"You have a nice camera"

scratchpaddy · 05-13-2014, 07:57 PM - **1 Like**

This is probably the worst thing someone could say to a photographer. It goes like this: you take a nice picture. You show it to someone. They like it too. What do they say to show their admiration? "You have talent"? "You have skill"? "I wish I could do that"? No. They say, "You have such a nice camera."

Think about the implications for a moment. Was your skill important? Your experience? Apparently, your efforts have nothing to do with it. It's all in the camera. Your nice camera does all the work for you. Why don't they come out and say it? "If I had a camera as nice as yours, I bet I could take even better pictures."

It makes me wish carrying around a DSLR didn't also mean carrying around all the baggage, and I'm not talking about the camera bag. "Big camera" doesn't mean "good photographer," and it never has, but that's what people think, often without realizing it. If you're actually good at using one, it doesn't matter as much once you get the big camera. Of course your pictures are nice. It's just because you have a nice camera.

Once you have the best gear, nothing but the best is acceptable from you. It always makes me hesitate before going after the best gear. That's a good thing. It's not the gear that makes the picture. It's you.

Matt Miller · 05-13-2014, 08:17 PM - **8 Likes**

Nice post. You must have a good keyboard.

scratchpaddy · 05-13-2014, 08:26 PM

Originally posted by Matt Miller

Nice post. You must have a good keyboard.

I'm quite proud of this keyboard. My posts were always rubbish until I got it.

GibbyTheMole · 05-13-2014, 08:39 PM

You certainly have a point, but I take such comments as the compliment they're meant to be and move on. You and I know what's what, but most people don't. No biggie.

jimr-pdx · 05-13-2014, 08:44 PM

Check out the golfchannel website, they are now showing what the most-recent winner had in his golf bag. Buy them and you can win next week!

scratchpaddy · 05-13-2014, 08:51 PM

Originally posted by GibbyTheMole

You certainly have a point, but I take such comments as the compliment they're meant to be and move on. You and I know what's what, but most people don't. No biggie.

OK, I do sound kind of angry in the original post, but don't get me wrong; I just move on too. I actually heard it a number of times before I started thinking about it. I know it's honestly meant as a compliment, and I don't get mad when I hear it. But it made me realize that most people think it's all in the camera, not the person behind it. Heck, I even catch myself doing the same thing when I look at pictures taken with gear even more advanced than mine. I want to stop being jealous of other people's gear, because it's completely beside the point.

I think we're all aware of these things, deep down, but it's too easy to slip into the "gear" mindset. I just wanted to remind myself, and maybe some others, too.

Originally posted by jimr-pdx

Check out the golfchannel website, they are now showing what the most-recent winner had in his golf bag. Buy them and you can win next week!

Yeah, it's not just a photography thing.

I wonder which hobby has the worst gear obsession?

SpecialK · 05-13-2014, 09:05 PM - **2 Likes**

I was called "a really good photographer" by a clairvoyant woman, based on the simple fact I had a camera and camera bag around my neck when I approached her group...

tahoejeepmom · 05-13-2014, 09:36 PM

The camera is a tool. but not everyone knows how to use the tools right. That is like saying you have a nice paint brush and thats some really good oil paint. It takes an artist to use the tools to make art.

Next time give the camera to the person and say here take some photos like I just did.

Imageman · 05-14-2014, 02:12 AM - **1 Like**

The sad thing is that person is largely right.

Digital is killing the craft of photography.

There was a time when it was not guaranteed that pictures would turn out. It took skill to get more than a few pictures that showed anything.

Beginners would start to get exposures right, then focus, then composition. By the time you could see good photographs they had learned a whole lot about handling a camera.

These days everybody is used to pointing a digital camera in the general direction of something interesting and being able to frame it on the rear screen. The shutter releases and they get a picture, it always turns out sharp, it always turns out well exposed, and it always shows what they wanted in the frame.

With digital, everyone can successfully take a picture. So why would they think it takes any skill.

If cars did what cameras do, you would sit in a car and it would drive you, you would do nothing except tell it where to take you, automatic everything.

Sure those of us who know what we are doing use manual, but most photographers in this site and the rest of the world want automatic exposure, automatic focus, automatic shake reduction.

The only thing left to any skill might be where the camera is pointed, but there are photographers take 700 images in a day rejecting 690 that were not pointed at something interesting and discovering quite by chance that 10 were.

This is the photography of monkeys.

