How to judge camera reviews

mohb · 09-02-2015, 02:52 PM

I've just read a review of the new Sony and though it told me countless times how 'wonderful' 'the greatest' 'magnificent' it was I was none the wiser on how it's overall performance as a camera was. It's all very well quoting DXO figures and DR etc. but what's it like as a camera that you will use on a regular basis for at least a couple of years. I want a camera that I like as a piece of equipment because it's been designed for the photographer and not a technician in a lab.

**UncleVanya** · 09-02-2015, 02:59 PM

How to judge..."with great scepticism and yet an open mind". It's hard to read reviews without wondering what agenda is at play. It's hard to know what level of expertise is employed and if the methods are sound and if the copy is any good. Mostly I just read lots of them and then hope that someone I know (online or otherwise) has an informed first hand opinion.

**jatrax** · 09-02-2015, 03:14 PM - **3 Likes**

Originally posted by UncleVanya

How to judge..."with great scepticism and yet an open mind". It's hard to read reviews without wondering what agenda is at play. It's hard to know what level of expertise is employed and if the methods are sound and if the copy is any good.

+1.

I mostly assume any camera made today will take pictures far beyond my abilities so I'm just interested in things that are hard to quantify. Like how does it fit in my hand, are the buttons responsive and placed well. Beyond that kind of stuff, well if an extra 1/2 stop of DR is important to you then I guess look at the technical reviews. For me I'll never be good enough to see the difference anyway.

Adam · 09-02-2015, 03:15 PM

Good reviews are those with little to no bias that offer a fair ground for establishing a comparison with similar products by offering a thorough analysis of the product at hand.

Excessive references to external tests, a lack of demonstrated knowledge of the camera system as a whole, and/or an imbalance of technical and real-world tests would all be warning signs.

Adam
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**mwilky55** · 09-02-2015, 03:51 PM

Originally posted by jatrax

+1.

I mostly assume any camera made today will take pictures far beyond my abilities so I'm just interested in things that are hard to quantify. Like how does it fit in my hand, are the buttons responsive and placed well. Beyond that kind of stuff, well if an extra 1/2 stop of DR is important to you then I guess look at the technical reviews. For me I'll never be good enough to see the difference anyway.

+1 jatrax....appreciate your honesty and should confess that the capability of my equipment exceeds my skill by a good measure....it's a little analogous to mastering software....I can do quite a few things in Word, but I'm sure there's 80% functionality I still don't know

DeadJohn · 09-02-2015, 04:21 PM

Try to find at least 3 camera reviews before committing. Pay attention to what the reviewer liked and disliked about the camera; that's more important than whether the review says "best camera ever". Even a glowing review should mention some quirks and areas for improvement.

Consider the reviewer's photography style. A bunch of great landscape examples don't help if you mostly shoot portraits.

A new camera might not have a lot of details about the user interface. Comments about prior models in the same line can be helpful because manufacturers often keep the same general menu system and button layout.

alamo5000 · 09-02-2015, 05:56 PM

I bought my first DSLR (Pentax) based on nothing but reviews. I had never owned a 'real' camera (except a point and shoot) and had never seen a Pentax is real life. But I read as many reviews as I could get my hands on and ultimately made the decision to buy an original K5 based on a bunch of reading. With that in mind reviews do impact the brand for good and for bad even if they are very biased around previous loyalties or whatever.

Now that I have some photography under my belt (I am still very much a novice) but I am not a complete noob. Long story short I am able to sort of parse through a lot of the bias that some people have. That said I don't read many reviews to honest.

1. My general feeling is to be very skeptical of people who have an over bearing amount of technical data.
2. About 90% of the time it really is all about the shooting experience. IE being user friendly etc.
3. You cannot talk about a camera without talking about it's lenses. People are making big bucks selling bodies, but lenses make the image more than the camera does.
4. Know what you want to do. "This camera sucks for video"... great. Now so what. I have turned on the video mode once to see if it works and that's about it. Does the information even apply? That said if you shoot video for fun, pay attention. Or if you shoot sports, pay attention to the AF comments, or whatever it is that you do.
5. Know that the most bad-ass, big time, $20,000 dollar medium format, 50,000 megapixel camera will not make a photographer out of anyone.

