Which shutter speed do you use with 24MPix K-3 body?

Prakticant · 02-25-2015, 03:02 PM

Which shutter speed do you set for a given focal length, free-handshots with SR on (no tripod, no monopod, etc.), no flash, for the 24 MPix pictures not to be blurry?

**jrpower10** · 02-25-2015, 03:13 PM

1/(2xfocal length) when I have enough light and iso isn't getting too high (i.e. 1/200th for a 100mm lens). 1/focal length gets me good results too, but not consistently. If I'm very carefull I can get away with slower, particularly with wider lenses. For instance, I've managed good results with the 31 limited shooting as slow as 1/15th, but not consistently good.

stevebrot · 02-25-2015, 03:38 PM

I shoot mainly at focal lengths below 70mm and generally shoot at 1/30s or faster. That being said, I have gone as slow as 1/8s with acceptable results. Here is an example shot at 28mm and 1/13s, SR on, hand-held with no props.

Edit: I thought a full-resolution excerpt from the above image might be interesting...

Now, having shown you what is possible in my hands, I might suggest that you explore this yourself. Asking this question makes for fairly predictable discussion, since there are conventions for this sort of thing, but actually practicing the slow speed shot will yield dividends for your shooting in general. After all, you do own a K-3 and the electrons to learn and experiment with are fairly inexpensive. Do your best and post your findings on this forum!

Steve

CNunez · 02-25-2015, 04:45 PM

Tbh, I shoot at whatever speed I can stabilise at that given time. Sometimes I'm in my Zen, and I can shoot incredibly slow. I must admit though, it's a completely different ball game with the k3.

CarlG · 02-25-2015, 04:49 PM

I like to use P in sports mode as my baseline, unless I am trying to attain something special.

Sandy Hancock · 02-25-2015, 04:58 PM - **1 Like**

I don't understand the problem. Blurriness is only going to be greater at pixel-peeping levels, *because* the pixels are smaller and more closely packed.

At normal print sizes or screen resolutions the sensor resolution has no effect.

1/6 sec, 161 mm, K-3, handheld.

Na Horuk · 02-25-2015, 05:03 PM

I agree with the first reply, that is generally what I do with my cameras - but they are 16MP! Still, 2*focal length should be enough
Anyway, two more points:
1) SR takes a bit to turn on. You can see a little icon that lights up when SR is activated. If you press the shutter before that, it won't be used. So in low light, with SR enabled, make sure you give the SR enough time to activate it.
2) Stance is very important. How you hold your camera, how you stand, etc. Pentax Forums had a good post about this a while ago: Making the Most of Long Exposure Handhelds - Introduction - In-Depth Articles
Maybe not all of those stances are needed for everyday stuff, but it is an interesting read. how you press the shutter button, how you hold the camera can help you use a longer shutter without a blur penalty

**WPRESTO** · 02-25-2015, 08:42 PM - **1 Like**

For hand-holding @ slower shutter speeds, old advice: take two quick deep breaths; take a third, exhale half then hold your breath; steady and shoot before your face turns purple.

**clackers** · 02-25-2015, 08:59 PM

I don't like to let it drop below 1/60s, Prakticant, but things happen. Got away with this at 1/5s.

Prakticant · 02-26-2015, 12:27 AM

Why my question?
When shooting manual (in Jurrasic Park times) I was going down to 1/30 s (at least I was pretending to) with 50mm prime.
So with my digital body I calculated 'longer than focal lenght', i.e. 1/60 for 50mm.
I was not succesfull with the sharpness (some other threads), so went to 'more than 2x focal lenght', i.e. 1/125 for 50mm.
Yesterday I got a book of Benno Hessler 'Pentax K-3 Das Buch zur Kamera' (ISBN 978-3-941761-43-8), where the author writes (page 177):

Focal lenght - Shutter:

16/18mm - 1/100
28mm - 1/200
35mm - 1/250
50mm - 1/320
75mm - 1/500
100mm - 1/750
135mm - 1/1000
200mm - 1/1500
300mm - 1/2000

- (which means 6-7x focal lenght as his choice). He explains the above with very high pixel density of 24 MPix APS-C sensor influencing the possible blurr and the need of short shutter times.

Actually, what he says in his book sounds right to me.

-----

Originally posted by clackers

I don't like to let it drop below 1/60s, Prakticant, but things happen.

Sandy Hancock · 02-26-2015, 01:51 AM

Well that's just laughable. Did people spout the same nonsense when shooting PanF vs HP5?

r0ckstarr · 02-26-2015, 02:03 AM

At 300mm, I can use 1/80 hand held with sharp results.