I would suggest that in more than 99% of photographs taken today (im talking generally and not on this site) that look good, there is zero skill. Who can blame people for thinking the camera is the reason for the good photograph. What we face is, when someone looks at a well composed and well exposed image, viewers think "I could do that with my Iphone"

Clavius · 05-14-2014, 02:49 AM

Originally posted by scratchpaddy

This is probably the worst thing someone could say to a photographer. It goes like this: you take a nice picture. You show it to someone. They like it too. What do they say to show their admiration? "You have talent"? "You have skill"? "I wish I could do that"? No. They say, "You have such a nice camera."

Think about the implications for a moment. Was your skill important? Your experience? Apparently, your efforts have nothing to do with it. It's all in the camera. Your nice camera does all the work for you. Why don't they come out and say it? "If I had a camera as nice as yours, I bet I could take even better pictures."

It makes me wish carrying around a DSLR didn't also mean carrying around all the baggage, and I'm not talking about the camera bag. "Big camera" doesn't mean "good photographer," and it never has, but that's what people think, often without realizing it. If you're actually good at using one, it doesn't matter as much once you get the big camera. Of course your pictures are nice. It's just because you have a nice camera.

Once you have the best gear, nothing but the best is acceptable from you. It always makes me hesitate before going after the best gear. That's a good thing. It's not the gear that makes the picture. It's you.

Oh how true! I've been fed up with this for ages. There's whole tribes of people that think photography requires only good gear and zero skill. I even know multiple people that bought a DSLR because of my pictures. And then complain afterwards: "Why can't such an expensive camera take good pictures?" It's also the reason why I dislike using my DSLR in public places. I strongly dislike being one of the many moms and dads that's carrying one at the amusement park. Makes me feel like I'm one of the douches.

I've been able to switch this around entirely though. Since I got my tiny mirrorless they're surprised at the quality of my pictures, despite the fact that I'm obviously using an amateur camera. It must be me then. I prefer being the one that produces very nice pictures despite the camera that looks like a household compact, then the one with the pro gear that just lives up to what his gear promises.

And what I enjoy most is taking out my TLR in public. The looks I get are priceless. And the expections can't be lower. People only look, but don't ask. They must be thinking I'm bonkers. I've already got a wooden tripod. Now all I need is some kind of strange hat to complete the total package though.

**skid2964** · 05-14-2014, 10:28 AM

I have heard the comments, "Wow, your pictures are sooo good, what kind of camera do you have? my DLSR doesnt make photos like that!"

I agree this happens way too often but it seems to be diminishing somewhat. Why? because so many people went out and bought a fancy new DLSR and were very surprised to see that their photos were NOT good like those professional images they had seen. They leave it on "auto" overuse the pop-up flash.. have no clue what ISO is and forget about post-processing... They just want to be able to WiFi the images straight to Facebook...

GibbyTheMole · 05-14-2014, 10:33 AM

Originally posted by Imageman

These days everybody is used to pointing a digital camera in the general direction of something interesting and being able to frame it on the rear screen. The shutter releases and they get a picture, it always turns out sharp, it always turns out well exposed, and it always shows what they wanted in the frame.

With digital, everyone can successfully take a picture. So why would they think it takes any skill.

LOL... I've seen plenty of photos taken with digital cameras that would prove you wrong.

**monochrome** · 05-14-2014, 10:56 AM - **1 Like**

Be thankful for faint praise.

My son's Mother-in-law handed me her Nikon Superzoom at the family Christmas dinner at their club to take the requisite group shots because "You take good pictures." She's only ever seen my Q and the photos I email to my son and daughter-in-law, so I suppose she meant what she said - but there's a certain pressure to perform under those circumstances.

For cars it has always been, "Win on Sunday, sell on Monday."

Who ever credited the driver?

I have known wealthy ordinary people who owned professional Canon, Nikon and Hassy cameras since I was in my teens. I've known people who had darkrooms in their basements that their children used more than they did. I've known people who gave their 10th-Grade child an FM2 for Christmas.

I know a guy who worked for a camera store who took his photographs all his life with the most godawful, broken, Ugly Spotmatics and Takumars you'll ever see, most of them jury-repaired from parts bodies. He gave me his stuff in a cardboard box and everything exposes film once you learn the idosyncracies. The Super Tak 105/2.8 lacks a beauty ring and the aperture indictor ring is loose, but I can get there by counting clicks and shading the front element with my hand like Jerry did.

