014, 07:24 AM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
K-3 is all about the AF. Everything else is gravy.


Yes. Many more autofocus points for the K3. And the value of this, of course, is also use dependent. I do a lot of studio product photography and macro work both using manual focus with a Katz Eye. In a lot of what I do in nature photography, I find myself using center point autofocus along with manual. I can imagine scenarios where multi-point AF is very beneficial; e.g., if I were doing wedding or event photography. But even there, I would opt for the maximum dynamic range at lower ISO's to facilitate exposure adjustment in ACR. I love gravy, and cheese too, and especially cheesy gravy, but when I'm eating out, I don't expect to pay a lot more for it as a percentage of the cost of the meal


I think that for the kind of photography I like to do, two things are of most importance; maximum RAW DR at low ISO and secondarily the absence of an AA filter for maximum intrinsic sharpness. The significantly lower DR of the K3 is therefore a negative for me v. the K5 IIs. The K3 allows the option of simulated AA through sensor microvibration without an inherent AA filter, making that point even for both.


I've discovered the advantage of participating in this very knowledgeable forum before, and all of the comments have validity within one context or another. While there is, of course, no "one-size-fits-all" answer, I do believe that for each photographer there probably is a best answer. I have now made a decision in favor of the K5 IIs largely based upon the DR numbers reported from controlled tests. While I'm sure that I wouldn't be able to distinguish between 13.4EV and 14.1EV in routine day-to-day use, I do believe in numbers and objective data, and therefore, over the long run, I think I will be better off.


In the mean time, I wish you all success with your photography whichever camera model you use. I am still using my K100D Super frequently for NIR. Thanks to everyone for helping me decide what's best for me (and saving me from a purchase I might have regretted later after finding out the facts, again for me and my unique situation). Take care and thanks again!
09-05-2014, 08:18 AM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by chicagojohn Quote
Yes. Many more autofocus points for the K3. And the value of this, of course, is also use dependent. I do a lot of studio product photography and macro work both using manual focus with a Katz Eye. In a lot of what I do in nature photography, I find myself using center point autofocus along with manual. I can imagine scenarios where multi-point AF is very beneficial; e.g., if I were doing wedding or event photography. But even there, I would opt for the maximum dynamic range at lower ISO's to facilitate exposure adjustment in ACR. I love gravy, and cheese too, and especially cheesy gravy, but when I'm eating out, I don't expect to pay a lot more for it as a percentage of the cost of the meal


I think that for the kind of photography I like to do, two things are of most importance; maximum RAW DR at low ISO and secondarily the absence of an AA filter for maximum intrinsic sharpness. The significantly lower DR of the K3 is therefore a negative for me v. the K5 IIs. The K3 allows the option of simulated AA through sensor microvibration without an inherent AA filter, making that point even for both.


I've discovered the advantage of participating in this very knowledgeable forum before, and all of the comments have validity within one context or another. While there is, of course, no "one-size-fits-all" answer, I do believe that for each photographer there probably is a best answer. I have now made a decision in favor of the K5 IIs largely based upon the DR numbers reported from controlled tests. While I'm sure that I wouldn't be able to distinguish between 13.4EV and 14.1EV in routine day-to-day use, I do believe in numbers and objective data, and therefore, over the long run, I think I will be better off.


In the mean time, I wish you all success with your photography whichever camera model you use. I am still using my K100D Super frequently for NIR. Thanks to everyone for helping me decide what's best for me (and saving me from a purchase I might have regretted later after finding out the facts, again for me and my unique situation). Take care and thanks again!
@ChicagoJohn, thank you for starting this thread, I am in a similar situation except that I already have both k-5 and k-5IIs, thinking about replacing my k-5 with the k-3 after Photokina and perhaps next time I visit Japan.
09-05-2014, 09:17 AM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by aleonx3 Quote
@ChicagoJohn, thank you for starting this thread, I am in a similar situation except that I already have both k-5 and k-5IIs, thinking about replacing my k-5 with the k-3 after Photokina and perhaps next time I visit Japan.


You're welcome. And let me just add one last thing, and that is, as Mike pointed out, we should not discount the value of simply having something new, from time to time, to rekindle our desire to learn, explore, and take more pictures in that process. This factor is something I think we all recognize, yet one that's hard to put a value on. I know it was a significant part of my motivation in deciding to get a new Pentax model at this time.
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