[Rondec]

Like I said, Norm, it's not a requirement for people to post photos - but I agree that it's very helpful if they do. Your example is a pretty extreme (though I'll admit, not uncommon) one, but even in that example, a member is entitled to their opinion. For the guy who claims "Pentax AF sucks", personally I would say "Well, that hasn't been my experience" and move on, rather than saying "You don't know what you're talking about, here's my proof, where's yours?!". If I believe someone is talking baloney, I'd rather end the exchange with that person in a friendly and courteous way, and move on. That's just me. I accept (and embrace) that we're all different



Yes, some people have very thin skins, some very thick, and some in-between. I always work on the assumption that someone is thin-skinned, and I word my responses to be constructive, helpful and non-confrontational. I never assume someone is thick-skinned, and I never talk to them that way. Even so, I very occasionally get it wrong and offend someone - but not often. Some people would say I'm treading on egg-shells unnecessarily, but I just see it as courtesy. I do get a little frustrated when I can see someone is blaming their shortcomings on their gear, but hey - most of us were there at one time or another



We're all different, I guess. Each member wants something very personal from these forums. Some post lots of photos, some none. You post a lot, whereas I post very few - not because I'm uncomfortable doing so (I have and will continue to post them occasionally), but I'm really not looking for feedback on my photography on a day-to-day basis. I *will* post a photo if it helps in identifying a problem, but I won't usually post one when I express an opinion, and I don't particularly care if others disagree with that opinion (though I'm grateful when I can learn something from constructive and courteous disagreement). Heck, sometimes I'm not even in a position to post a photo without going through my images (some processed and catalogued, others not), but that won't stop me from posting an opinion or advice, and nor should it. Anyone who insists on a photo whenever I ask a question or state an opinion can simply ignore my posts. They don't need to throw down a gauntlet



With regard to the bit in bold above, absolutely not, Norm - that's not a requirement or condition of posting here, and that's why it's not in the forum rules. Everyone is entitled to post here within those. You and I can choose not to read or participate in those posts, of course

I think we've moved away from the OP's original post somewhat, so I'll leave it there.

You don't have to be an awesome film maker to understand that you like (or don't like) certain films. I don't see much discussion of technique here, but when it happens, it is usually triggered by someone sharing an interesting photo and then others asking about details about how they shot and processed it. I seldom see the reverse. But certainly I am glad for folks to give input on if they like or don't like images and why (the why is often the hard part), even if they are still developing as photographers.

I do think someone's opinion is valid, even if they don't have an awesome photograph to back it up. I also want people to feel comfortable posting images as well. Generally people are gentle with criticism. The biggest problems I have run into is when I post "comparison" photos and then people are always quick to point out why it isn't a valid comparison.

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Last edited by Rondec; 11-22-2017 at 03:39 AM.

[Auzzie-Phoenix]

I'd love to post pictures all the time, but I rely entirely on my pf gallery storage, and have to curate carefully due to space constraints. There are some images in my gallery space that are linked to club threads, or threads that I don't want to remove the images from. Until I find a better solution, I'm stuck. I'd love to post more images, but that's the way things stand until I find a better alternative, and that certainly isn't flickr.

[Dan Rentea]

For the guy who claims "Pentax AF sucks".

Unless you're a pro action shooter and your income depends on fast and accurate af (case in which I do understand that Pentax system is not an option), there may be a solution to improve the chances to get better and better action images with Pentax cameras. Please escuse me if I will yell when I say this, but the solution (at least one of them) is to practice, practice, practice!

You don't think that I'm yelling right now? Since this topic is somehow about back-up our comments with images...well, see for yourself how I yell!

[sibyrnes]

I have noticed, especially in the news and rumors threads, that some of the most outspoken and opinionated people hardly ever post photos. Many don't even have any photos in the gallery. I often wonder if they spend more time talking about photography than they do actually doing it!

[normhead]

I have noticed, especially in the news and rumors threads, that some of the most outspoken and opinionated people hardly ever post photos. Many don't even have any photos in the gallery. I often wonder if they spend more time talking about photography than they do actually doing it!

Especially when they are telling people they can't be happy with their cameras because it isn't good for what they do. I used to get into it with Dan Rentea, simply because I shoot the occasional wildlife BiF image, and he shoots them more than he shoots anything else. I'm more a "I want camera body to do everything, landscape, candids, slower moving wildlife etc. I do some birds in flight, but I don't plan to do birds in flight, I'm more casual. Once I realized he was hanging with a largely BiF crowd, and focussing on that aspect of his photography, I completely understood why he doesn't shoot Pentax. But Dan is actually the only one that's happened with. Most of these guys i have no idea what they shoot or why. I understand Dan because he showed me his pictures, and, he's good enough at what he does you can't really object to his opinions. Opinions with photos to back them up are supported by real world evidence.

