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10-29-2016, 10:09 AM   #1
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No more "Travel Photography" or "Photo Safaris" for me...

For about 20 years now, I've made brief photo visits to locations that had beautiful scenery (e.g. Grand Canyon, Antelope Canyon, famous lighthouses, Moraine Lake in Canada, Monument Valley Arizona, Oak Alley Louisianna, Autumn colors in Vermont/New Hampshire, Cherry blossoms in Washington DC, Sea Stacks at Bandon Oregon, etc. etc.). I took mostly the same photographs that thousands of others before me had taken.

I fooled myself into believing that somehow, my photos were unique and better than those taken by others of these same subjects. But, my dismal lack of print sales of these images has made me realize that I was wrong - my images (while technically good) were not any more special than the thousands of images that preceded mine.

How could I have ever have thought that in a few days in Hawaii (for example), I could capture better images than the many photographers who actually live in Hawaii and shoot images there 24/7, 365 days a year there? I couldn't hope to capture images in a few short days that rival the images these local photographers (many of whom have photo equipment at least as good, or better, than mine) take.

While I'm not going to be giving up photography, from now on, I will be focusing all of my photography closer to home (Northern Wisconsin, USA). I've canceled my upcoming trip to Iceland...

I'm surprised it took me so long to reach this conclusion. I could have saved lots of time and money by just studying the famous artists and photographers of yesteryear and seen that most of them focused their creative energies in their own "backyards" (i.e. local areas).


Last edited by Fenwoodian; 10-29-2016 at 10:22 AM.
10-29-2016, 10:33 AM - 1 Like   #2
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True but you have experienced the local. Something that a photograph can never give you. Sometimes you just have to put that camera down and enjoy the trip
10-29-2016, 10:34 AM   #3
amp
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I don't know you nor have I seen any of your images, but it sounds like you're being a bit too critical of yourself. No sense in cancelling a trip to an exotic place because you believe your photos aren't up to par with local masters. Just my $.02
10-29-2016, 10:39 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by amp Quote
I don't know you nor have I seen any of your images, but it sounds like you're being a bit too critical of yourself. No sense in cancelling a trip to an exotic place because you believe your photos aren't up to par with local masters. Just my $.02
Everyone has their own reason for doing photography. My goal is to shoot a single image that is unique, special, considered a piece of art, displayed in a museum, and lives beyond me. So far, none of my images have reached that goal.

So, I only shoot RAW and use the best technique I can because the next image might be "the one".

Taking "I was there" shots have no appeal to me.

---------- Post added 10-29-16 at 12:44 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by thazooo Quote
True but you have experienced the local. Something that a photograph can never give you. Sometimes you just have to put that camera down and enjoy the trip
With me it's just the opposite. Having a camera forces me to critically focus on my environment. With a camera in my hand, I will see many things that I otherwise would not have seen had I "put my camera down".

10-29-2016, 10:54 AM - 2 Likes   #5
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If your goal is to sell ("my dismal lack of print sales of these images"), then I believe you are right, focus on whats your forte, which could well be the places you know since you were born...

I don't know... with photography sometimes you tend to have a jaded look on the things you know and miss important details someone who sees them for the first time is able to catch, sometimes it is just the opposite, and experience pays dividends...

If the main goal, OTOH, is to go to beautiful places and come back with high-res pictures for your own enjoyment (not "me too" shots, as you said, nor a unique picture different from someone else, it could just be a picture that resonates with you because you took it), then go and visit, and take back memories and pictures.

I almost never expect to do "art photography" when visiting a place I don't know... I just enjoy it and take some snapshots... when I look at them some time later, I enjoy remembering, that's all.

So you have a choice, choose what your priorities are and then decide ;-)
10-29-2016, 11:11 AM - 2 Likes   #6
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there's nothing wrong with visiting amazing places. and there is certainly nothing wrong with bringing your camera and enjoying the view and snapping some pics.

but i think there is something wrong with creating an attitude that none of it is worth while because some stranger took a better photo. it sounds like you're getting a bad attitude about it because other people either do it better or are selling more photos.


if your own perceived failures when comparing yourself to others are the driving force behind your choice to quit exploring and taking photos, you have developed a defeatist attitude and should do your best to get over it. quit comparing yourself to other people, that's not a healthy way to be.
10-29-2016, 11:15 AM - 1 Like   #7
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Ok, so maybe you haven't yet shot 'that' photo, and haven't sold many, but so what?

