[sholtzma]

So, can you complain to the venue about the photographers/videographers that "come with" the place? Or are they under pressure to get some shots whether they are wanted or not?

[Gimbal]

I can understand the video crew as well, here they where payed to do a video of the wedding and they where going all in with 4 guys to do the best job they possible could. And then having every shoot ruined by a super important photographer constantly running in an out of the frame paying no attention to anything except his own work. I mean you are pissed off but at least you got the pictures. I wonder how they feel, they got home with a video of a photographer.

I could be wrong though.

[honey bo bo]

Zafar You have to grow some to protect your livelyhood. This wedding shoot is not one of those politically correct bullshoot sessions that you have to accommodate everyone in the building.You were paid big money and were expected to produce your best candids ever according to your comments from the Client so do it ! If you want to stay in the business then dont let others involved in the wedding money tree to influence your product quality!!!
I was 6' 3" 250 lbs and even the cook had to ask my premission to serve the meal ! I had no problem seeking out those memorable shots once in a wedding day candid shoots and my reputation remained intact!

[pathdoc]

I think he did actually get the shots he wanted despite the interference. But reading his account, it seems there was little else he could have done short of beating the others unconscious with their own equipment, and that was not a reasonable option.

[monochrome]

A wedding is decidedly not about the Bride and Groom. "A wedding is a set-piece drama designed to force together two groups of antagonists, under circumstances outside their control, with the intent to ascertain how they behave under pressure." ~ my brother-in-law.

[Zafar Iqbal]

I wonder if anyone spoke to the videographers in advance of the event? If they were surprised to learn their work was lower priority, that might explain their rude behavior. That does not excuse their behavior just helps to understand it.

They didn't and even on the day, the couple didn't know there was going to be 4, only an hour or so before we were supposed to be at the venue. I'm certain I wasn't told about either even though I always try hard to explain that good communication is vital.

They were jumpy from the very beginning, even before I took or was about to take my very first shot - what they argued about and how they argued puzzled me at the time, but I'm pretty sure now, it was because they were offended.

For most part of the day, "they" was just a single guy talking/arguing.

I can understand the video crew as well, here they where payed to do a video of the wedding and they where going all in with 4 guys to do the best job they possible could. And then having every shoot ruined by a super important photographer constantly running in an out of the frame paying no attention to anything except his own work. I mean you are pissed off but at least you got the pictures. I wonder how they feel, they got home with a video of a photographer.

I could be wrong though.

I can understand that as well, and I'm no different when I'm occasionally told video is of such importance, that I have to pay attention to it, however I suck it up and still do my job the best way I can within the limitations I have and I recognize, that photo related obstacles aren't the same when it comes to video. With video you often can't just move like photographers can.

With that being said - having seen some of their work, I can't see that being the main cause for the problem. They have videos with planned shots from locations and have their own people clearly visible in the frame quiet often. That's the easiest thing they could have fixed.

At the wedding, that was the very first issue with them, and I wasn't shooting yet. That one guy just started arguing rather than saying "hey, we are doing this and that, and we'd like if other people don't show up in the video, so could you please move, go away or whatever". In fact, I first didn't want to join them as I could see from distance, that the video guys were working. I only went after I was asked for several times.

The brides brother and another photographer of theirs was there too, both standing close to the couple, but nothing was said to them.

I could go on, but this should be sufficient to illustrate how they were. I will point out though, that they had 2 cameras on tripods at 2+ meters height, and 2 handheld at the venue. The handheld were they ones most active, and the ones I could have had the most incidents with, but we had none, including when they used flycam to do long swift recordings.

Zafar You have to grow some to protect your livelyhood. This wedding shoot is not one of those politically correct bullshoot sessions that you have to accommodate everyone in the building.You were paid big money and were expected to produce your best candids ever according to your comments from the Client so do it ! If you want to stay in the business then dont let others involved in the wedding money tree to influence your product quality!!!
I was 6' 3" 250 lbs and even the cook had to ask my premission to serve the meal ! I had no problem seeking out those memorable shots once in a wedding day candid shoots and my reputation remained intact!

