[mohb]

Originally posted by mohb*
Perhaps your desire for debate would be answered if you explained why you think they can't?
Did I say that? I asked a question and invited discussion

The problem is that beyond "mirrorless is the future" we are given very little to debate except the Pentax is doomed scenario and i was hoping that you could start us off without relying on the dubious assumptions of TN

[steve_k]

i don't really think many people on this forum really care what Tony has to say. The guy is a paid hack who has his own agenda and it is not what is best for us. That being said if you feel that mirrorless is the way to go you have chosen the wrong brand. I suggest you break your piggy bank and max out your credit cards and buy an overpriced mirrorless kit. Let us know how much it improves your photographic skills.

[Bert J]

I don't know if you noticed Bert, but Tony Northrop (or is it Sony Northrop) makes a number of comments that are all wrong.

There's no facts presented as to why mirrorless will overtake DSLR as the prefered format. I note you have not commented on the graph I have posted showing manufacturers data.
There's a whole lot of (in my view) false reasons why mirrorless is "better".
His comments about Pentax are highly inflammatory and wrong. One of the claims he makes is that Pentax lenses are "rebranded Tamron".

Thanks Mark. Yes I agree that Tony was unfair towards Pentax.

Apologies i didn't reply to the graph, i'm trying to calm people down who misunderstand this thread. I'm not succeeding.

So, currently Nikon and Canon are not in the mirrorless market, but both will be very soon. Have you seen Nikon's lens roadmap? They aren't going half-hearted. I wonder how the graph will change in 12-24 months.

As i said before, i think our fan base will keep pentax afloat for a while. I doubt we will win many new friends though

[clickclick]

You Tube

You Tube

[TER-OR]

Not everyone has to make everything. Should BMW market a full-sized pickup truck?

Doing a poor job entering a crowded market would be harmful to the brand. If Pentax decides to move into the mirrorless market, it must not repeat its experience with the K-01. Does Pentax really need to move strong into the mirrorless realm?

The legacy of K-mount must be maintained. Others have changed mounts etc. and screwed their owners in the process.

We do have the Q architecture. That might have capacity for improved models, which would compete more with the Micro 4/3 environment than APSC, perhaps even with the Fuji line.

[boriscleto]

You must have one heck of an ignore list Boris!

Only 169 ATM. Threads like this used to add a lot, but now they mostly ignored users

[RobA_Oz]

Canon's been in the mirrorless market for a while, although they haven't had a direct challenger to a 35FF DSLR to date.

I've watched a few Tony Northrup videos, and, while I don't think he's particularly anti-Pentax (he did say at one stage that he thought the K-1 was the best landscape camera available), like a lot of other online reviewers he seems to confuse his preferences with absolute truths. Currently, he likes the Sony A7/A9 range because they suit some of his styles of shooting, but he still prefers Nikon DSLRs in other situations.

Other people have criticised his industry analysis, so I won't add to that, except to say that, if you read some of the comments in the threads about the imminent release of the Nikon Z series and other mirrorless bodies, you'll see that some of us are wondering just where all these reported MILC sales are going, because some of us aren't seeing many of them out and about.

In spite of the interpretations that Tony and Chelsea Northrup might put on the present sales situation, I'm not worried about Pentax's future. It isn't just this little band of frequent posters on PF that's supporting them with purchases of new gear. If you also check the posts on the Pentax Facebook groups, you'll see many different people using the gear. Nonetheless, if you check the Forum home page, you'll see that there are nearly 80,000 subscribers noted. Even allowing for non-active members or old gear users, that's a not insubstantial dedicated base on which to build sales.

Since I've been active here, I've introduced at least five other people to Pentax gear, who've bought new bodies and lenses, and I know others who've had similar experiences.

[Bert J]

You're the only one attacking.

Ah. A prime offender speaks

[biz-engineer]

As i said before, i think our fan base will keep pentax afloat for a while. I doubt we will win many new friends though

So what? What is your concern? Are you afraid of something?

[reh321]

The legacy of K-mount must be maintained. Others have changed mounts etc. and screwed their owners in the process.