Did you enjoy the places you visited?

What were the people like? The food? The whole experience? See places you'd never otherwise see?

If you got nothing at all out of your trips, then by all means stop, but...really? Nothing?

Take a breath. Pack your kit. Go and meet some Icelanders and have some fun!

10-29-2016, 11:19 AM - 1 Like   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by wibbly Quote
there's nothing wrong with visiting amazing places. and there is certainly nothing wrong with bringing your camera and enjoying the view and snapping some pics.

but i think there is something wrong with creating an attitude that none of it is worth while because some stranger took a better photo. it sounds like you're getting a bad attitude about it because other people either do it better or are selling more photos.


if your own perceived failures when comparing yourself to others are the driving force behind your choice to quit exploring and taking photos, you have developed a defeatist attitude and should do your best to get over it. quit comparing yourself to other people, that's not a healthy way to be.
Why do I even bother posting? I'm not trying to change you or anybody. Just sharing MY convictions. Thanks for being so judgemental!!
10-29-2016, 11:23 AM - 1 Like   #9
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i think your original post was being pretty judgemental, especially to people who like to take pictures on vacation. you're suggesting that doing that somehow cheapens you as a photographer because you take pictures that others already have.

and you shared it i'm sure to start a conversation about your new attitude, not all comments are going to be praise.
10-29-2016, 11:26 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fenwoodian Quote
For about 20 years now, I've made brief photo visits to locations that had beautiful scenery (e.g. Grand Canyon, Antelope Canyon, famous lighthouses, Moraine Lake in Canada, Monument Valley Arizona, Oak Alley Louisianna, Autumn colors in Vermont/New Hampshire, Cherry blossoms in Washington DC, Sea Stacks at Bandon Oregon, etc. etc.). I took mostly the same photographs that thousands of others before me had taken.

I fooled myself into believing that somehow, my photos were unique and better than those taken by others of these same subjects. But, my dismal lack of print sales of these images has made me realize that I was wrong - my images (while technically good) were not any more special than the thousands of images that preceded mine.

How could I have ever have thought that in a few days in Hawaii (for example), I could capture better images than the many photographers who actually live in Hawaii and shoot images there 24/7, 365 days a year there? I couldn't hope to capture images in a few short days that rival the images these local photographers (many of whom have photo equipment at least as good, or better, than mine) take.

While I'm not going to be giving up photography, from now on, I will be focusing all of my photography closer to home (Northern Wisconsin, USA). I've canceled my upcoming trip to Iceland...

I'm surprised it took me so long to reach this conclusion. I could have saved lots of time and money by just studying the famous artists and photographers of yesteryear and seen that most of them focused their creative energies in their own "backyards" (i.e. local areas).
I feel your pain. My sales, particularly this year have been dismal, to borrow your word. I just got back from DC/VA Beach and the resulting photos were a total bust. Nothing worth posting on my website. I've had thoughts of quitting and taking up underwater basket weaving, or something more productive, but then I come to the same conclusion I reached when I gave up golf for 2 years... "What else would I want to do?"

At least chasing that magic million dollar photo gives me a goal, when I'm at the stage in life where goals are tough to come by. Photography motivates me and challenges me to go somewhere I've never been before and keep crossing items off my bucket list.

As I get older, my golf game continues to get worse and there's really no hope of ever being scratch again. My career goal is counting down the years to retirement, so at least with photography I have something to look forward too with each trip. I still enjoy the weeks of planning I put into each journey, digging through books, surfing the internet, using google earth and google maps to lock down each day from sunrise to sunset in 15 minute intervals.