I completely agree and if you dig back enough in this forum, you'll find posts with me writing about how troublesome it was to photograph strangers and issues with being self-conscious etc. That was some years ago and I've grown a lot since then, but I agree, there is room for a lot more growth.

---------- Post added 27-12-15 at 17:05 ----------

So, can you complain to the venue about the photographers/videographers that "come with" the place? Or are they under pressure to get some shots whether they are wanted or not?

I thought about this but in my opinion it would be best if the complaint came from the couple themselves.

I don't think they are under pressure. I've often experienced, that even when the venue people are asked to stay home, they turn up anyways, or that they were supposed to be a fixed number, but bring along other colleges, trainees and whatnot, without asking the couple first.

I mentioned earlier there is no deduction in price, so if someone is asked to stay home, the venue will keep the money - I think some disregard the couples wishes so they can score that money - and bring along unrelated people, in case they get bored.

I do not know this for a fact, but I find it very puzzling, that someone shows up when they had been told not to do so.

[Digitalis]

A wedding is decidedly not about the Bride and Groom. "A wedding is a set-piece drama designed to force together two groups of antagonists, under circumstances outside their control, with the intent to ascertain how they behave under pressure." ~ my brother-in-law.

In Yoda speak: A set piece a wedding is, antagonistic are the two groups who the force brings together, outside of their control circumstances will be, and under great pressure: civilized they will be expected to behave. A farce it is, merely an attempt to understand the durability of expensive glassware and china. Break your faith in humanity it will, if persist in your choice to document these events: forever dominate your destiny it will.

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Last edited by Digitalis; 12-27-2015 at 09:21 AM.

[honey bo bo]

I completely agree and if you dig back enough in this forum, you'll find posts with me writing about how troublesome it was to photograph strangers and issues with being self-conscious etc. That was some years ago and I've grown a lot since then, but I agree, there is room for a lot more growth.

Good luck with your future endevours! And remember if there is a once in a life time candid and 90 year old Grandma is in the way with her box camera and gun powder flash; gently push her out of the way and take the damn shot!

[Zafar Iqbal]

Good luck with your future endevours! And remember if there is a once in a life time candid and 90 year old Grandma is in the way with her box camera and gun powder flash; gently push her out of the way and take the damn shot!

[Davidparis]

In Yoda speak: A set piece a wedding is, antagonistic are the two groups who the force brings together, outside of their control circumstances will be, and under great pressure: civilized they will be expected to behave. A farce it is, merely an attempt to understand the durability of expensive glassware and china. Break your faith in humanity it will, if persist in your choice to document these events: forever dominate your destiny it will.

Nice one.

[Driline]

That's a rather unfair dismissal of an entire art form.

Well, if my 17 years of work in major television broadcast taught me anything, it was that any trained ape can point and shoot a video camera. I know because I had to on several occasions when our videographers were not available. ( I was an engineer at the time). Over the years most broadcast stations removed the video photographers in the studio and replaced them with pan tilt zoom cameras operated by assistant producers in the control room. We got rid of half a dozen camera operators that way. (Broadcasting is Brutal). As time went on videographers were replaced in the news department with reporters shooting their own stuff by themselves. Stand ups were a problem but the higher ups didn't care. When I left we had one videographer left for an entire newsroom. And this was a top 100 market. So yea.....I may have a jaded opinion on the subject

[forest_bear59]

Photography was explicitely named the primary media for this wedding. Period. So what to argue about?

I can understand, that the video crew also wanted to give a 100% of their power, and felt restricted by others getting in their way. The same is true for the photographer ...
So either noone can give full 100% or one is reduced to less than ... say 75% ... which will damage his/hers pride. Combine this with the fact, that afterwards only the result counts and not the hindering circumstances - even if the couple said something else and you see the dilemma.

I think the mistake or how you call it happened before when the wedding was planned. They meant to do it good when engaging two creators of media, but it was poorly coordinated.

So each one will justify his point of view ... and feel frustrated at the same time.