I can carry on with this list.

btnapa · 09-02-2015, 06:19 PM

Originally posted by mohb

I've just read a review of the new Sony and though it told me countless times how 'wonderful' 'the greatest' 'magnificent' it was I was none the wiser on how it's overall performance as a camera was. It's all very well quoting DXO figures and DR etc. but what's it like as a camera that you will use on a regular basis for at least a couple of years. I want a camera that I like as a piece of equipment because it's been designed for the photographer and not a technician in a lab.

There is always an agenda. It is hard to judge because you don't know what the reviewer's motives are. I agree with @jatrax. There are all the intangibles which come into play which reviews may not adequately communicate. I remember one of the threads a while back. Someone was saying that there are really no bad cameras out there today in terms of image quality. I tend to agree with that premise. So beyond the hard specs. it comes down to the intangibles.

With that said, I think the reviews on this forum happen to be on the critical side and a little harsh on our own beloved Pentax equipment. For instance I have the FA 43 Limited lens and in my book it is a 10. Well not really but I think it deserves a lot better score than 8.0 given by this site. Seeing all the relatively low scores for most of the Pentax gear, I am kinda bummed out. But by the same token, I know someone is being extra critical and that is a good thing. If it scores an 8.0 on this site then I know it is a lot better than the score indicates. Unlike other sites giving various gear high marks just because they can or they are serving an agenda.

stevebrot · 09-02-2015, 06:29 PM

Originally posted by mohb

It's all very well quoting DXO figures

Ignore those aspects of a review that quote or rely on comparative scoring.

Steve

reeftool · 09-02-2015, 07:20 PM

Originally posted by jatrax

+1.

I mostly assume any camera made today will take pictures far beyond my abilities so I'm just interested in things that are hard to quantify. Like how does it fit in my hand, are the buttons responsive and placed well. Beyond that kind of stuff, well if an extra 1/2 stop of DR is important to you then I guess look at the technical reviews. For me I'll never be good enough to see the difference anyway.

Yep, I think every DSLR out there is capable of awesome photos. I look at ergonomics and controls also. Dials that are easy to operate, buttons that are convenient. Since I do a lot of shooting outdoors in the winter, I want a camera that I can operate with gloves on. I hate menus. I really, really hate going into the menu to change any settings and if a common setting l use a lot requires me to scroll through a menu, I won't buy that camera no matter what the reviewers say about it. For ergonomics, my favorite was the K10D. It fit my hands nicely. My K5 has some better features but the body is a little small for my hands and I don't like lock button on the mode dial because I can't operate it with gloves on. That said, I still like the K5 overall. All this means you really have to have a hands on experience with the camera before buying it. My K10D came from a B&M store. I got to try out a friends K5 before I bought mine.

wildman · 09-02-2015, 08:04 PM

Originally posted by mohb

I want a camera that I like as a piece of equipment because it's been designed for the photographer and not a technician in a lab.

We would be ahead if it was designed for a tech. As it is I think a camera, like cars, are designed primarily by marketing.

Originally posted by mohb

How to judge camera reviews

How to review a review of a camera - what's wrong with this logic?

**UncleVanya** · 09-02-2015, 08:20 PM

Originally posted by reeftool

My K5 has some better features but the body is a little small for my hands and I don't like lock button on the mode dial because I can't operate it with gloves on. That said, I still like the K5 overall. All this means you really have to have a hands on experience with the camera before buying it. My K10D came from a B&M store. I got to try out a friends K5 before I bought mine.

On the K3 the mode dial lock is selectable. You can turn it off - is that not the case with the K5?

**jatrax** · 09-02-2015, 08:41 PM

Originally posted by UncleVanya

On the K3 the mode dial lock is selectable. You can turn it off - is that not the case with the K5?