Finchj · 02-26-2015, 02:28 AM - **2 Likes**

I use whatever I can get away with. I guess I'm not too serious about studying my gear as the jump from 14 mp on my K-7 to the 24 on the K-3 has never occurred to me as being an issue with sharpness, or lack thereof.

If my images aren't sharp, I usually chalk it up to a few things:

1) Too much coffee making my hands shaky as all get out
2) Poor posture/camera holding technique (IE, being lazy, out with other people and not concentrating, etc)
3) Subject is moving too fast for my chosen shutter speed

As soon as I fix those things, my images sharpen up. Of course, the only thing I can do about the coffee is wait

Also, purchasing a grip was the best thing I did for my handheld shots. I primarily shoot with the DA*50-135. Coupled with the K-3+DBG-5, I couldn't ask for better ergonomics.

I guess I'm simply not convinced that the number of pixels on the sensor has more to do with an image being inadequately sharp than technique and appropriate shutter speed for the subject.

**WPRESTO** · 02-26-2015, 04:45 AM

Two other comments V-A-V longer shutter speeds and blur-degraded images.
1) a very successful non-pro photographer in my local club (MANY, MANY salon competition awards) states as a basic assumption: camera motion is the single greatest cause of unsatisfactory images.
2) a comment in a photo-magazine decades ago that still sticks in my mind: tripods are the most useful and valuable camera accessory that we all love to hate.

Even a relatively flimsy monopod can significantly reduce camera motion degradation of IQ at longer shutter speeds.

r0ckstarr · 02-26-2015, 05:01 AM

Originally posted by Finchj

Also, purchasing a grip was the best thing I did for my handheld shots.

I agree with that. When I got my K3, the grip was included with it. Up until then, I had never understood the full reason for a grip, and thought it was just for an extra battery and portrait orientation. I figured I could could just carry another battery in my bag and do without one. I had my grip listed for sale here. After a week with no interest in it, I decided that I would put it on the camera and try it out. It helped balance out the camera, especially with larger lenses. Quickly, I pulled my listing and decided to keep the grip. Whatever I replace the K3 with in a few years will also have a grip.

02-25-2015, 03:02 PM	#1
Prakticant Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 274	Which shutter speed do you use with 24MPix K-3 body? Which shutter speed do you set for a given focal length, free-handshots with SR on (no tripod, no monopod, etc.), no flash, for the 24 MPix pictures not to be blurry?

02-25-2015, 03:38 PM	#3
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	I shoot mainly at focal lengths below 70mm and generally shoot at 1/30s or faster. That being said, I have gone as slow as 1/8s with acceptable results. Here is an example shot at 28mm and 1/13s, SR on, hand-held with no props. Edit: I thought a full-resolution excerpt from the above image might be interesting... Now, having shown you what is possible in my hands, I might suggest that you explore this yourself. Asking this question makes for fairly predictable discussion, since there are conventions for this sort of thing, but actually practicing the slow speed shot will yield dividends for your shooting in general. After all, you do own a K-3 and the electrons to learn and experiment with are fairly inexpensive. Do your best and post your findings on this forum! Steve Last edited by stevebrot; 02-25-2015 at 04:16 PM.

02-25-2015, 04:58 PM - 1 Like	#6
Sandy Hancock Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Adelaide Hills, South Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,275	I don't understand the problem. Blurriness is only going to be greater at pixel-peeping levels, because the pixels are smaller and more closely packed. At normal print sizes or screen resolutions the sensor resolution has no effect. 1/6 sec, 161 mm, K-3, handheld. Last edited by Sandy Hancock; 02-25-2015 at 05:43 PM.

02-26-2015, 12:27 AM	#10
Prakticant Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 274 Original Poster	Why my question? When shooting manual (in Jurrasic Park times) I was going down to 1/30 s (at least I was pretending to) with 50mm prime. So with my digital body I calculated 'longer than focal lenght', i.e. 1/60 for 50mm. I was not succesfull with the sharpness (some other threads), so went to 'more than 2x focal lenght', i.e. 1/125 for 50mm. Yesterday I got a book of Benno Hessler 'Pentax K-3 Das Buch zur Kamera' (ISBN 978-3-941761-43-8), where the author writes (page 177): Focal lenght - Shutter: 16/18mm - 1/100 28mm - 1/200 35mm - 1/250 50mm - 1/320 75mm - 1/500 100mm - 1/750 135mm - 1/1000 200mm - 1/1500 300mm - 1/2000 - (which means 6-7x focal lenght as his choice). He explains the above with very high pixel density of 24 MPix APS-C sensor influencing the possible blurr and the need of short shutter times. Actually, what he says in his book sounds right to me. ----- Originally posted by clackers I don't like to let it drop below 1/60s, Prakticant, but things happen. Last edited by Prakticant; 02-26-2015 at 05:07 AM.

