Successor to K3ii - care to guess when?

Ginnipe · 07-23-2016, 01:50 AM - **1 Like**

As everyone has said, if they can get the AF-C tracking to current standards, I'm in.

Tweak all the little things sure, make sure it has a bit better dynamic range, make sure it has a bit better ISO performance and buffer rate. But the one, biggest disadvantage Pentax has is AF. Put a little joystick to select the AF point / group, and pour the lions share of R & D into AF-C. I came from the Nikon D300 to the K1, and that D300 can AF track just as well if not slightly better than the K1 and it came out in the late 2000's. Granted, I don't often shoot sports or wild life, though I would like to get into it more. I'm not expecting a D500, but if Pentax wants to really start converting Canon and Nikon users they're going to have to address this. At least bring it up to the standard of the D7000 series, and more people will come over. If they release a K3mk3 and the biggest change is AF performance, I will most likely pick one up as soon as I can. The K1 is like Nikon's D810, a field camera and work horse, but not made for sports. Make the K3mk3 like the D500 in terms of purpose, make it a sports, wildlife, and journalism camera. And I will buy it in a heartbeat.

panonski · 07-23-2016, 01:53 AM

Originally posted by beachgardener

I for one do not want EVF, definetely not. No, Pentax does not need to follow like sheep. OVF is what I need in my DSLR, if Pentax change to EVF I will change to another brand that have OVF.

EVF will be the same as OVF in future terms, so it's nothing to lose about..

**beachgardener** · 07-23-2016, 04:02 AM

Originally posted by panonski

EVF will be the same as OVF in future terms, so it's nothing to lose about..

you didn't hear me, for me, definitely a no EVF from me. OVF all the way.

panonski · 07-23-2016, 04:31 AM

Originally posted by beachgardener

you didn't hear me, for me, definitely a no EVF from me. OVF all the way.

ok, ok

D1N0 · 07-23-2016, 04:43 AM

Pentax makes DSLRS so as long as they make them there will be an OVF. EVF is for mirrorless. A hybrid system with mirror up EVF I would welcome as long as it doesn't deteriorate the OVF view. The problem is making such a system compact. It would be easy to implement of you don't mind a huge camera top with two VF's or one really big VF. An other solution could be an EFV accessory that could go in the hot shoe.

**monochrome** · 07-23-2016, 06:23 AM

Originally posted by D1N0

Pentax makes DSLRS so as long as they make them there will be an OVF. EVF is for mirrorless. A hybrid system with mirror up EVF I would welcome as long as it doesn't deteriorate the OVF view. The problem is making such a system compact. It would be easy to implement of you don't mind a huge camera top with two VF's or one really big VF. An other solution could be an EFV accessory that could go in the hot shoe.

From a branding perspective it would be reasonable to expect an MILC to be a Ricoh camera. EVF technology could thus be explored without diluting the Pentax brand value proposition.

panonski · 07-23-2016, 06:40 AM

EVF is a revolution standard - and I'm sorry if this sounds rude - but mirrorirng for getting the picture to your eye - will be gone soon, mark my words here - and nobody would ever look back.

From users perspective I've already read in some threads - and there are certain users who claim that OVF and cameras which ownes it, would be their only choice.
But some of them tried very usable and best in class EVF from Oly in OMD, and they reverse their claims.

The better part is that particular EVF is made in 2013, and most articles are from that period.

OVF would dissapear like te keyboards dissapear from phones - no matter what. Maybe it would stay on really big cameras, for people in studios or photographers who like jogging with heavy equipment

Last edited by panonski; 07-23-2016 at 08:19 AM.

D1N0 · 07-23-2016, 06:44 AM

Originally posted by panonski

EVF is a revolution standard - and I'm sorry if this sounds rude - but mirrorirng for getting the picture to your eye - will be gone soon, mark my words here - and nobody would ever look back.

From users perspective I've already read some threads - and there are certain users who claim that OVF and cameras which ownes it, would be their only choice.
But some of them tried very usable and best in class EVF from Oly in OMD, and they reverse their claims.

The better part is that particular EVF is made in 2013, and most articles are from that period.