Mostly I know people who take good pictures.

lytrytyr · 05-14-2014, 02:33 PM

Originally posted by Imageman

The only thing left to any skill might be where the camera is pointed

Not for long:

"Autographer is a new type of camera which has been custom built to enable spontaneous, hands-free image capture.
Its world leading technology includes a custom 136° eye view lens, an ultra small GPS unit and 5 in-built sensors.
These sensors are fused by a sophisticated algorithm to tell the camera exactly the right moments to take photos."

Home - Autographer - The World's First Wearable camera

scratchpaddy · 05-14-2014, 07:34 PM

Originally posted by Imageman

With digital, everyone can successfully take a picture. So why would they think it takes any skill.

Anyone can take a picture, true. Successfully? Only if your definition of "success" excludes composition. That's still a critical part of a picture. Automagic mode can give you proper exposure, but it can't give you good lighting. The screen on the back can help you frame the picture, but it can't give you good framing.

I know things were more challenging back in the day. I respect you for working through that. I was one of those "monkeys" you talk about, ten years ago, a kid with a PDA with a built-in 0.3 megapixel camera. The best way to learn is by making mistakes, and I made lots of mistakes. Sometimes hundreds of worthless pictures in a single day. Quantity over quality. But that's how I figured out what worked, and what didn't. It was easy, and it was fun.

Photography is easy to pick up, easier than ever now, as you say, but hard to master. So lots of people are taking awful pictures. They're learning. I'm okay with that, as long as people understand that they're the main reason the pictures are good or bad, not the camera.

Originally posted by lytrytyr

Not for long:

"Autographer is a new type of camera which has been custom built to enable spontaneous, hands-free image capture.
Its world leading technology includes a custom 136° eye view lens, an ultra small GPS unit and 5 in-built sensors.
These sensors are fused by a sophisticated algorithm to tell the camera exactly the right moments to take photos."

Yeah... those things actually do scare me. Every picture taken is a learning experience, but only if you actually take the picture. Hopefully, it won't catch on. Hopefully.

05-13-2014, 07:57 PM - 1 Like	#1
scratchpaddy Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Phoenix Posts: 3,361	"You have a nice camera" This is probably the worst thing someone could say to a photographer. It goes like this: you take a nice picture. You show it to someone. They like it too. What do they say to show their admiration? "You have talent"? "You have skill"? "I wish I could do that"? No. They say, "You have such a nice camera." Think about the implications for a moment. Was your skill important? Your experience? Apparently, your efforts have nothing to do with it. It's all in the camera. Your nice camera does all the work for you. Why don't they come out and say it? "If I had a camera as nice as yours, I bet I could take even better pictures." It makes me wish carrying around a DSLR didn't also mean carrying around all the baggage, and I'm not talking about the camera bag. "Big camera" doesn't mean "good photographer," and it never has, but that's what people think, often without realizing it. If you're actually good at using one, it doesn't matter as much once you get the big camera. Of course your pictures are nice. It's just because you have a nice camera. Once you have the best gear, nothing but the best is acceptable from you. It always makes me hesitate before going after the best gear. That's a good thing. It's not the gear that makes the picture. It's you.

05-14-2014, 02:49 AM	#10
Clavius Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: De Klundert Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,150	Originally posted by scratchpaddy This is probably the worst thing someone could say to a photographer. It goes like this: you take a nice picture. You show it to someone. They like it too. What do they say to show their admiration? "You have talent"? "You have skill"? "I wish I could do that"? No. They say, "You have such a nice camera." Think about the implications for a moment. Was your skill important? Your experience? Apparently, your efforts have nothing to do with it. It's all in the camera. Your nice camera does all the work for you. Why don't they come out and say it? "If I had a camera as nice as yours, I bet I could take even better pictures." It makes me wish carrying around a DSLR didn't also mean carrying around all the baggage, and I'm not talking about the camera bag. "Big camera" doesn't mean "good photographer," and it never has, but that's what people think, often without realizing it. If you're actually good at using one, it doesn't matter as much once you get the big camera. Of course your pictures are nice. It's just because you have a nice camera. Once you have the best gear, nothing but the best is acceptable from you. It always makes me hesitate before going after the best gear. That's a good thing. It's not the gear that makes the picture. It's you. Oh how true! I've been fed up with this for ages. There's whole tribes of people that think photography requires only good gear and zero skill. I even know multiple people that bought a DSLR because of my pictures. And then complain afterwards: "Why can't such an expensive camera take good pictures?" It's also the reason why I dislike using my DSLR in public places. I strongly dislike being one of the many moms and dads that's carrying one at the amusement park. Makes me feel like I'm one of the douches. I've been able to switch this around entirely though. Since I got my tiny mirrorless they're surprised at the quality of my pictures, despite the fact that I'm obviously using an amateur camera. It must be me then. I prefer being the one that produces very nice pictures despite the camera that looks like a household compact, then the one with the pro gear that just lives up to what his gear promises. And what I enjoy most is taking out my TLR in public. The looks I get are priceless. And the expections can't be lower. People only look, but don't ask. They must be thinking I'm bonkers. I've already got a wooden tripod. Now all I need is some kind of strange hat to complete the total package though. Last edited by Clavius; 05-14-2014 at 03:14 AM.

