[beachgardener]

probably better to keep the K-3 line and improve

[xmeda]

K1 is different system which NEEDS different lenses than already existing APS-C to work well. And these lenses are simply not there yet and they are not going to be there anytime soon as we can see current tempo. (Compare that "growth" to any other system).

There is no chance, that advanced APS-C camera will affect the K1. It only can help brand to stay on market and keep those, who are leaving. Not to mention, that K1 sales are laughable compared to ANY other FF camera on the market. It is more like cheap 645Z cousin for few guys who think, that they somehow "need" FF sensor size to make better pictures.

They need to produce:
645Z replacement
K1II replacement comparable to Z7, A7III, A99II (or kill it like Q and wait for lenses)
K3 replacement comparable to D500/7DII level
K70 replacement
+ Maybe something really low-end to attract newbies like Km/Kx/Kr were.

APS-C lenses overhaul, especially those DA*, that are more than decade old.

KP has little place here.
And yes there are guys who bought that and now they are trying to defent it till last breath.. But would you buy that KP if K3 replacement would have existed? I have serious doubts. It only is desperate move how to get something with slightly better IQ and AF, than 6 years old obsolete K3 technology (or the same camera branded as K3II).
It is not advanced camera and also not cheap camera. It was even more expensive than K3II when it was introduced. Just something in the middle, loosing both advantages.

[reh321]

KP has little place here.
And yes there are guys who bought that and now they are trying to defent it till last breath.. But would you buy that KP if K3 replacement would have existed? I have serious doubts. It only is desperate move how to get something with slightly better IQ and AF, than 6 years old obsolete K3 technology (or the same camera branded as K3II).
It is not advanced camera and also not cheap camera. It was even more expensive than K3II when it was introduced. Just something in the middle, loosing both advantages.

Yes, the KP is not a K-3 replacement, nor is it a cheap camera aimed at the usual K-n0 crowd. It is a separate product aimed at a different clientèle - and I am part of that clientèle. I was never interested in the K-5 or K-3; I purchased the K-30 because it was the most appropriate camera I could afford. Now the KP has arrived - the camera in the middle that gains advantages of both sides. I would never have purchased the K-3ii nor its replacement, but I will happily purchase a KP.

[Racer X 69]

K1 is different system which NEEDS different lenses than already existing APS-C to work well.

There are lots of lenses available that should work well with the K-1. In addition to existing newer AF Pentax lenses that cover the full frame image circle, there are lenses such as the Sigma DG lineup that are excellent performers.

And let’s not forget all the legacy film era glass.

But we are straying from the topic of discussion here, which is the APSC K-3 successor.

[dafbp]

But we are straying from the topic of discussion here, which is the APSC K-3 successor.

Wasn't that Pentax's original intention, to stray us from APS to FF ?

[reh321]

Wasn't that Pentax's original intention, to stray us from APS to FF ?

But it is not what many users here want. The impetus behind the K-1 was "let our legacy lenses act like themselves"; what nobody noticed was that we have built up a generation of DA lenses which have their own character, and many people have become comfortable with and "invested in" that.

[str8talk83]

But it is not what many users here want. The impetus behind the K-1 was "let our legacy lenses act like themselves"; what nobody noticed was that we have built up a generation of DA lenses which have their own character, and many people have become comfortable with and "invested in" that.

Hopefully Pentax doesn’t abandon the smaller sensor crowd like most of the other manufacturers. The upcoming 11-16 is a good sign that they aren’t.

[Racer X 69]

Wasn't that Pentax's original intention, to stray us from APS to FF ?

I really don’t know what the intentions of Ricoh/Pentax is.

But the topic of this discussion concerns an APSC replacement for the K-3II.

Not the K-1 and the limited selection of newer lenses for a full frame camera.

[The Squirrel Mafia]

All I can say is that many users will be happy if Ricoh can actually pull off a K-3II replacement this Photokina. If they can actually pull it off, which I still kind of doubt, the only remaining variable will be the AF performance. Will it have taken a major step forward from the K-3/3II line? No need to worry about IBIS & IQ 'cause I'm pretty sure that they have those 2 areas covered already.

Like Gang Starr once said, "The question remains." Hmmmm..............

[ffking]

K1 is different system which NEEDS different lenses than already existing APS-C to work well. And these lenses are simply not there yet and they are not going to be there anytime soon as we can see current tempo. (Compare that "growth" to any other system).

There is no chance, that advanced APS-C camera will affect the K1. It only can help brand to stay on market and keep those, who are leaving. Not to mention, that K1 sales are laughable compared to ANY other FF camera on the market. It is more like cheap 645Z cousin for few guys who think, that they somehow "need" FF sensor size to make better pictures.