I have probably better odds of winning the Powerball than I do of getting a Nat Geo cover, especially since I am horrible at marketing myself, but at least I try. I can't seem to just curl up in a ball and let the world go by. I have a tough time giving up on anything. In fact my biggest fear is that I won't be able to get to some places on my bucket list because of age or health or whatever. I guess beyond being a photographer, I'm a collector of experiences and my photography intrinsic to that experience.

As I said int he beginning, I empathize completely, I have been there, done that emotionally. Maybe it's time to step away for a little while and let yourself miss it again. maybe you have put to much pressure on yourself to achieve a nearly impossible goal. Just don't close the door.

One of the things I'm planning on doing is buying an RV and allowing myself longer periods of time in one location. Of course, that can't happen until I retire, but it's another piece of the long term plan that keeps me slogging through corporate america day after day.
10-29-2016, 12:26 PM - 2 Likes   #11
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It's actually a total bummer - for what it's worth,this was the conclusion I came to when I hit a buffer of my own - there's one thing I can do better than anyone else in the world, and that's be me, and shoot what I see, the way I see it. Probably won't improve your sales, but its a helluva lot more fun, and if you happen to find a voice which resonates with others then you might just get the sales you only dreamed of when taking perfect pictures. The thing that makes you pissed off is the thing that can make you a really good photographer - we live in an amazing world - go photograph it through your own eyes. That's what I tell myself, anyway - and I sometimes listen, and I sometimes do something unique.

Last edited by ffking; 10-30-2016 at 03:28 PM.
10-29-2016, 12:29 PM - 4 Likes   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fenwoodian Quote
How could I have ever have thought that in a few days in Hawaii (for example), I could capture better images than the many photographers who actually live in Hawaii and shoot images there 24/7, 365 days a year there? I couldn't hope to capture images in a few short days that rival the images these local photographers (many of whom have photo equipment at least as good, or better, than mine) take.
Really interesting post; thanks for sharing. I live on Oahu (Hawaii). Every other year, I travel to my schoolʻs yearbook printing plant in Manitoba south of Winnipeg and north of North Dakota in the dead of winter. None of the locals are out shooting because it is so colorless and barren. For me, itʻs an awesome change of scenery.

Yes, local artists and photographers have the advantage of 24/7 familiarity, timing for best weather, insider info on the special or lesser known places and things. A few thrive, sometime for a couple years, a couple decades, and in very, very rare instances a lifetime. From what Iʻve seen, "it takes a village" that is not just the photographer, but a loving and supportive family, business partners, and engagement within the culture and art community. The lone wolf may think of themselves as that, but if they are thriving, they are interdependent of others.

On the other hand, some of the best images Iʻve seen are taken by "outsiders". As a local, that which is special becomes familiar and mundane and it feels like your best work comes from travel and seeing and discovering new vistas. So in many ways, although at a disadvantage in many ways, the tourist or travel photographer appreciates and sees with the eyes of a child the wonder and sights that a local will ignore from desensitization.

Photography as a business, or "Show Business", requires among many things, the photographerʻs ability to efficiently have exclusivity as long as possible to a specific market of images. I think we all know the life and work of Ansel Adams and the extraordinary efforts he took in the field and in the darkroom to create his signature monochrome landscapes. But he came from a well-to-do family, and most of his life supplemented his art with income generating school photography, industrial/corporate color jobs, and teaching. In reality, he probably spent more time doing commercial photography than he did his niche of western landscapes.

And you mention equipment, and in most instances I think that is the least important factor. Clark Little is a local that loves photography and body surfing and would risk life and limb with his DSLR and waterproof housing to shoot in the shore break. One day, one of his photos went viral and he found himself on the national television that launched two galleries, books, and at the moment, enough income to raise his family. But now there are packs of wannabe surf photographers with GoPros to Red cameras eating away at Clarkʻs niche...with his advantage as having the legacy of being the pioneer.