05-14-2014, 10:56 AM - 1 Like	#13
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Be thankful for faint praise. My son's Mother-in-law handed me her Nikon Superzoom at the family Christmas dinner at their club to take the requisite group shots because "You take good pictures." She's only ever seen my Q and the photos I email to my son and daughter-in-law, so I suppose she meant what she said - but there's a certain pressure to perform under those circumstances. For cars it has always been, "Win on Sunday, sell on Monday." Who ever credited the driver? I have known wealthy ordinary people who owned professional Canon, Nikon and Hassy cameras since I was in my teens. I've known people who had darkrooms in their basements that their children used more than they did. I've known people who gave their 10th-Grade child an FM2 for Christmas. I know a guy who worked for a camera store who took his photographs all his life with the most godawful, broken, Ugly Spotmatics and Takumars you'll ever see, most of them jury-repaired from parts bodies. He gave me his stuff in a cardboard box and everything exposes film once you learn the idosyncracies. The Super Tak 105/2.8 lacks a beauty ring and the aperture indictor ring is loose, but I can get there by counting clicks and shading the front element with my hand like Jerry did. Mostly I know people who take good pictures. Last edited by monochrome; 05-15-2014 at 08:03 AM.

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05-13-2014, 08:17 PM - 8 Likes	#2
Matt Miller Veteran Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Cambridge, Iowa Photos: Gallery Posts: 339	Nice post. You must have a good keyboard.

05-13-2014, 08:26 PM	#3
scratchpaddy Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Phoenix Posts: 3,361 Original Poster	Originally posted by Matt Miller Nice post. You must have a good keyboard. I'm quite proud of this keyboard. My posts were always rubbish until I got it.

05-13-2014, 08:39 PM	#4
GibbyTheMole Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Iowa Photos: Albums Posts: 2,275	You certainly have a point, but I take such comments as the compliment they're meant to be and move on. You and I know what's what, but most people don't. No biggie.

05-13-2014, 08:44 PM	#5
jimr-pdx Pentaxian Join Date: May 2010 Location: now 1 hour north of PDX Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,897	Check out the golfchannel website, they are now showing what the most-recent winner had in his golf bag. Buy them and you can win next week!

05-13-2014, 08:51 PM	#6
scratchpaddy Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Phoenix Posts: 3,361 Original Poster	Originally posted by GibbyTheMole You certainly have a point, but I take such comments as the compliment they're meant to be and move on. You and I know what's what, but most people don't. No biggie. OK, I do sound kind of angry in the original post, but don't get me wrong; I just move on too. I actually heard it a number of times before I started thinking about it. I know it's honestly meant as a compliment, and I don't get mad when I hear it. But it made me realize that most people think it's all in the camera, not the person behind it. Heck, I even catch myself doing the same thing when I look at pictures taken with gear even more advanced than mine. I want to stop being jealous of other people's gear, because it's completely beside the point. I think we're all aware of these things, deep down, but it's too easy to slip into the "gear" mindset. I just wanted to remind myself, and maybe some others, too. Originally posted by jimr-pdx Check out the golfchannel website, they are now showing what the most-recent winner had in his golf bag. Buy them and you can win next week! Yeah, it's not just a photography thing. I wonder which hobby has the worst gear obsession?

05-13-2014, 09:05 PM - 2 Likes	#7
SpecialK Pentaxian Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: So California Photos: Gallery Posts: 16,481	I was called "a really good photographer" by a clairvoyant woman, based on the simple fact I had a camera and camera bag around my neck when I approached her group...

05-13-2014, 09:36 PM	#8
tahoejeepmom Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Tahoe Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 100	The camera is a tool. but not everyone knows how to use the tools right. That is like saying you have a nice paint brush and thats some really good oil paint. It takes an artist to use the tools to make art. Next time give the camera to the person and say here take some photos like I just did.