No, that was a change on the k-3. A welcome one IMHO.

hks_kansei · 09-02-2015, 09:02 PM

To be honest, I just skim reviews since there are so many variables.

If you are looking for a body with a kit lens, then they are relevant (since that's what they test) but who's to know that a body doesn't just score badly because the kit lens sucks?

I usually just read the specs from the manufacturer, look at maybe a few example pics for colour rendition etc, and then find one in a shop and have a play.

Ergonomics and ease of use are a big thing for me, I want to take photos, not set the clock on a VCR.

An example is that two friends of mine, one has a Nikon something, and another a Canon something.
Both cameras apparently score well in tests for their time.

The Nikon I picked up and instantly worked out the controls and took a few shots. I quite liked it, pity it's not Kmount :P
The Canon I picked up and found that every button was in a strange place, even the on/off button. 20mins and I still couldn't find how to change the aperture.

I should probably add though that I havent bought a DSLR since my *istDS..... and even that I bought secondhand.

**Rondec** · 09-03-2015, 02:55 AM

I basically skim the narrative and look at the pros and cons that are listed. Sometimes you can tell that the writer has just copied and pasted, either from previous reviews of the brand or from press releases regarding the camera. Those sorts of reviews are pretty worthless in my opinion.

The reality is that most cameras are really good these days and so review sites end up nit picking to find cons. For a very long time, DP Review focused on Pentax's lack of a dedicated video button. Fine, if you like to use video, but if you are buying a camera to shoot stills, probably not a big deal.

The hardest part is telling if a reviewer has a particular system that they like best -- many seem to like the lay out of Canon or Nikon cameras and compare everything to their favorite camera, at least subconsciously.

09-02-2015, 02:52 PM	#1
mohb Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Photos: Albums Posts: 1,912	How to judge camera reviews I've just read a review of the new Sony and though it told me countless times how 'wonderful' 'the greatest' 'magnificent' it was I was none the wiser on how it's overall performance as a camera was. It's all very well quoting DXO figures and DR etc. but what's it like as a camera that you will use on a regular basis for at least a couple of years. I want a camera that I like as a piece of equipment because it's been designed for the photographer and not a technician in a lab.

09-02-2015, 06:19 PM	#8
btnapa Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 1,614	Originally posted by mohb I've just read a review of the new Sony and though it told me countless times how 'wonderful' 'the greatest' 'magnificent' it was I was none the wiser on how it's overall performance as a camera was. It's all very well quoting DXO figures and DR etc. but what's it like as a camera that you will use on a regular basis for at least a couple of years. I want a camera that I like as a piece of equipment because it's been designed for the photographer and not a technician in a lab. There is always an agenda. It is hard to judge because you don't know what the reviewer's motives are. I agree with @jatrax. There are all the intangibles which come into play which reviews may not adequately communicate. I remember one of the threads a while back. Someone was saying that there are really no bad cameras out there today in terms of image quality. I tend to agree with that premise. So beyond the hard specs. it comes down to the intangibles. With that said, I think the reviews on this forum happen to be on the critical side and a little harsh on our own beloved Pentax equipment. For instance I have the FA 43 Limited lens and in my book it is a 10. Well not really but I think it deserves a lot better score than 8.0 given by this site. Seeing all the relatively low scores for most of the Pentax gear, I am kinda bummed out. But by the same token, I know someone is being extra critical and that is a good thing. If it scores an 8.0 on this site then I know it is a lot better than the score indicates. Unlike other sites giving various gear high marks just because they can or they are serving an agenda. Last edited by btnapa; 09-02-2015 at 06:22 PM. Reason: text

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09-02-2015, 02:59 PM	#2
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,385	How to judge..."with great scepticism and yet an open mind". It's hard to read reviews without wondering what agenda is at play. It's hard to know what level of expertise is employed and if the methods are sound and if the copy is any good. Mostly I just read lots of them and then hope that someone I know (online or otherwise) has an informed first hand opinion.

