K-3II overexposing (after firmware update)

Roquefort · 08-07-2018, 01:02 PM

Hi,

I searched around and found several threads about the K-3II overexposing, but I didn't find any real answers as to why it's happening.

I recently bought a new K-3II to replace my older K-3. At first it worked perfectly fine, exactly like the K-3 (as you would expect) but the last few days it started to overexpose some shots. Mostly in situations with sunlight it seems (outside or near a window), but not necessarily in very difficult lighting. I never had this problem with the K-3, which tended to underexpose a bit.

I'm using the exact same settings as I used on the K-3: shooting in RAW, with multi-pattern metering. When I'm shooting in Av or full auto mode, it tends to overexpose. It happens irrespective of lens used.

It seems this started after I upgraded the firmware to version 1.10. I'm not sure if this might be in any way related, and I'm not sure if it's possible to revert to 1.00 (or if it's even possible to download the older version anywhere) to test this.

Has anyone had a similar experience?

aaacb · 08-07-2018, 01:45 PM

I didn't notice any difference in exposure between firmware updates, I updated a while ago when it was released. For me, usually drastic overexposure happens from human error when I leave spot metering on and forget about it, but you already checked that the same metering was used.

Adam · 08-07-2018, 01:46 PM

Originally posted by Roquefort

Hi,

I searched around and found several threads about the K-3II overexposing, but I didn't find any real answers as to why it's happening.

I recently bought a new K-3II to replace my older K-3. At first it worked perfectly fine, exactly like the K-3 (as you would expect) but the last few days it started to overexpose some shots. Mostly in situations with sunlight it seems (outside or near a window), but not necessarily in very difficult lighting. I never had this problem with the K-3, which tended to underexpose a bit.

I'm using the exact same settings as I used on the K-3: shooting in RAW, with multi-pattern metering. When I'm shooting in Av or full auto mode, it tends to overexpose. It happens irrespective of lens used.

It seems this started after I upgraded the firmware to version 1.10. I'm not sure if this might be in any way related, and I'm not sure if it's possible to revert to 1.00 (or if it's even possible to download the older version anywhere) to test this.

Has anyone had a similar experience?

It's more likely related to an inadvertent settings change, or reset. Could you post some problematic samples?

Paul the Sunman · 08-07-2018, 03:13 PM

Originally posted by Roquefort

I recently bought a new K-3II to replace my older K-3. At first it worked perfectly fine, exactly like the K-3 (as you would expect) but the last few days it started to overexpose some shots.

My K3 generally over-exposes with the Sigma 35mm Art mounted. What lens are you using, and has that changed?

house · 08-07-2018, 03:20 PM

My K-3 II is permanently on -0,7 compensation when using matrix metering.

Roquefort · 08-07-2018, 04:01 PM

Originally posted by Paul the Sunman

My K3 generally over-exposes with the Sigma 35mm Art mounted. What lens are you using, and has that changed?

I tried the DA 50mm 1.8 and the DA 16-85mm. Results were the same for both lenses.

I included two examples. I'll admit that they aren't that extreme and can mostly be fixed in post-processing, but the histogram shows clipping highlights for both. And I don't remember ever having similar results with the K-3, which is what worries me a bit. It also didn't happen with the K-3II before the firmware update, although I really haven't had it for long enough to test it extensively yet so it might be a coincidence. Sadly I already sold the K-3 so I can't test the two against each other.

Having a permanent exposure compensation as a fix isn't ideal, because it doesn't overexpose consistently (I just tried, without having touched any settings, under artificial light and the results seemed perfectly fine).

C_Jones · 08-07-2018, 06:03 PM

What the subject contains, such as a combination of dark, white, glare, plus other shades can cause it to be difficult for the camera to meter appropriately for all of the subject contents. You may want to switch to "Spot" metering mode and test on different subjects to see how it meters based on the "Spot" (center point) that you are focusing on.

I have a K-3 II and I know the metering of the subject can differ due to its contents, such as glare and dark areas, so I just accept the fact that not everything can be interpreted by the camera sometimes and just switch to Manual mode. That way I have full control..

**clackers** · 08-07-2018, 06:15 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Roquefort

I tried the DA 50mm 1.8 and the DA 16-85mm. Results were the same for both lenses.

I included two examples. I'll admit that they aren't that extreme and can mostly be fixed in post-processing, but the histogram shows clipping highlights for both. And I don't remember ever having similar results with the K-3, which is what worries me a bit. It also didn't happen with the K-3II before the firmware update, although I really haven't had it for long enough to test it extensively yet so it might be a coincidence. Sadly I already sold the K-3 so I can't test the two against each other.