05-14-2014, 02:12 AM - 1 Like	#9
Imageman Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Photos: Albums Posts: 461	The sad thing is that person is largely right. Digital is killing the craft of photography. There was a time when it was not guaranteed that pictures would turn out. It took skill to get more than a few pictures that showed anything. Beginners would start to get exposures right, then focus, then composition. By the time you could see good photographs they had learned a whole lot about handling a camera. These days everybody is used to pointing a digital camera in the general direction of something interesting and being able to frame it on the rear screen. The shutter releases and they get a picture, it always turns out sharp, it always turns out well exposed, and it always shows what they wanted in the frame. With digital, everyone can successfully take a picture. So why would they think it takes any skill. If cars did what cameras do, you would sit in a car and it would drive you, you would do nothing except tell it where to take you, automatic everything. Sure those of us who know what we are doing use manual, but most photographers in this site and the rest of the world want automatic exposure, automatic focus, automatic shake reduction. The only thing left to any skill might be where the camera is pointed, but there are photographers take 700 images in a day rejecting 690 that were not pointed at something interesting and discovering quite by chance that 10 were. This is the photography of monkeys. I would suggest that in more than 99% of photographs taken today (im talking generally and not on this site) that look good, there is zero skill. Who can blame people for thinking the camera is the reason for the good photograph. What we face is, when someone looks at a well composed and well exposed image, viewers think "I could do that with my Iphone"

05-14-2014, 10:28 AM	#11
skid2964 Site Supporter Join Date: May 2008 Location: USA Posts: 614	I have heard the comments, "Wow, your pictures are sooo good, what kind of camera do you have? my DLSR doesnt make photos like that!" I agree this happens way too often but it seems to be diminishing somewhat. Why? because so many people went out and bought a fancy new DLSR and were very surprised to see that their photos were NOT good like those professional images they had seen. They leave it on "auto" overuse the pop-up flash.. have no clue what ISO is and forget about post-processing... They just want to be able to WiFi the images straight to Facebook...

05-14-2014, 10:33 AM	#12
GibbyTheMole Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Iowa Photos: Albums Posts: 2,275	Originally posted by Imageman These days everybody is used to pointing a digital camera in the general direction of something interesting and being able to frame it on the rear screen. The shutter releases and they get a picture, it always turns out sharp, it always turns out well exposed, and it always shows what they wanted in the frame. With digital, everyone can successfully take a picture. So why would they think it takes any skill. LOL... I've seen plenty of photos taken with digital cameras that would prove you wrong.

05-14-2014, 02:33 PM	#14
lytrytyr Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2011 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,310	Originally posted by Imageman The only thing left to any skill might be where the camera is pointed Not for long: "Autographer is a new type of camera which has been custom built to enable spontaneous, hands-free image capture. Its world leading technology includes a custom 136° eye view lens, an ultra small GPS unit and 5 in-built sensors. These sensors are fused by a sophisticated algorithm to tell the camera exactly the right moments to take photos." Home - Autographer - The World's First Wearable camera

05-14-2014, 07:34 PM	#15
scratchpaddy Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Phoenix Posts: 3,361 Original Poster	Originally posted by Imageman With digital, everyone can successfully take a picture. So why would they think it takes any skill. Anyone can take a picture, true. Successfully? Only if your definition of "success" excludes composition. That's still a critical part of a picture. Automagic mode can give you proper exposure, but it can't give you good lighting. The screen on the back can help you frame the picture, but it can't give you good framing. I know things were more challenging back in the day. I respect you for working through that. I was one of those "monkeys" you talk about, ten years ago, a kid with a PDA with a built-in 0.3 megapixel camera. The best way to learn is by making mistakes, and I made lots of mistakes. Sometimes hundreds of worthless pictures in a single day. Quantity over quality. But that's how I figured out what worked, and what didn't. It was easy, and it was fun. Photography is easy to pick up, easier than ever now, as you say, but hard to master. So lots of people are taking awful pictures. They're learning. I'm okay with that, as long as people understand that they're the main reason the pictures are good or bad, not the camera. Originally posted by lytrytyr Not for long: "Autographer is a new type of camera which has been custom built to enable spontaneous, hands-free image capture. Its world leading technology includes a custom 136° eye view lens, an ultra small GPS unit and 5 in-built sensors. These sensors are fused by a sophisticated algorithm to tell the camera exactly the right moments to take photos." Yeah... those things actually do scare me. Every picture taken is a learning experience, but only if you actually take the picture. Hopefully, it won't catch on. Hopefully.