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04-20-2016, 06:26 AM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by dsmithhfx Quote
To obtain a more balanced view of some military and geopolitical aspects of the Vietnam conflicts, suggest you begin by reading The Military Art of Peoples War by General Vo Nguyen Giap.
The identity of the author suggests this is hardly a balanced view. (ETA at least not in the sense of being impartial)

04-20-2016, 06:29 AM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by pathdoc Quote
The identity of the author suggests this is hardly a balanced view.
Indeed, nor did I claim it was.
04-20-2016, 06:30 AM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by pathdoc Quote
The identity of the author suggests this is hardly a balanced view.
Absolutely!

Giap's admirable in some ways (and you can see him chatting relaxedly during dinner with his onetime enemy Robert McFarlane in Errol Morris' "Fog of War") but he was a true communist propagandist back in the day! 😀
04-20-2016, 06:33 AM - 1 Like   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
Absolutely!

Giap's admirable in some ways (and you can see him chatting relaxedly with his onetime enemy Robert McFarlane in Errol Morris' "Fog of War") but he was a true communist propagandist back in the day! ��
The point is, if we in the West want to obtain a more balanced view -- and perhaps we don't -- then we should listen to the other. Only by doing this can we avoid catastrophic errors like Vietnam (and Iraq and Afghanistan ad nauseum).

04-20-2016, 06:34 AM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by dsmithhfx Quote
The point is, if we in the West want to obtain a more balanced view -- and perhaps we don't -- then we should listen to the other.
Well, I agree with that. (Thumbup)

04-20-2016, 06:35 AM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by dsmithhfx Quote
The point is, if we in the West want to obtain a more balanced view -- and perhaps we don't -- then we should listen to the other. Only by doing this can we avoid catastrophic errors like Vietnam (and Iraq and Afghanistan ad nauseum).
True. But its also a 2-way street. Its o.k. to pet the tiger until it eats you.
04-20-2016, 06:40 AM - 2 Likes   #37
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An interesting book on the ambiguity of photography and its political use and abuse is Errol Morris's Believing is Seeing.

04-20-2016, 06:43 AM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
Its o.k. to pet the tiger until it eats you.
Petting a tiger is ill-advised. Punching it and hitting it with sticks is suicidal.
04-20-2016, 06:47 AM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by Thagomizer Quote
An interesting book on the ambiguity of photography and its political use and abuse is Errol Morris's Believing is Seeing.
There's that guy again. Check out his 'First Person' TV series if you haven't seen it, Thagomizer.

04-20-2016, 07:55 AM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
The U.S. wasn't kicked out. The U.S. pulled their troops out in '73. There only a few hundred U.S. troops in South Vietnam in 1975 when the cease fire was violated by the Soviet backed North Vietnamese army.
Yeah,tactical withdrawal due to the American public getting fed up with the high rate of losses and injuries.Defeat by any other name!

---------- Post added 04-20-16 at 03:57 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by pathdoc Quote
If you're going to be honest, you should admit the MASSIVE material and technological help they had from the USSR.
Yes,they should have fought fair and only used the weapons they'd taken off the French or could cobble together themselves
04-20-2016, 08:02 AM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Funny how articles like this are as opinionated and polarizing as the original accounts, and still raising issues best left alone. They were not resolved in the past, because the can't be. Nothing is to be gained by revisiting them.
While I agree with many of your points, this last one I disagree with. I think the article is quite interesting and instructive. That some want to turn it into a propaganda piece that validates their fixed and uninformed opinion is unfortunate. It is also unavoidable.
04-20-2016, 08:02 AM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by pathdoc Quote
The identity of the author suggests this is hardly a balanced view. (ETA at least not in the sense of being impartial)
Most histories are written by the victor.
04-20-2016, 08:11 AM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
The U.S. wasn't kicked out. The U.S. pulled their troops out in '73. There only a few hundred U.S. troops in South Vietnam in 1975 when the cease fire was violated by the Soviet backed North Vietnamese army.
The U.S. had up to 250,000 men in Vietnam and never accomplished their objective. SO, this is like saying, I quit before he fired me. And you re still arguing the politics of the war, in violation of forum policy.
04-20-2016, 08:14 AM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
The U.S. had up to 250,000 men in Vietnam and never accomplished their objective. SO, this is like saying, I quit before he fired me. And you re still arguing the politics of the war, in violation of forum policy.
No, Norm. I stated a fact about the number of troops in South Vietnam in 1975 when the offensive occurred that resulted in the fall of Saigon. It was in the hundreds. The U.S. pulled years before following the UN cease fire. I didn't in any way state my opinion about U.S. involvement in the U.N. policing action.
04-20-2016, 08:18 AM   #45
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Eddie Adams and Hugh van Es are a couple of my favorite photographers. Those guys could have gotten getting some of there images. Es even slipped over the border and go some legendary images of the Soviets rolling into Afghanistan.

Eddie Adams had discussed how is images of the ones referred to in the OP were taken out of context.

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