I know that if I buy the gear Dan does, and follow him around for a while, I'll get pictures like he does. SO many on this site have big opinions, but without pictures, I have no way of evaluating if thier opinion is worth the paper it's written on.and I'm definitely not going to follow their purchasing advice or try and emulate what they do, unless they show me a compelling image I'd like to replicate.

Kind of like "find the lens you love and buy the camera it goes on", "Find the images you like, and research how the photographer takes them, and what gear he uses." It is much easier to have photographic success by not reinventing the wheel and learning from those who's work appeals to you.

[BigMackCam]

I have noticed, especially in the news and rumors threads, that some of the most outspoken and opinionated people hardly ever post photos. Many don't even have any photos in the gallery. I often wonder if they spend more time talking about photography than they do actually doing it!

I'm sure some do, but that's OK. Currently, I spend a lot more time servicing old lenses than I do taking photos with them

[Dan Rentea]

Especially when they are telling people they can't be happy with their cameras because it isn't good for what they do.

There is a fine line between "isn't good" and "it's good enough". Good enough for everyday use is any camera released in the last couple of years. Chasing the best camera in the world it's a waste of time.

I used to get into it with Dan Rentea, simply because I shoot the occasional wildlife BiF image, and he shoots them more than he shoots anything else. I'm more a "I want camera body to do everything, landscape, candids, slower moving wildlife etc. I do some birds in flight, but I don't plan to do birds in flight, I'm more casual.

If we're talking only about wildlife, then yes, I do love BIF because it's fun but in the same time demanding. I try to depend as little as I can on the camera and I concentrate on fast reacting from my part in choosing the right settings and also in keeping the bird in the frame as long as I can. I do have some great shots with BIF, but I'm to lazy to update my website. I said on different threads that I can shoot wildlife with a KP, K-3 II, K1 (I shoot BIF side by side with friends that shoot with Pentax and get great results) and I would probably get the same results as I get with Canon, but a little more effort is needed for some particular shots.

But, BIF is on third position when comes to what I photograph. On first position is corporate events and portraits. I don't want to be a full time photographer because I have a very good job (professionally and financially speaking), but I promised myself that I will not invest a single dollar in gear because life is short and I want to travel with my wife instead of investing so much money in photography. So, corporate events and portrait photography pays for all my gear, from cameras, lenses and up to lights, trainings, etc.

On second position are the photo events that I organise for people who doesn't have money to go to workshops or for the people who want to go out and socialise. I provide flashes (I have a lot of Godox powerful flashes), triggers that can work with any system, all sort of modifiers, models and I invite always a known photographer to give the participants tips and tricks. I always take behind the scenes images or I ask someone else to take if I'm holding a flash or a modifier because these kind of images (see below a few examples) helps people understand how to position the flashes and so on.

Once I realized he was hanging with a largely BiF crowd, and focussing on that aspect of his photography, I completely understood why he doesn't shoot Pentax.

I still shoot with Pentax cameras, it's just that they are not mine anymore. I love Pentax cameras, but I hate how poorly is represented in my country, that's why I choose to change the system.

But Dan is actually the only one that's happened with. Most of these guys i have no idea what they shoot or why. I understand Dan because he showed me his pictures, and, he's good enough at what he does you can't really object to his opinions. Opinions with photos to back them up are supported by real world evidence.

I should have started with me telling you thank you for these words. Yes, I'm very much in love with discussion that come with images as support for arguments of the people involved in that discussion. I had a teacher in college that was one of the best theoreticians in terms of business management but had almost no practical experience as a manager or as an entrepreneur and he didn't know how to put in practise his knowledge. An experienced manager came to his class one day and destroyed all his theories with practical examples. So yes, theoreticians and theories are good, but up to a point. If I see a guy that contradicts on something based on his theoretichal knowledge and he has 15.000 or 20.000 comments on a forum, but not a single image nowhere on the internet... I tend to belive that marketing and paid reviews got him.

I know that if I buy the gear Dan does, and follow him around for a while, I'll get pictures like he does.

I have no doubt that gear is important in some particular moments with fast actions involved, but learning how to anticipate and make the best out of the gear you have it's more important. I still shoot BIF with 6D despite I have a 5D Mark IV and I get good results shooting next to guys with 5D Mark IV, 7D Mark II, D500, etc. I take out 5D Mark IV only when the birds are small and fast because keeping them in the frame for more than 2-3 seconds it's the big challenge for me and in this regard 7fps from 5D Mark IV helps me a lot more than 4,5fps from 6D in those 2 or 3 seconds when the bird is in the frame. So, I'm sure you can get any kind of image you want with your gear if you become interested in BIF.

SO many on this site have big opinions, but without pictures, I have no way of evaluating if thier opinion is worth the paper it's written on.and I'm definitely not going to follow their purchasing advice or try and emulate what they do, unless they show me a compelling image I'd like to replicate.

Yes, the discussion based on direct experience and with images as support are far more interesting (even if they are contraditory) than graphs, lab tests and hypothetical conclusions based on internet reviews.

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Last edited by Dan Rentea; 11-29-2017 at 03:27 AM.