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02-01-2016, 01:55 PM   #31
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I found this diagram at a Imaging Resource page about Pentax K-x:



I don't know how trustworthy it is all the time it doesn't show rotational correction, though. Unless that was added for newer bodies.

02-01-2016, 02:06 PM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
There used to be a detailed diagram out there somewhere, but I was unable to find it.
I was able to find a diagram for the A7II. Pentax does not support the blue-color motions.




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02-01-2016, 02:09 PM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by savoche Quote
it doesn't show rotational correction, though. Unless that was added for newer bodies.
I could be wrong in regards to rotational. With any luck perhaps Adam or another member with deep SR expertise (falconeye?) will weigh in.

Edit: The Imaging Resource K-5 review states that Pentax will correct X, Y, and rotational...

http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/K5/K5A.HTM


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02-01-2016, 02:17 PM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
I could be wrong in regards to rotational. With any luck perhaps Adam or another member with deep SR expertise (falconeye?) will weigh in.

Edit: The Imaging Resource K-5 review states that Pentax will correct X, Y, and rotational...

Pentax K-5 Review: Full Review


Steve

Makes sense. Might be one reason the O-GPS isn't supported by earlier models.

02-01-2016, 02:37 PM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Well, if it does not correct for lateral (side-to-side), then it would be pretty lame. There used to be a detailed diagram out there somewhere, but I was unable to find it.

Steve
Not really, the lateral movement has normally a very small impact on the blur in the image, unless you are shooting macro or something very close.

If I aim at a mountain far away (to make it extreme) and shifts the camera perfectly sideways 5mm to the left, then that means that the mountain will also shift 5mm, but since the mountain is far away that will not be visible in the frame.

But if I rotate the camera sideways, the entire frame will immediately change. That's why the SR reacts to rotation and not lateral movement.

---------- Post added 02-01-2016 at 10:41 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
I was able to find a diagram for the A7II. Pentax does not support the blue-color motions.




Steve
No, it does not support the orange motion of the camera. It does however correct the blue motions by shifting the sensor in the orange directions.
02-01-2016, 08:21 PM - 1 Like   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gimbal Quote
No, it does not support the orange motion of the camera. It does however correct the blue motions by shifting the sensor in the orange directions.
That is some creative thinking. I will offer these suggestions and then bug out:
  • Pentax SR is limited to movements at the sensor plane and supports X and Y axis correction in addition to rotation
  • Related to above: SR does not tilt the sensor away from the lens axis
  • Repeat for emphasis: SR does not tilt the sensor. Doing so would shift focus during exposure...not a good idea
  • The composition adjustment feature (when supported) is an expression of movement in X and Y directions
  • Horizon correction (when supported) is an expression of the rotation feature
  • There is no movement in the Z axis as would be required for pitch or yaw correction
  • On systems that do support pitch and yaw correction (Sony and Olympus), that aspect is done using in-lens optical stabilization.
All of the above are documented in various reviews. You many also confirm by using M-mode, shutter on "B" with no lens mounted. Press the shutter button and see what motions are compensated for. Prepare to be both alarmed an amazed.


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02-01-2016, 08:26 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gimbal Quote
That's why the SR reacts to rotation and not lateral movement.
Only the X, Y vectors.


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02-02-2016, 02:12 AM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
That is some creative thinking. I will offer these suggestions and then bug out:
  • Pentax SR is limited to movements at the sensor plane and supports X and Y axis correction in addition to rotation
  • Related to above: SR does not tilt the sensor away from the lens axis
  • Repeat for emphasis: SR does not tilt the sensor. Doing so would shift focus during exposure...not a good idea
  • The composition adjustment feature (when supported) is an expression of movement in X and Y directions
  • Horizon correction (when supported) is an expression of the rotation feature
  • There is no movement in the Z axis as would be required for pitch or yaw correction
  • On systems that do support pitch and yaw correction (Sony and Olympus), that aspect is done using in-lens optical stabilization.
All of the above are documented in various reviews. You many also confirm by using M-mode, shutter on "B" with no lens mounted. Press the shutter button and see what motions are compensated for. Prepare to be both alarmed an amazed.