OVF would dissapear like te keyboards dissapear from phones - no matter what. Maybe it would stay on really big cameras, for people in studios or photographers who like jogging with heavy equipment

No this is just nonsense an OVF still has advantages. There is still no EVF that uses zero battery and has zero lag. EFV can be a useful addition to the OVF.

panonski · 07-23-2016, 06:49 AM

Originally posted by D1N0

No this is just nonsense an OVF still has advantages. There is still no EVF that uses zero battery and has zero lag. EFV can be a useful addition to the OVF.

and digital cameras from 2000 have very noise pics, and nobody can't beat the film ... Come on men

D1N0 · 07-23-2016, 06:51 AM

Originally posted by panonski

and digital cameras from 2000 have very noise pics, and nobody can beat the film ... Come on men

Now you are just trying to ridicule me. That means ignore mode

mee · 07-23-2016, 06:53 AM

Originally posted by panonski

and digital cameras from 2000 have very noise pics, and nobody can't beat the film ... Come on men

There is nothing to gain from this.. 'discussion.' Please move on for all of our sake!

panonski · 07-23-2016, 06:56 AM

Originally posted by D1N0

Now you are just trying to ridicule me. That means ignore mode

this mean you have no clue about this subject here, and most important you have very limited perspective and very less faith in future technologies

---------- Post added 07-23-16 at 07:02 AM ----------

Originally posted by mee

There is nothing to gain from this.. 'discussion.' Please move on for all of our sake!

Look men,

I'm just talk here, I have DSLR - it's in my signature here... If someone gets offended with new technology over almost pathetic claims that EVF would never be like OVF,

I must compare this with claims from 2000 - when people claim that nothing can beat the film.

End of discussion here - best to all

**Pål Jensen** · 07-23-2016, 12:57 PM - **1 Like**

Why should optics disappear? I think it will be around for the foreseeable future. There's no technology that replaces the real thing. Seeing with you own eyes via optics. DSLR's already have an EVF in addition to the optical one. Removing the optical finder is not adding new technology. It is removing an important feature from the camera.
Mirrorless is not new technology. It is the oldest camera technology there is.
You can buy DSLR's 50 years from now.....

panonski · 07-23-2016, 03:07 PM

Originally posted by Pål Jensen

Why should optics disappear? I think it will be around for the foreseeable future. There's no technology that replaces the real thing. Seeing with you own eyes via optics. DSLR's already have an EVF in addition to the optical one. Removing the optical finder is not adding new technology. It is removing an important feature from the camera.
Mirrorless is not new technology. It is the oldest camera technology there is.
You can buy DSLR's 50 years from now.....

If you are familiar with historical "Vievfinders" you will see the plenty of options, which are pretty much history now. Prism and mirror are indeed good solution, which last for very, very long period, and that's because of lacking parallax effect, which was good
--
Lack of parallax mean, the picture from lens have no different angle, compared to one from older viewfinders in older era camera bodys - because prism and mirror gave the "same" pic to your eye - if we're not 100 % precise in coverfiled

and that's my friend is best we can get. Till EVF came to the scene.

This discussion here made me to search over internet to cover my way of thinking - and I'm pretty sure now, from others who tried out some good EVF on their cameras - that EVF will override OVF,

at least , and for beginning in semipro class, which we're already ( who knows how to get the pro images) - calling the pro class.

( this is the case with K3, which is in my opinion pro camera, even without K1 or K3 II capability or sensor size ) ..

----
EVF have many advantages over OVF,
and OVF have only one, or maybe two over EVF - and this two are melting like an icecream on the hot sun in these - technology days.
Related articles I found when I'm do my research to show you how others think, and where the future optic/photo technology would be focused on

Rumors: Ricoh wants to enter the mirrorless interchangeable camera market | Pentax Rumors

EVF

Epson announces mass production of the EVF found in the Leica SL Typ 601 mirrorless camera | Photo Rumors

Optic would not disappear - I'm not exactly sayin that - but OVF will be override by EVF in many cameras, and it will be very soon, because companies like to offer cheaper product, less brokeable product, less heavy product, less parts product and less sized product.
and more powerfull and more inventive product

As soon when EVF bring us decent refresh rate to shoot sports and fast moving targets - the OVF would become a more expensive solution,
and more imporant - less usable.

**beachgardener** · 07-23-2016, 03:20 PM - **1 Like**

In my DSLR view finder I want to see the real thing, not a little video of it in the view finder, EVF no thank you.