Having a permanent exposure compensation as a fix isn't ideal, because it doesn't overexpose consistently (I just tried, without having touched any settings, under artificial light and the results seemed perfectly fine).

Both those examples look correctly exposed for 18 percent grey, Roquefort. They have large dark areas, and so will overexpose smaller white areas.

Roquefort · 08-08-2018, 02:37 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by clackers

Both those examples look correctly exposed for 18 percent grey, Roquefort. They have large dark areas, and so will overexpose smaller white areas.

These are the RAWs, the effect is more pronounced in the jpg preview. But looking at the histogram of these it's clear they are leaning towards the bright side, with blown out highlights. Even if it would have exposed for the subject in the shade (man in the middle), it's still too bright.

Like I said, I'm not used to the K-3 doing this. In similar situations I feel it tended to underexpose - I assume by design, to preserve highlights. Maybe there's a setting somewhere for this that I'm not aware of, but in the 10.000+ photos I took with the original K-3 I can't remember coming across something similar as the examples above. To compare, here's an example of a shot I took with the K-3 with tricky lighting. Of course no two photos are perfectly comparable but notice how this one leans toward underexposure, with actual shadows and no or very little clipped highlights. This is what I've come to expect so the K-3II's metering seems strange to me.

**Larrymc** · 08-08-2018, 06:55 AM

Originally posted by Roquefort

Hi,

I searched around and found several threads about the K-3II overexposing, but I didn't find any real answers as to why it's happening.

I recently bought a new K-3II to replace my older K-3. At first it worked perfectly fine, exactly like the K-3 (as you would expect) but the last few days it started to overexpose some shots. Mostly in situations with sunlight it seems (outside or near a window), but not necessarily in very difficult lighting. I never had this problem with the K-3, which tended to underexpose a bit.

I'm using the exact same settings as I used on the K-3: shooting in RAW, with multi-pattern metering. When I'm shooting in Av or full auto mode, it tends to overexpose. It happens irrespective of lens used.

It seems this started after I upgraded the firmware to version 1.10. I'm not sure if this might be in any way related, and I'm not sure if it's possible to revert to 1.00 (or if it's even possible to download the older version anywhere) to test this.

Has anyone had a similar experience?

Have you by chance inadvertently changed some of your custom image settings?

Roquefort · 08-08-2018, 12:33 PM

Originally posted by Larrymc

Have you by chance inadvertently changed some of your custom image settings?

I checked a few times after this happened, but they're the same settings I've always used. I'm not sure if there is a setting that could cause this anyway.

leekil · 08-08-2018, 12:41 PM

When I moved to the K-3 II from the K-5, it seemed to overexpose to me. I typically have a -0.3 exposure compensation.

**clackers** · 08-08-2018, 05:22 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Roquefort

Like I said, I'm not used to the K-3 doing this.

Here is a photo you took with your K-3 doing this.

The clouds are blown.

Havenhuis - PentaxForums.com

Same as the three photographs as you've posted in this thread - there are big dark areas in the scenes, which you need to acknowledge in the shooting process, not later in post processing.

If you're unsure how much to underexpose, you can ask the camera to do something about it by selecting 'Highlight Correction' as an option.

aitrus3 · 08-08-2018, 08:55 PM

All those examples include a huge amount of dark areas, so yes it's going to seem to overexpose the highlights.
Use manual mode and you'll avoid this. The auto modes are ok for even-Steven lighting, but with all camera makes, it falls apart under conditions like this.
You said you shot RAW? All these images should be recoverable 100%.

Roquefort · 08-09-2018, 02:41 AM

Originally posted by clackers

Here is a photo you took with your K-3 doing this.

The clouds are blown.

Havenhuis - PentaxForums.com

Same as the three photographs as you've posted in this thread - there are big dark areas in the scenes, which you need to acknowledge in the shooting process, not later in post processing.

If you're unsure how much to underexpose, you can ask the camera to do something about it by selecting 'Highlight Correction' as an option.

That example was shot with manual exposure so isn't a useful comparison. And the partly blown clouds were mostly caused by increasing contrast in post-processing, in the RAW there is some, but little, clipping.

I tried the highlight correction setting but I think it only applies on jpg (not sure). I don't see any difference but I know I always had it disabled on the K-3.