09-02-2015, 03:14 PM - 3 Likes	#3
jatrax Site Supporter Join Date: May 2010 Location: Washington Cascades Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,991	Originally posted by UncleVanya How to judge..."with great scepticism and yet an open mind". It's hard to read reviews without wondering what agenda is at play. It's hard to know what level of expertise is employed and if the methods are sound and if the copy is any good. +1. I mostly assume any camera made today will take pictures far beyond my abilities so I'm just interested in things that are hard to quantify. Like how does it fit in my hand, are the buttons responsive and placed well. Beyond that kind of stuff, well if an extra 1/2 stop of DR is important to you then I guess look at the technical reviews. For me I'll never be good enough to see the difference anyway.

09-02-2015, 03:15 PM	#4
Adam Administrator Site Webmaster Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Arizona Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 51,593	Good reviews are those with little to no bias that offer a fair ground for establishing a comparison with similar products by offering a thorough analysis of the product at hand. Excessive references to external tests, a lack of demonstrated knowledge of the camera system as a whole, and/or an imbalance of technical and real-world tests would all be warning signs. Adam PentaxForums.com Webmaster (Site Usage Guide \| Site Help \| My Photography) PentaxForums.com server and development costs are user-supported. You can help cover these costs by donating or purchasing one of our Pentax eBooks. Or, buy your photo gear from our affiliates, Adorama, B&H Photo, KEH, or Topaz Labs, and get FREE Marketplace access - click here to see how! Trusted Pentax retailers:

09-02-2015, 03:51 PM	#5
mwilky55 Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Southeastern Connecticut Photos: Albums Posts: 816	Originally posted by jatrax +1. I mostly assume any camera made today will take pictures far beyond my abilities so I'm just interested in things that are hard to quantify. Like how does it fit in my hand, are the buttons responsive and placed well. Beyond that kind of stuff, well if an extra 1/2 stop of DR is important to you then I guess look at the technical reviews. For me I'll never be good enough to see the difference anyway. +1 jatrax....appreciate your honesty and should confess that the capability of my equipment exceeds my skill by a good measure....it's a little analogous to mastering software....I can do quite a few things in Word, but I'm sure there's 80% functionality I still don't know

09-02-2015, 04:21 PM	#6
DeadJohn Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: New York Posts: 4,833	Try to find at least 3 camera reviews before committing. Pay attention to what the reviewer liked and disliked about the camera; that's more important than whether the review says "best camera ever". Even a glowing review should mention some quirks and areas for improvement. Consider the reviewer's photography style. A bunch of great landscape examples don't help if you mostly shoot portraits. A new camera might not have a lot of details about the user interface. Comments about prior models in the same line can be helpful because manufacturers often keep the same general menu system and button layout.

09-02-2015, 05:56 PM	#7
alamo5000 Pentaxian Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 2,962	I bought my first DSLR (Pentax) based on nothing but reviews. I had never owned a 'real' camera (except a point and shoot) and had never seen a Pentax is real life. But I read as many reviews as I could get my hands on and ultimately made the decision to buy an original K5 based on a bunch of reading. With that in mind reviews do impact the brand for good and for bad even if they are very biased around previous loyalties or whatever. Now that I have some photography under my belt (I am still very much a novice) but I am not a complete noob. Long story short I am able to sort of parse through a lot of the bias that some people have. That said I don't read many reviews to honest. 1. My general feeling is to be very skeptical of people who have an over bearing amount of technical data. 2. About 90% of the time it really is all about the shooting experience. IE being user friendly etc. 3. You cannot talk about a camera without talking about it's lenses. People are making big bucks selling bodies, but lenses make the image more than the camera does. 4. Know what you want to do. "This camera sucks for video"... great. Now so what. I have turned on the video mode once to see if it works and that's about it. Does the information even apply? That said if you shoot video for fun, pay attention. Or if you shoot sports, pay attention to the AF comments, or whatever it is that you do. 5. Know that the most bad-ass, big time, $20,000 dollar medium format, 50,000 megapixel camera will not make a photographer out of anyone. I can carry on with this list.