They could make what I've been calling a K-07 {innards of K-70 in MILC case plus EVF} and do both; it would look like a M-5 with adapter permanently attached

[UncleVanya]

The newly announced Nikon system is what I'd love to see from Pentax. The question that remains is how the legacy product fits into the future. I'm a big fan of ovf based dslr systems... But mirrorless can be useful too.

[pschlute]

Ah. A prime offender speaks

The poster you are referring to criticized your confrontational first post, as did I. He then went on to criticize the video itself, participating in the debate you want.

You need to decide on the purpose of you posting here. Is it to discuss the merits of mirrorless and whether it will have an effect on the Pentax brand, or is it to complain about members ?

So far you have managed to upset a lot of people and what could have been an interesting debate is in danger of being lost.

Forums work by folk engaging with each other. If you wish to complain about members perhaps you would do better to take it straight to a moderator or forum owners.

[BigMackCam]

Folks, please let's stop the back and forth arguing.

To the OP: This thread could have been so much more valuable if it had been initiated without publicly voicing the assumption that existing members ("regulars") would respond negatively. That set the thread up for failure from the start, which is a shame, as I'm personally interested in both DSLR and mirrorless cameras. I even quite like Tony Northrup, though I disagree with his opinion on Pentax's future

To our established members: No matter how provocative a new member's posts may be, please try to cut them some slack as they acclimatise to this community. If you feel something is inflammatory or trolling, we have forum rules to deal with that, so please simply report the post to the moderating team rather than getting into arguments.

Many thanks

[IgorZ]

The interesting thing about traditional societies is that they were incredibly diverse. Think of Morocco, Britain, India, and China in the 17th century. Was there anything in common between them? These days we shun diversity for uniformity - unless you have an iPhone, drink Starbucks coffee and watch Netflix, there is something wrong with you. Similarly here. The fact that there is so much pressure to do what everyone else does is probably a sign of times. The more diversity there is in the camera market, the better for me as a consumer. I love Mamiya RB67, but I surely would not want all cameras to be like that, if only for the fact that I would not be able to carry 2 or 3 of them on any given outing. Mirrorless approach has some strengths, and so does the DSLR approach. The fact that we have both allows me to choose which one works for me. I like Pentax, but if I could make a wish and make it come true, I would not want Pentax to be the only camera maker, as it reduces my choices and I am selfish. I also don't want Pentax to be like Sony, because Sony is surely better than Pentax at being like Sony, and if I wanted Sony I'd just buy a Sony camera. And use it along side my Pentax gear, utilizing strengths of both camera makers. I think as consumers, instead of convergence between camera makers, we should encourage diversity. This will allow us to have sushi one day and pasta the next, instead of having rice wrapped in pasta and dipped into tomato sauce every day. Because who would want that?

[Bert J]

Canon's been in the mirrorless market for a while, although they haven't had a direct challenger to a 35FF DSLR to date.

I've watched a few Tony Northrup videos, and, while I don't think he's particularly anti-Pentax (he did say at one stage that he thought the K-1 was the best landscape camera available), like a lot of other online reviewers he seems to confuse his preferences with absolute truths. Currently, he likes the Sony A7/A9 range because they suit some of his styles of shooting, but he still prefers Nikon DSLRs in other situations.

Other people have criticised his industry analysis, so I won't add to that, except to say that, if you read some of the comments in the threads about the imminent release of the Nikon Z series and other mirrorless bodies, you'll see that some of us are wondering just where all these reported MILC sales are going, because some of us aren't seeing many of them out and about.

In spite of the interpretations that Tony and Chelsea Northrup might put on the present sales situation, I'm not worried about Pentax's future. It isn't just this little band of frequent posters on PF that's supporting them with purchases of new gear. If you also check the posts on the Pentax Facebook groups, you'll see many different people using the gear. Nonetheless, if you check the Forum home page, you'll see that there are nearly 80,000 subscribers noted. Even allowing for non-active members or old gear users, that's a not insubstantial dedicated base on which to build sales.

Since I've been active here, I've introduced at least five other people to Pentax gear, who've bought new bodies and lenses, and I know others who've had similar experiences.

Awesome!!!!

Thanks for your well considered response Rob

I agree Tony is misplaced sometimes. But it's interesting that many of his wishes are being implimented.