[imaspy]

hi all

i had been considering rationalising my setup for a little while now - i just wondered if it was worth doing. given my current kit setup, i felt i wanted to go small. however, because of the smaller sensors, i was always a little bit worried about wide angle shooting, as this tends to be a good 50% of what i seem to shoot (travel/architecture etc). i'll start by posting the current setup:

K5 w/2 batteries
DA35 macro limited
18-135WR
FA50
DA 12-24
a Tammy 70-300 w/macro
pentax flash (forgotten which model right now)

the two lenses i use the most would be the 18-135 and the 12-24, which is basically my go-to kit when i travel as it covers everything.

i use the 50mm for occasional portrait stuff.

the DA35 is really my best buddy for playing with macro, and sometimes landscape or street, but to be honest i just don't use it that much.

the tamron was free from a friend, i suppose if i ever needed the reach it would come in handy, but it isn't the world's best 300mm


so that's the kit. and, i had long thought of switching to something like M4:3 or other similar formats.

i DID buy a Q when they were on sale at ted's for $169 w/the 01 prime, but at that time i couldnt justify having to quite different bodies, and i ended up giving it to a friend (she LOVES it!)

anyway, up until this point, i never entertained the thought of getting a Q because of the lack of good quality wide angle coverage, but i only just discovered that they have released the 08 wide zoom!!! so i have been thinking very hard about it over the last few days.

here is what i am thinking of doing, and the pros and cons. i know most of it is personal preference, however i wanted to get some thoughts from fellow pentaxians before i went pulling any triggers.

1. sell off existing kit, with perhaps the exception of the flash - could still come in handy?
2. buy a Q7. could get the q-s1, but i dont think any of the handful of differences between them would make it worth paying the premium of the newer model? any thoughts?
3. fill kit with 01 prime, 06 tele, and 08 wide zoom. most of the others are so cheap that they don't factor into the equation or i wouldnt want them. maybe the mount shield lens for the hell of it.
4. spare batteries, an accessory here or there

and here are what i think might be the pros and cons....

Pros for keeping the K-mount kit:
- wider array of lenses (though, really, am i ever going to?)
- weather sealed setup. this is probably the single biggest worry, as i like the moodiness and drama of shooting in wet weather or wintry conditions.
- better IQ; ability to upgrade to quite a number of different newer bodies whenever i get that itch....
- probably better ergonomics, insofar as the way the body seems to be moulded for my hands

Cons for keeping the K-mount kit:
- size. it's not that it's TOO big; i just think it'd be nice to have something really small, pretty much pocketable, for travel. it's also a lot more subtle than some big black imposing body and lens.
- weight. it's not that it's TOO heavy; it's just that it can get a little tiresome on the wrists sometimes.
- conspicuousness. having the larger body when travelling can say 'look, i'm a tourist! target me!'


Pros for switching to the Q-mount kit:
- size. small. stash in pocket, or in a bag with other stuff (as opposed to a single bag JUST for gear because it takes up so much room)
- weight. easy to lug, easy to operate and shoot even with one hand.
- main range that i shoot is covered by 3 lenses.
- would probably end up with a little cash in hand after all is said and done

Cons for switching to the Q-mount kit:
- limited range of lenses (again, not such a biggie)
- not weather-sealed. this is the biggest thing i guess.
- lower-performing in terms of IQ (sensor size) and burst (not such a big issue but i do use it from time to time), and DR? any comments on a Q7/Q-S1 vs APS-C for DR performance? how about speeds, eg. write to mem card?
- ergonomics; could be tricky to get used to everything being a lot smaller. as i said, i owned an original Q for a while, but didn't use it so much that i could get annoyed at anything that didn't feel right.

one final general guiding statement: video doesn't factor into it at all. i don't use video.

i think that's about it. if i think of anything else i will add it.

but, over to you guys? your thoughts or opinions about this situation would be greatly appreciated

[LensBeginner]

My personal, biased opinion?
K-01.

(A little bit) smaller, (a little bit) lighter, toy-looking enough not to be perceived as a "threat".
Goes in a fanny pack with a 18-55 or a nice 40mm XS.
If I were interested in wide I would invest in a 15mm ltd and have top quality in a tiny package.

You keep all your lenses, only buy a cheap used body and possibly a lens or two.