They need to produce:
645Z replacement
K1II replacement comparable to Z7, A7III, A99II (or kill it like Q and wait for lenses)
K3 replacement comparable to D500/7DII level
K70 replacement
+ Maybe something really low-end to attract newbies like Km/Kx/Kr were.

APS-C lenses overhaul, especially those DA*, that are more than decade old.

KP has little place here.
And yes there are guys who bought that and now they are trying to defent it till last breath.. But would you buy that KP if K3 replacement would have existed? I have serious doubts. It only is desperate move how to get something with slightly better IQ and AF, than 6 years old obsolete K3 technology (or the same camera branded as K3II).
It is not advanced camera and also not cheap camera. It was even more expensive than K3II when it was introduced. Just something in the middle, loosing both advantages.

Somebody got out of bed the wrong side yesterday...

[reh321]

I really don’t what the intentions of Ricoh/Pentax is.

But the topic of this discussion concerns an APSC replacement for the K-3II.

Not the K-1 and the limited selection of newer lenses for a full frame camera.

Then you open the question of Pentax's original intention - I still believe the delay in an APS-C replacement for the K-3 line was a result of Pentax's originally intending for the K-1 to be the only replacement for the K-3 .... I don't see how the current shortage of anything K-3 can be explained in any other way without using the term "incompetent".

[jeallen01]

Then you open the question of Pentax's original intention - I still believe the delay in an APS-C replacement for the K-3 line was a result of Pentax's originally intending for the K-1 to be the only replacement for the K-3 .... I don't see how the current shortage of anything K-3 can be explained in any other way without using the term "incompetent".

If what you suggest is "true" then I can only agree with you = "incompetent" (to say the least!) - FF bodies and matching lenses are too big, heavy and EXPENSIVE for many of us, especially when we don't "feel the need" for "more quality"! Can't say that I could bring myself to fork out for a "K3 III" , but many can and would.

PS: IF Ricoh-Pentax really did think that FF was "the way to go" then they should have (PDQ!) followed up the K-1 with several other bodies both above and BELOW that one in capabilities and prices - but they didn't

[Mark Ransom]

If what you suggest is "true" then I can only agree with you = "incompetent" (to say the least!) - FF bodies and matching lenses are too big, heavy and EXPENSIVE for many of us, especially when we don't "feel the need" for "more quality"! Can't say that I could bring myself to fork out for a "K3 III" , but many can and would.

PS: IF Ricoh-Pentax really did think that FF was "the way to go" then they should have (PDQ!) followed up the K-1 with several other bodies both above and BELOW that one in capabilities and prices - but they didn't

I imagine the conversation at Pentax headquarters went like this:

"OK, our 3 camera model lineup has been working well for us. Now it is time to come up with the new models for all 3. What is the most requested feature that should go into the flagship?"

"A full frame sensor is the most requested feature, and will make that camera special to our loyal customers."

"Good. Get started, we will call it the K-1. What about our entry-level camera?"

"We've been working on a special image accelerator to improve the IQ from the K-50. And we could take some features like pixel shift from the K-3 II to make it a unique and compelling product."

"Good, we will call that the K-70. What about the middle-range?"

"Well it can't have all the features of the flagship. But it should have the accelerator so that our IQ will be the best. Our research has also shown that customers would value a smaller camera with good build quality."

"Fine, that will be the KP."

At no point in this hypothetical conversation did anybody realize that FF would be a new line rather than just a feature on a new model.

[jeallen01]

I imagine the conversation at Pentax headquarters went like this:
..........

At no point in this hypothetical conversation did anybody realize that FF would be a new line rather than just a feature on a new model.

That would definitely sound like "incompetence" me

[MarkJerling]

I imagine the conversation at Pentax headquarters went like this:

"OK, our 3 camera model lineup has been working well for us. Now it is time to come up with the new models for all 3. What is the most requested feature that should go into the flagship?"

"A full frame sensor is the most requested feature, and will make that camera special to our loyal customers."

"Good. Get started, we will call it the K-1. What about our entry-level camera?"

"We've been working on a special image accelerator to improve the IQ from the K-50. And we could take some features like pixel shift from the K-3 II to make it a unique and compelling product."

"Good, we will call that the K-70. What about the middle-range?"

"Well it can't have all the features of the flagship. But it should have the accelerator so that our IQ will be the best. Our research has also shown that customers would value a smaller camera with good build quality."

"Fine, that will be the KP."

At no point in this hypothetical conversation did anybody realize that FF would be a new line rather than just a feature on a new model.

Based on the cryptic interviews, I'd say you're most likely right on the mark!