07-23-2016, 04:43 AM	#125
D1N0 Pentaxian Join Date: May 2012 Location: --- Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,802	Pentax makes DSLRS so as long as they make them there will be an OVF. EVF is for mirrorless. A hybrid system with mirror up EVF I would welcome as long as it doesn't deteriorate the OVF view. The problem is making such a system compact. It would be easy to implement of you don't mind a huge camera top with two VF's or one really big VF. An other solution could be an EFV accessory that could go in the hot shoe. Last edited by D1N0; 07-23-2016 at 04:49 AM.

07-23-2016, 06:56 AM	#132
panonski Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Location: Zagreb Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 624	Originally posted by D1N0 Now you are just trying to ridicule me. That means ignore mode this mean you have no clue about this subject here, and most important you have very limited perspective and very less faith in future technologies ---------- Post added 07-23-16 at 07:02 AM ---------- Originally posted by mee There is nothing to gain from this.. 'discussion.' Please move on for all of our sake! Look men, I'm just talk here, I have DSLR - it's in my signature here... If someone gets offended with new technology over almost pathetic claims that EVF would never be like OVF, I must compare this with claims from 2000 - when people claim that nothing can beat the film. End of discussion here - best to all Last edited by panonski; 07-23-2016 at 08:06 AM.

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07-23-2016, 01:50 AM - 1 Like	#121
Ginnipe Junior Member Join Date: May 2016 Posts: 39	As everyone has said, if they can get the AF-C tracking to current standards, I'm in. Tweak all the little things sure, make sure it has a bit better dynamic range, make sure it has a bit better ISO performance and buffer rate. But the one, biggest disadvantage Pentax has is AF. Put a little joystick to select the AF point / group, and pour the lions share of R & D into AF-C. I came from the Nikon D300 to the K1, and that D300 can AF track just as well if not slightly better than the K1 and it came out in the late 2000's. Granted, I don't often shoot sports or wild life, though I would like to get into it more. I'm not expecting a D500, but if Pentax wants to really start converting Canon and Nikon users they're going to have to address this. At least bring it up to the standard of the D7000 series, and more people will come over. If they release a K3mk3 and the biggest change is AF performance, I will most likely pick one up as soon as I can. The K1 is like Nikon's D810, a field camera and work horse, but not made for sports. Make the K3mk3 like the D500 in terms of purpose, make it a sports, wildlife, and journalism camera. And I will buy it in a heartbeat.

07-23-2016, 01:53 AM	#122
panonski Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Location: Zagreb Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 624	Originally posted by beachgardener I for one do not want EVF, definetely not. No, Pentax does not need to follow like sheep. OVF is what I need in my DSLR, if Pentax change to EVF I will change to another brand that have OVF. EVF will be the same as OVF in future terms, so it's nothing to lose about..

07-23-2016, 04:02 AM	#123
beachgardener Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,842	Originally posted by panonski EVF will be the same as OVF in future terms, so it's nothing to lose about.. you didn't hear me, for me, definitely a no EVF from me. OVF all the way.

07-23-2016, 04:31 AM	#124
panonski Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Location: Zagreb Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 624	Originally posted by beachgardener you didn't hear me, for me, definitely a no EVF from me. OVF all the way. ok, ok

07-23-2016, 06:23 AM	#126
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Originally posted by D1N0 Pentax makes DSLRS so as long as they make them there will be an OVF. EVF is for mirrorless. A hybrid system with mirror up EVF I would welcome as long as it doesn't deteriorate the OVF view. The problem is making such a system compact. It would be easy to implement of you don't mind a huge camera top with two VF's or one really big VF. An other solution could be an EFV accessory that could go in the hot shoe. From a branding perspective it would be reasonable to expect an MILC to be a Ricoh camera. EVF technology could thus be explored without diluting the Pentax brand value proposition.

07-23-2016, 06:40 AM	#127
panonski Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Location: Zagreb Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 624	EVF is a revolution standard - and I'm sorry if this sounds rude - but mirrorirng for getting the picture to your eye - will be gone soon, mark my words here - and nobody would ever look back. From users perspective I've already read in some threads - and there are certain users who claim that OVF and cameras which ownes it, would be their only choice. But some of them tried very usable and best in class EVF from Oly in OMD, and they reverse their claims. The better part is that particular EVF is made in 2013, and most articles are from that period. OVF would dissapear like te keyboards dissapear from phones - no matter what. Maybe it would stay on really big cameras, for people in studios or photographers who like jogging with heavy equipment Last edited by panonski; 07-23-2016 at 08:19 AM.