[officiousbystander]

I've been running a parallel M43 system with my Pentax for a few years. But my Lumix GF2 always played second fiddle to my K5. However a few weeks ago I picked up an Olympus EM5 for $A399 new, and it's just fantastic. I can go out with a 20mm, 45mm and 35-100mm zoom all in a little man bag (Tamrac Jazz 36) and it barely weighs anything. There was a big ANZAC commemoration parade (pre ANZAC day teaser) near me today and I charged up the K5 and reformatted the card. But as I walked out the door I grabbed the Olympus kit instead. Yes I felt like a traitor. I felt like wimp. But it was just so easy. The K5 still flogs the Olympus when it comes to viewfinder (of course), battery life, depth of field, intuitive controls and edges it in IQ. But that 5 axis stabilisation is just incredible for low light exposures. Sometimes instead of an extra lens I'll take the GR so I get APSC goodness when I want it (but only at one focal length). I've invested too much in the K mount to just let it languish. And I know the K5 + any Ltd lens combo just can't be beaten. So the dilemma is have we become such self-conscious weaklings that we can't carry a bigger camera to major event or tourist attraction? Or is there an enthusiast photography law of diminishing returns where choosing APSC over something like M43 doesn't always add up? This really doesn't answer the Q question because the compromises are different. But the overall issues are the same.

[Bagga_Txips]

If the K-01 is a viable option, as LensBeginner suggests, then the K-S1 is an even better option. I recently posted a shot of my lightweight kit, which consists of K-S1 body, DA21 ltd, DA70 ltd, and 40 XS. Total weight? Less than a kilo! And the results I get are better than from my K5.

The K-01 became an ignored classic, to the extent that here in China its price dropped then started to rise again as people realised its quality, and I think the K-S1 is going to experience the same process, so it's worth grabbing at a low price.

In fact, considering that it's closely approaching a price that is 50% of the cost of a K-S2, I am seriously considering getting a second one, especially if I can get a low-priced kit with the 16_85, for use on my K-5 when WR is needed.

[biz-engineer]

1. sell off existing kit, with perhaps the exception of the flash

Why would you not sell the flash if you don't plan to buy a full frame?

[wildman]

size. small. stash in pocket, or in a bag with other stuff (as opposed to a single bag JUST for gear because it takes up so much room)

Why not just buy a small camera in addition to your DSLR stuff?
I have a k5 and Canon S95. The Canon is so handy I can carry it with me even when I also have the k5 with me and not even notice it in my shirt pocket.
My guess is that you think the Q will give you a sort of miniaturized DSLR and it won't - you will still end up with a bag full of bits and pieces to lug around and a system that is nowhere near the quality, versatility or speed of a DSLR.

There's no free lunch.

[Neo_]

IMHO the Q is just not worth it considering price tag and finger nail sized sensor.
While considering the purchase myself for a while sick of cramming around my k5 even at work or shopping, I decided I needed something lighter, smaller and possibly pocket size.
The Q system just doesn't have the quality required to replace a DSLR, exacly as my powershot s90 doesn't.
I ended up pulling the trigger on a Sony alpha 5000, since the budget/features/overall performance seemed particularly favourable to start with a smaller system.
I couldn't be happier, I now concentrate much more on actually shooting pictures, I just enjoy it more.

[jimr-pdx]

I picked up one of the 'disposable' K-r bodies from Colorado auctioneers that stripped CRIS. It's essentially K-s1 size but has all the K-5 features (except for the DI-90 battery). I'd been trying to convince myself the K-s1 would do but this does better since I know the interface, and the 12Mpx sensor is only lessened by its sweet-16 successor. The shutter sounds like a guillotine but otherwise this throwback is great for smaller travel with K24/A50macro and a teleprime (or perhaps a 20-40 or that new 18-50?).

[Tony Belding]

I've been tempted by the Q many times, but have never gone for it. One thing that held me back was the lack of any viewfinder and the resulting difficulty in bright daylight. Yeah, I know there are ways to work around that. . . but other cameras don't require me to work around that!

The other thing is, there are body-and-lens combos in the Micro Four Thirds world now that compete with the Q on compactness. I already have an OM-D E-M5, so a compact body (albeit, lacking the built-in EVF) that could share lenses with it makes some sense.

[imaspy]

My personal, biased opinion?
K-01.

(A little bit) smaller, (a little bit) lighter, toy-looking enough not to be perceived as a "threat".
Goes in a fanny pack with a 18-55 or a nice 40mm XS.
If I were interested in wide I would invest in a 15mm ltd and have top quality in a tiny package.

You keep all your lenses, only buy a cheap used body and possibly a lens or two.

i like biased opinions however, for me, the size difference isn't quite worth it in this case.

However a few weeks ago I picked up an Olympus EM5 for $A399 new, and it's just fantastic.

wow - where did you score an EM5 for that price?!?!?!

Why would you not sell the flash if you don't plan to buy a full frame?

i dunno? why would i not want to use it with the q? whoops, answered my own question

Why not just buy a small camera in addition to your DSLR stuff?
I have a k5 and Canon S95. The Canon is so handy I can carry it with me even when I also have the k5 with me and not even notice it in my shirt pocket.
My guess is that you think the Q will give you a sort of miniaturized DSLR and it won't - you will still end up with a bag full of bits and pieces to lug around and a system that is nowhere near the quality, versatility or speed of a DSLR.

There's no free lunch.

well obviously i'm still going to end up with a bag of bits it's that the bits are smaller. noted though.