I know youʻre not asking or looking for advice, but I just wanted to share that when it comes to selling art or photography, Iʻve found that "theme" and the photographerʻs identity needs to somehow standout as a specialization, iconic, a brand. Enjoy your time in Hawaii...but keep in mind that youʻll notice all the lenses are pointing in one direction for that postcard profile screensaver sunset, but very few 180 degrees at the cast shadows on the sand or the Brocken Spectre in the grey cloud behind you.
10-29-2016, 12:42 PM - 4 Likes   #13
Brooke Meyer
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fenwoodian Quote
For about 20 years now, I've made brief photo visits to locations that had beautiful scenery (e.g. Grand Canyon, Antelope Canyon, famous lighthouses, Moraine Lake in Canada, Monument Valley Arizona, Oak Alley Louisianna, Autumn colors in Vermont/New Hampshire, Cherry blossoms in Washington DC, Sea Stacks at Bandon Oregon, etc. etc.). I took mostly the same photographs that thousands of others before me had taken.

I fooled myself into believing that somehow, my photos were unique and better than those taken by others of these same subjects. But, my dismal lack of print sales of these images has made me realize that I was wrong - my images (while technically good) were not any more special than the thousands of images that preceded mine.

How could I have ever have thought that in a few days in Hawaii (for example), I could capture better images than the many photographers who actually live in Hawaii and shoot images there 24/7, 365 days a year there? I couldn't hope to capture images in a few short days that rival the images these local photographers (many of whom have photo equipment at least as good, or better, than mine) take.

While I'm not going to be giving up photography, from now on, I will be focusing all of my photography closer to home (Northern Wisconsin, USA). I've canceled my upcoming trip to Iceland...

I'm surprised it took me so long to reach this conclusion. I could have saved lots of time and money by just studying the famous artists and photographers of yesteryear and seen that most of them focused their creative energies in their own "backyards" (i.e. local areas).
You've learned a great deal. It takes a long time to get to know a place, to belong to a place. So when we went to Paris recently, it was a real vacation. My wife and I both love the city - food, wine, art, architecture and history -and we've been before. Took the same apt as last time. But even though I get around easily on the Metro and am comfortable there, I don't really know the city, I am not a Parisien.

Of course I made photographs, for us, for me. It was great fun to wander about Monet's house and garden after seeing his paintings at L'orangerie and Musee Marmottan. And as a ballet photographer, Palais Garnier is just spectacular, even as a tourist.

Our trip was a much needed break and reset and I came home ready for the work I love and earn with, portraits and dancers. And after photographing the NC State Fair here in Raleigh the past 7 years, I came home to find I'd won "Best NC Fair Scene".

So sometimes, you need to travel so you can really see your home. And home is where all my best work is done.
10-29-2016, 12:53 PM - 1 Like   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fenwoodian Quote
While I'm not going to be giving up photography, from now on, I will be focusing all of my photography closer to home (Northern Wisconsin, USA). I've canceled my upcoming trip to Iceland...
I think that "the magic moment" could be everywhere, everytime and for the most it comes unexpected. So all we need is to be there and be prepared. This is what makes a photo "special" . You can achieve very good results with a lot of patience and a solid experience, planning very well locations and times, but unfortunately this is exactly what many people do. no one could give you any insurance for all the hundreds of little things that could change the shooting conditions and make the magic. So.... my opinion is that perhaps you're too uncompromising with youself and the way you think your photography. If your pictures are the same as many others, well.... given the fact that many of those photos are professional grade... perhaps that means you reached a top level , that your photos are great and that you have to face the fact that "magic moment" is just right the corner waiting for you. Doensn't matter if this is in your backyard or in Iceland. Photos I like in my travels are special for me because they remind me what moments and experiences were special for my existence; perhaps those photo have nothing "special" but having my life inside they are my special photo. Enjoy your photography and enjoy your travels.
Best regards.Matteo
10-29-2016, 01:09 PM - 1 Like   #15
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I appreciate your post and have had similar feelings. I segregate my journeys into either family vacations or photography trips. For the former my ambitions are, well, different and I'm OK with taking snapshots, or even glorified snapshots using better gear because my goals are different. My photography journeys are usually aimed at more obscure locations, or if at a popular place, much more narrow in scope. With over a trillion shots being created every year, it's not easy to come up with something unique and artful, but well worth the journey.

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