07-23-2016, 06:44 AM	#128
D1N0 Pentaxian Join Date: May 2012 Location: --- Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,802	Originally posted by panonski EVF is a revolution standard - and I'm sorry if this sounds rude - but mirrorirng for getting the picture to your eye - will be gone soon, mark my words here - and nobody would ever look back. From users perspective I've already read some threads - and there are certain users who claim that OVF and cameras which ownes it, would be their only choice. But some of them tried very usable and best in class EVF from Oly in OMD, and they reverse their claims. The better part is that particular EVF is made in 2013, and most articles are from that period. OVF would dissapear like te keyboards dissapear from phones - no matter what. Maybe it would stay on really big cameras, for people in studios or photographers who like jogging with heavy equipment No this is just nonsense an OVF still has advantages. There is still no EVF that uses zero battery and has zero lag. EFV can be a useful addition to the OVF.

07-23-2016, 06:49 AM	#129
panonski Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Location: Zagreb Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 624	Originally posted by D1N0 No this is just nonsense an OVF still has advantages. There is still no EVF that uses zero battery and has zero lag. EFV can be a useful addition to the OVF. and digital cameras from 2000 have very noise pics, and nobody can't beat the film ... Come on men

07-23-2016, 06:51 AM	#130
D1N0 Pentaxian Join Date: May 2012 Location: --- Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,802	Originally posted by panonski and digital cameras from 2000 have very noise pics, and nobody can beat the film ... Come on men Now you are just trying to ridicule me. That means ignore mode

07-23-2016, 06:53 AM	#131
mee Veteran Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 7,403	Originally posted by panonski and digital cameras from 2000 have very noise pics, and nobody can't beat the film ... Come on men There is nothing to gain from this.. 'discussion.' Please move on for all of our sake!

07-23-2016, 12:57 PM - 1 Like	#133
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	Why should optics disappear? I think it will be around for the foreseeable future. There's no technology that replaces the real thing. Seeing with you own eyes via optics. DSLR's already have an EVF in addition to the optical one. Removing the optical finder is not adding new technology. It is removing an important feature from the camera. Mirrorless is not new technology. It is the oldest camera technology there is. You can buy DSLR's 50 years from now.....

07-23-2016, 03:07 PM	#134
panonski Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Location: Zagreb Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 624	Originally posted by Pål Jensen Why should optics disappear? I think it will be around for the foreseeable future. There's no technology that replaces the real thing. Seeing with you own eyes via optics. DSLR's already have an EVF in addition to the optical one. Removing the optical finder is not adding new technology. It is removing an important feature from the camera. Mirrorless is not new technology. It is the oldest camera technology there is. You can buy DSLR's 50 years from now..... If you are familiar with historical "Vievfinders" you will see the plenty of options, which are pretty much history now. Prism and mirror are indeed good solution, which last for very, very long period, and that's because of lacking parallax effect, which was good -- Lack of parallax mean, the picture from lens have no different angle, compared to one from older viewfinders in older era camera bodys - because prism and mirror gave the "same" pic to your eye - if we're not 100 % precise in coverfiled and that's my friend is best we can get. Till EVF came to the scene. This discussion here made me to search over internet to cover my way of thinking - and I'm pretty sure now, from others who tried out some good EVF on their cameras - that EVF will override OVF, at least , and for beginning in semipro class, which we're already ( who knows how to get the pro images) - calling the pro class. ( this is the case with K3, which is in my opinion pro camera, even without K1 or K3 II capability or sensor size ) .. ---- EVF have many advantages over OVF, and OVF have only one, or maybe two over EVF - and this two are melting like an icecream on the hot sun in these - technology days. Related articles I found when I'm do my research to show you how others think, and where the future optic/photo technology would be focused on Rumors: Ricoh wants to enter the mirrorless interchangeable camera market \| Pentax Rumors EVF Epson announces mass production of the EVF found in the Leica SL Typ 601 mirrorless camera \| Photo Rumors Optic would not disappear - I'm not exactly sayin that - but OVF will be override by EVF in many cameras, and it will be very soon, because companies like to offer cheaper product, less brokeable product, less heavy product, less parts product and less sized product. and more powerfull and more inventive product As soon when EVF bring us decent refresh rate to shoot sports and fast moving targets - the OVF would become a more expensive solution, and more imporant - less usable.

07-23-2016, 03:20 PM - 1 Like	#135
beachgardener Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,842	In my DSLR view finder I want to see the real thing, not a little video of it in the view finder, EVF no thank you.