Get a Q7+01. Next add the 08 and 06, then don't look back. In addition, don't hesitate to invest a little time and energy in yourself. For example, commit the next six months to becoming a world-class post processor. It's easy to learn and a ton of fun, plus you'll vastly improve the quality of your GAS (Gear Acquisition Syndrome) decision making... could save you a ton of money, too. PP excellence aligns your stars in ways that will consistently gob-smock and dazzle your friends!

Also, may I suggest you quit thinking/obsessing about gear and get out... take more photographs. I bet during the time it took to write the opening post, several images could have been fine tuned, then shared for others to enjoy.

My 2 cents... M

post is no problem for me, i love it just as much as getting out and taking the photos. i was a graphic designer in a past work life so i have lots of mAd sKiLLz to dedicate to that.

IMHO the Q is just not worth it considering price tag and finger nail sized sensor.
While considering the purchase myself for a while sick of cramming around my k5 even at work or shopping, I decided I needed something lighter, smaller and possibly pocket size.
The Q system just doesn't have the quality required to replace a DSLR, exacly as my powershot s90 doesn't.
I ended up pulling the trigger on a Sony alpha 5000, since the budget/features/overall performance seemed particularly favourable to start with a smaller system.
I couldn't be happier, I now concentrate much more on actually shooting pictures, I just enjoy it more.

probably worth noting that i'm not a pro, and my photos are mainly for myself?

I've been tempted by the Q many times, but have never gone for it. One thing that held me back was the lack of any viewfinder and the resulting difficulty in bright daylight. Yeah, I know there are ways to work around that. . . but other cameras don't require me to work around that!

The other thing is, there are body-and-lens combos in the Micro Four Thirds world now that compete with the Q on compactness. I already have an OM-D E-M5, so a compact body (albeit, lacking the built-in EVF) that could share lenses with it makes some sense.

OH YES - that was the other thing - lack of OVF. i love viewfinders and that's the thing i suspect i would need the most getting used to.

thanks for the opinions all i might have a look at some other systems before i do anything rash.

[officiousbystander]

wow - where did you score an EM5 for that price?!?!?!

At Camera House in Broadway Shopping Centre but it was a crazy last chance old model clear out. I'd taken the kids to the movies and walked past the shop and there was the price in the window. The offer didn't even make it to their website. I imagine the cameras would have only lasted a couple of days at that price with just passing trade. BTW what I should have added in my initial comment was we're planning an Uluru holiday in July. For the big once in a lifetime bucket list landscapes I'll take the K5. When it comes to lifelong memories where best possible IQ is the bottom line the smaller sensors just aren't in the game.

[6BQ5]

I have a Q7 with the 01, 02, 03, and 06 lenses. It's a great little travel camera but it would never replace what my K-30 did or what my K-3 does. The small sensor works well but you need very good light. When you start climbing above ISO 400 IQ will drop significantly due to noise. You can still get very nice small sized prints but that could be limiting in some cases. The lenses are sharp if you can achieve good focus. I think a DSLR with phase detection focusing will always focus better and faster than what a Q7 does. The range of what the Q7 thinks is "in focus" seems rather loose too. Performance is another issue. The lag between shutter button pressing and shutter actuation is very noticeable. Forget about bursts, high frame rates, etc. You may miss shots.

Don't take all that as negative. The Q7 is a great little camera! I traveled with an original Q to the UK last winter while leaving my DSLR at home. It worked very well! Just understand that the Q system is completely different animal than a DSLR. It has own strengths and weaknesses like any other system. I went to the UK with my eyes wide open and fully aware of what I would be up against with what I had and I had a wonderful experience with the camera. It was great for street photography. My lens kit (didn't have the 06 back then) fit in a very small bag.

My advise would be don't switch. Complement instead. Running a K and Q system in parallel makes sense if you consider each system for different applications.

[Neo_]

It doesn't matter if you're not a pro, if you want dslr quality in a point and shoot format than an ILC is your answer my friend, not the Q. Sony, Fujy, Olympus,Samsung, whatever, they all manage to have great mirrorless cameras
Consider that my alpha 5000 is roughly the same size and price of a Q, but it as a 20mp Aps-c sensor coupled with Bionz X processor, and it comes in kit with a pancake 16-50 (24-75eq.) that, while not stellar in performance, is pretty enjoyable as a street zoom lens. An Ilc can't do everything a dslr does, but it can do most. I'd consider something in the entry level range like the Samsung nx3000, Fuji xa, Sony alpha 5000 and similar..
If I was willing to invest serious money especially on lenses I'd point on fuji, hands down the best name in the game.

[imaspy]

interesting opinions, thanks for that guys. my main thing about any system other than aps-c DSLR is the ability to shoot properly wide.... i will need to do some poking around at different systems and the available lenses.

6BQ5 - the idea to compliment rather than replace is a common-sense conclusion, but i was interested in the possibility of replacing and am investigating that first

thanks!