Steve
I know, that is why I wrote ĒIt does however correct the blue motions by shifting the sensor in the orange directions.Ē

So when you turn your camera left/right, like the blue arrows show, the SR compensates this motion by shifting the sensor laterally in the X direction, illustrated by the orange arrows.

I too suggest you take a look at the sensor by using M-mode and so on, except donít use Bulb mode as that will disable SR, enter instead a large shutter time like 10sec or so. Enter a large focal length and test turning left/right, notice the large movement of the sensor.

Then move the camera laterally against a ruler so you donít accidently turn it, notice that there is no movement of the sensor.

Summery, twist and turn the camera results in large sensor movement. Lateral movement of the camera results in no movement of the sensor.

02-02-2016, 06:49 AM   #39
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A couple of days ago, I experienced a weird shake reduction glitch. I was shooting from on-board the ferry and the ferry was vibrating. At some point shake reduction system started to vibrate as well. I was using a 70-210 A series lens at 210.
02-02-2016, 01:47 PM   #40
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SR works pretty good on K-3
Handheld
EXIF on Flikr


---------- Post added 02-02-16 at 02:51 PM ----------

This is one I did as a test with the K-5 I was walking at a steady pace when this picture was taken
02-02-2016, 02:20 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gimbal Quote
It does however correct the blue motions by shifting the sensor in the orange directions.
You are correct that the inertial sensors* will detect the X/Y components of pitch change if the apex is other than the focal plane. The effectiveness depends on how far the apex is from the focal plane with full correction only being possible as the apex approaches either positive or negative infinity. The situation is similar for yaw. Translation? For all practical purposes SR performance for those two classes of motion is poor to non-existent.

In normal shooting, pitch would be of greater concern than yaw unless you are shooting from something like a pitching boat or have been drinking.

Over all the Pentax SR system is quite effective though it is good to know its weak points.


Steve

* The key is to realize that the system does not detect and correct actual image displacement. It detects inertial changes within set of constrained axes. That is why it cannot fully correct for pitch and yaw.

Last edited by stevebrot; 02-02-2016 at 02:26 PM.
02-06-2016, 09:12 AM   #42
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I love Pentax SR...it is amazingly effective for my use. However, I have read that Oly has the best system for stabilization....is there anyone here familiar with Oly SR that could give us some information ?

Regards!
02-06-2016, 11:06 AM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rupert Quote
I love Pentax SR...it is amazingly effective for my use. However, I have read that Oly has the best system for stabilization....is there anyone here familiar with Oly SR that could give us some information ?
that might be true for micro 4/3rd's mount but when it comes to aps-c and ff systems sony have 5 axis stabilization in some camera's (but stabilization doesn't work with adapted and/or vintage lens)

also mirror-less camera's do not have to deal with mirror slap although shutter shock is still a problem (the vibration of the first curtain snapping open)
02-06-2016, 11:15 AM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ratcheteer Quote
that might be true for micro 4/3rd's mount but when it comes to aps-c and ff systems sony have 5 axis stabilization in some camera's (but stabilization doesn't work with adapted and/or vintage lens)

also mirror-less camera's do not have to deal with mirror slap although shutter shock is still a problem (the vibration of the first curtain snapping open)
Hmmmm...I wasn't considering the differences in the camera systems...and I should have, but am not a fast thinker on Sat mornings....or any other mornings...according to Otis.

Regards! & Thanks for the info!
02-07-2016, 02:50 AM   #45
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Both Olympus and Sony uses the same type of voice coil motors and general idea for the shake reduction system as Pentax does, and if they don't have to pay licensing fees to Pentax for that, then patents are a total waist of time. Sure, they have slightly altered the layout and looks but in general it is exactly the same thing.

Pentax (at least the K5 and newer) has the hardware needed to do the same 5-axis SR as Sony and Oly but still they don't do it, lack of software apparently.

I would be surprised if the new K-1 doesn't have 5-axis SR, at least on paper. How well it works is another thing.
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