The point is that, in similar situations with high contrast, the K-3 seemed to err on the safe side and expose for the light areas, underexposing the dark parts - which I feel is preferable. This is clear in the example I posted. The K-3II seems to go the other way, which is strange to me because I assumed it's basically the same camera apart from a few minor features. I admit it's hard to be sure without being able to compare them directly. Maybe I'm imagining things and there's actually nothing wrong, I'll see if I can try a demo model in the store for comparison.

08-07-2018, 01:02 PM	#1
Roquefort Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2016 Posts: 63	K-3II overexposing (after firmware update) Hi, I searched around and found several threads about the K-3II overexposing, but I didn't find any real answers as to why it's happening. I recently bought a new K-3II to replace my older K-3. At first it worked perfectly fine, exactly like the K-3 (as you would expect) but the last few days it started to overexpose some shots. Mostly in situations with sunlight it seems (outside or near a window), but not necessarily in very difficult lighting. I never had this problem with the K-3, which tended to underexpose a bit. I'm using the exact same settings as I used on the K-3: shooting in RAW, with multi-pattern metering. When I'm shooting in Av or full auto mode, it tends to overexpose. It happens irrespective of lens used. It seems this started after I upgraded the firmware to version 1.10. I'm not sure if this might be in any way related, and I'm not sure if it's possible to revert to 1.00 (or if it's even possible to download the older version anywhere) to test this. Has anyone had a similar experience?

08-07-2018, 01:45 PM	#2
aaacb Pentaxian Join Date: May 2016 Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,725	I didn't notice any difference in exposure between firmware updates, I updated a while ago when it was released. For me, usually drastic overexposure happens from human error when I leave spot metering on and forget about it, but you already checked that the same metering was used. Last edited by aaacb; 08-07-2018 at 02:19 PM.

08-07-2018, 01:46 PM	#3
Adam Administrator Site Webmaster Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Arizona Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 51,595	Originally posted by Roquefort Hi, I searched around and found several threads about the K-3II overexposing, but I didn't find any real answers as to why it's happening. I recently bought a new K-3II to replace my older K-3. At first it worked perfectly fine, exactly like the K-3 (as you would expect) but the last few days it started to overexpose some shots. Mostly in situations with sunlight it seems (outside or near a window), but not necessarily in very difficult lighting. I never had this problem with the K-3, which tended to underexpose a bit. I'm using the exact same settings as I used on the K-3: shooting in RAW, with multi-pattern metering. When I'm shooting in Av or full auto mode, it tends to overexpose. It happens irrespective of lens used. It seems this started after I upgraded the firmware to version 1.10. I'm not sure if this might be in any way related, and I'm not sure if it's possible to revert to 1.00 (or if it's even possible to download the older version anywhere) to test this. Has anyone had a similar experience? It's more likely related to an inadvertent settings change, or reset. Could you post some problematic samples? Adam PentaxForums.com Webmaster (Site Usage Guide \| Site Help \| My Photography) PentaxForums.com server and development costs are user-supported. You can help cover these costs by donating or purchasing one of our Pentax eBooks. Or, buy your photo gear from our affiliates, Adorama, B&H Photo, KEH, or Topaz Labs, and get FREE Marketplace access - click here to see how! Trusted Pentax retailers:

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08-07-2018, 03:13 PM	#4
Paul the Sunman Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Melbourne Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,843	Originally posted by Roquefort I recently bought a new K-3II to replace my older K-3. At first it worked perfectly fine, exactly like the K-3 (as you would expect) but the last few days it started to overexpose some shots. My K3 generally over-exposes with the Sigma 35mm Art mounted. What lens are you using, and has that changed?

08-07-2018, 03:20 PM	#5
house Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 3,306	My K-3 II is permanently on -0,7 compensation when using matrix metering.

08-07-2018, 06:03 PM	#7
C_Jones Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: NY Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,084	What the subject contains, such as a combination of dark, white, glare, plus other shades can cause it to be difficult for the camera to meter appropriately for all of the subject contents. You may want to switch to "Spot" metering mode and test on different subjects to see how it meters based on the "Spot" (center point) that you are focusing on. I have a K-3 II and I know the metering of the subject can differ due to its contents, such as glare and dark areas, so I just accept the fact that not everything can be interpreted by the camera sometimes and just switch to Manual mode. That way I have full control..