09-02-2015, 06:29 PM	#9
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by mohb It's all very well quoting DXO figures Ignore those aspects of a review that quote or rely on comparative scoring. Steve

09-02-2015, 07:20 PM	#10
reeftool Pentaxian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Upstate New York Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,553	Originally posted by jatrax +1. I mostly assume any camera made today will take pictures far beyond my abilities so I'm just interested in things that are hard to quantify. Like how does it fit in my hand, are the buttons responsive and placed well. Beyond that kind of stuff, well if an extra 1/2 stop of DR is important to you then I guess look at the technical reviews. For me I'll never be good enough to see the difference anyway. Yep, I think every DSLR out there is capable of awesome photos. I look at ergonomics and controls also. Dials that are easy to operate, buttons that are convenient. Since I do a lot of shooting outdoors in the winter, I want a camera that I can operate with gloves on. I hate menus. I really, really hate going into the menu to change any settings and if a common setting l use a lot requires me to scroll through a menu, I won't buy that camera no matter what the reviewers say about it. For ergonomics, my favorite was the K10D. It fit my hands nicely. My K5 has some better features but the body is a little small for my hands and I don't like lock button on the mode dial because I can't operate it with gloves on. That said, I still like the K5 overall. All this means you really have to have a hands on experience with the camera before buying it. My K10D came from a B&M store. I got to try out a friends K5 before I bought mine.

09-02-2015, 08:04 PM	#11
wildman Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Flyover America Posts: 4,469	Originally posted by mohb I want a camera that I like as a piece of equipment because it's been designed for the photographer and not a technician in a lab. We would be ahead if it was designed for a tech. As it is I think a camera, like cars, are designed primarily by marketing. Originally posted by mohb How to judge camera reviews How to review a review of a camera - what's wrong with this logic?

09-02-2015, 08:20 PM	#12
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,385	Originally posted by reeftool My K5 has some better features but the body is a little small for my hands and I don't like lock button on the mode dial because I can't operate it with gloves on. That said, I still like the K5 overall. All this means you really have to have a hands on experience with the camera before buying it. My K10D came from a B&M store. I got to try out a friends K5 before I bought mine. On the K3 the mode dial lock is selectable. You can turn it off - is that not the case with the K5?

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09-02-2015, 08:41 PM	#13
jatrax Site Supporter Join Date: May 2010 Location: Washington Cascades Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,991	Originally posted by UncleVanya On the K3 the mode dial lock is selectable. You can turn it off - is that not the case with the K5? No, that was a change on the k-3. A welcome one IMHO.

09-02-2015, 09:02 PM	#14
hks_kansei Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 834	To be honest, I just skim reviews since there are so many variables. If you are looking for a body with a kit lens, then they are relevant (since that's what they test) but who's to know that a body doesn't just score badly because the kit lens sucks? I usually just read the specs from the manufacturer, look at maybe a few example pics for colour rendition etc, and then find one in a shop and have a play. Ergonomics and ease of use are a big thing for me, I want to take photos, not set the clock on a VCR. An example is that two friends of mine, one has a Nikon something, and another a Canon something. Both cameras apparently score well in tests for their time. The Nikon I picked up and instantly worked out the controls and took a few shots. I quite liked it, pity it's not Kmount :P The Canon I picked up and found that every button was in a strange place, even the on/off button. 20mins and I still couldn't find how to change the aperture. I should probably add though that I havent bought a DSLR since my *istDS..... and even that I bought secondhand.

09-03-2015, 02:55 AM	#15
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,650	I basically skim the narrative and look at the pros and cons that are listed. Sometimes you can tell that the writer has just copied and pasted, either from previous reviews of the brand or from press releases regarding the camera. Those sorts of reviews are pretty worthless in my opinion. The reality is that most cameras are really good these days and so review sites end up nit picking to find cons. For a very long time, DP Review focused on Pentax's lack of a dedicated video button. Fine, if you like to use video, but if you are buying a camera to shoot stills, probably not a big deal. The hardest part is telling if a reviewer has a particular system that they like best -- many seem to like the lay out of Canon or Nikon cameras and compare everything to their favorite camera, at least subconsciously.