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02-25-2015, 03:13 PM	#2
jrpower10 Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Richland, Washington, USA Posts: 935	1/(2xfocal length) when I have enough light and iso isn't getting too high (i.e. 1/200th for a 100mm lens). 1/focal length gets me good results too, but not consistently. If I'm very carefull I can get away with slower, particularly with wider lenses. For instance, I've managed good results with the 31 limited shooting as slow as 1/15th, but not consistently good.

02-25-2015, 04:45 PM	#4
CNunez Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Photos: Gallery Posts: 168	Tbh, I shoot at whatever speed I can stabilise at that given time. Sometimes I'm in my Zen, and I can shoot incredibly slow. I must admit though, it's a completely different ball game with the k3.

02-25-2015, 04:49 PM	#5
CarlG Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 417	I like to use P in sports mode as my baseline, unless I am trying to attain something special.

02-25-2015, 05:03 PM	#7
Na Horuk Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Slovenia, probably Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,186	I agree with the first reply, that is generally what I do with my cameras - but they are 16MP! Still, 2*focal length should be enough Anyway, two more points: 1) SR takes a bit to turn on. You can see a little icon that lights up when SR is activated. If you press the shutter before that, it won't be used. So in low light, with SR enabled, make sure you give the SR enough time to activate it. 2) Stance is very important. How you hold your camera, how you stand, etc. Pentax Forums had a good post about this a while ago: Making the Most of Long Exposure Handhelds - Introduction - In-Depth Articles Maybe not all of those stances are needed for everyday stuff, but it is an interesting read. how you press the shutter button, how you hold the camera can help you use a longer shutter without a blur penalty

02-25-2015, 08:42 PM - 1 Like	#8
WPRESTO Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Massachusetts Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 59,138	For hand-holding @ slower shutter speeds, old advice: take two quick deep breaths; take a third, exhale half then hold your breath; steady and shoot before your face turns purple.

02-25-2015, 08:59 PM	#9
clackers Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Melbourne Photos: Albums Posts: 16,397	I don't like to let it drop below 1/60s, Prakticant, but things happen. Got away with this at 1/5s.

02-26-2015, 01:51 AM	#11
Sandy Hancock Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Adelaide Hills, South Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,275	Well that's just laughable. Did people spout the same nonsense when shooting PanF vs HP5?

02-26-2015, 02:03 AM	#12
r0ckstarr Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,507	At 300mm, I can use 1/80 hand held with sharp results.

02-26-2015, 02:28 AM - 2 Likes	#13
Finchj Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Espoo Photos: Albums Posts: 142	I use whatever I can get away with. I guess I'm not too serious about studying my gear as the jump from 14 mp on my K-7 to the 24 on the K-3 has never occurred to me as being an issue with sharpness, or lack thereof. If my images aren't sharp, I usually chalk it up to a few things: 1) Too much coffee making my hands shaky as all get out 2) Poor posture/camera holding technique (IE, being lazy, out with other people and not concentrating, etc) 3) Subject is moving too fast for my chosen shutter speed As soon as I fix those things, my images sharpen up. Of course, the only thing I can do about the coffee is wait Also, purchasing a grip was the best thing I did for my handheld shots. I primarily shoot with the DA*50-135. Coupled with the K-3+DBG-5, I couldn't ask for better ergonomics. I guess I'm simply not convinced that the number of pixels on the sensor has more to do with an image being inadequately sharp than technique and appropriate shutter speed for the subject.

02-26-2015, 04:45 AM	#14
WPRESTO Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Massachusetts Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 59,138	Two other comments V-A-V longer shutter speeds and blur-degraded images. 1) a very successful non-pro photographer in my local club (MANY, MANY salon competition awards) states as a basic assumption: camera motion is the single greatest cause of unsatisfactory images. 2) a comment in a photo-magazine decades ago that still sticks in my mind: tripods are the most useful and valuable camera accessory that we all love to hate. Even a relatively flimsy monopod can significantly reduce camera motion degradation of IQ at longer shutter speeds.

02-26-2015, 05:01 AM	#15
r0ckstarr Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,507	Originally posted by Finchj Also, purchasing a grip was the best thing I did for my handheld shots. I agree with that. When I got my K3, the grip was included with it. Up until then, I had never understood the full reason for a grip, and thought it was just for an extra battery and portrait orientation. I figured I could could just carry another battery in my bag and do without one. I had my grip listed for sale here. After a week with no interest in it, I decided that I would put it on the camera and try it out. It helped balance out the camera, especially with larger lenses. Quickly, I pulled my listing and decided to keep the grip. Whatever I replace the K3 with in a few years will also have a grip.