08-07-2018, 06:15 PM - 1 Like	#8
clackers Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Melbourne Photos: Albums Posts: 16,397	Originally posted by Roquefort I tried the DA 50mm 1.8 and the DA 16-85mm. Results were the same for both lenses. I included two examples. I'll admit that they aren't that extreme and can mostly be fixed in post-processing, but the histogram shows clipping highlights for both. And I don't remember ever having similar results with the K-3, which is what worries me a bit. It also didn't happen with the K-3II before the firmware update, although I really haven't had it for long enough to test it extensively yet so it might be a coincidence. Sadly I already sold the K-3 so I can't test the two against each other. Having a permanent exposure compensation as a fix isn't ideal, because it doesn't overexpose consistently (I just tried, without having touched any settings, under artificial light and the results seemed perfectly fine). Both those examples look correctly exposed for 18 percent grey, Roquefort. They have large dark areas, and so will overexpose smaller white areas.

08-08-2018, 06:55 AM	#10
Larrymc Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Mississippi, USA Posts: 5,251	Originally posted by Roquefort Hi, I searched around and found several threads about the K-3II overexposing, but I didn't find any real answers as to why it's happening. I recently bought a new K-3II to replace my older K-3. At first it worked perfectly fine, exactly like the K-3 (as you would expect) but the last few days it started to overexpose some shots. Mostly in situations with sunlight it seems (outside or near a window), but not necessarily in very difficult lighting. I never had this problem with the K-3, which tended to underexpose a bit. I'm using the exact same settings as I used on the K-3: shooting in RAW, with multi-pattern metering. When I'm shooting in Av or full auto mode, it tends to overexpose. It happens irrespective of lens used. It seems this started after I upgraded the firmware to version 1.10. I'm not sure if this might be in any way related, and I'm not sure if it's possible to revert to 1.00 (or if it's even possible to download the older version anywhere) to test this. Has anyone had a similar experience? Have you by chance inadvertently changed some of your custom image settings?

08-08-2018, 12:33 PM	#11
Roquefort Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2016 Posts: 63 Original Poster	Originally posted by Larrymc Have you by chance inadvertently changed some of your custom image settings? I checked a few times after this happened, but they're the same settings I've always used. I'm not sure if there is a setting that could cause this anyway.

08-08-2018, 12:41 PM	#12
leekil Pentaxian Join Date: May 2016 Photos: Albums Posts: 2,003	When I moved to the K-3 II from the K-5, it seemed to overexpose to me. I typically have a -0.3 exposure compensation.

08-08-2018, 05:22 PM - 1 Like	#13
clackers Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Melbourne Photos: Albums Posts: 16,397	Originally posted by Roquefort Like I said, I'm not used to the K-3 doing this. Here is a photo you took with your K-3 doing this. The clouds are blown. Havenhuis - PentaxForums.com Same as the three photographs as you've posted in this thread - there are big dark areas in the scenes, which you need to acknowledge in the shooting process, not later in post processing. If you're unsure how much to underexpose, you can ask the camera to do something about it by selecting 'Highlight Correction' as an option.

08-08-2018, 08:55 PM	#14
aitrus3 Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Kamloops B.C. Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,432	All those examples include a huge amount of dark areas, so yes it's going to seem to overexpose the highlights. Use manual mode and you'll avoid this. The auto modes are ok for even-Steven lighting, but with all camera makes, it falls apart under conditions like this. You said you shot RAW? All these images should be recoverable 100%.

08-09-2018, 02:41 AM	#15
Roquefort Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2016 Posts: 63 Original Poster	Originally posted by clackers Here is a photo you took with your K-3 doing this. The clouds are blown. Havenhuis - PentaxForums.com Same as the three photographs as you've posted in this thread - there are big dark areas in the scenes, which you need to acknowledge in the shooting process, not later in post processing. If you're unsure how much to underexpose, you can ask the camera to do something about it by selecting 'Highlight Correction' as an option. That example was shot with manual exposure so isn't a useful comparison. And the partly blown clouds were mostly caused by increasing contrast in post-processing, in the RAW there is some, but little, clipping. I tried the highlight correction setting but I think it only applies on jpg (not sure). I don't see any difference but I know I always had it disabled on the K-3. The point is that, in similar situations with high contrast, the K-3 seemed to err on the safe side and expose for the light areas, underexposing the dark parts - which I feel is preferable. This is clear in the example I posted. The K-3II seems to go the other way, which is strange to me because I assumed it's basically the same camera apart from a few minor features. I admit it's hard to be sure without being able to compare them directly. Maybe I'm imagining things and there's actually nothing wrong, I'll see if I can try a demo model in the store for comparison.