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12-15-2018, 02:48 AM   #16
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The article says the photos came before the tourist. Let's face most people don't throw a dart at a spinning globe and say I will spend my limited vacation money and limited money in hopes that dart made a great choice. They see the pictures and say that's a place I want to see. Then they take pictures and tell more people about them.
I think an article about places that fell out of favor for no dangerous reason would be more interesting.

12-15-2018, 02:57 AM - 1 Like   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by swanlefitte Quote
The article says the photos came before the tourist. Let's face most people don't throw a dart at a spinning globe and say I will spend my limited vacation money and limited money in hopes that dart made a great choice. They see the pictures and say that's a place I want to see. Then they take pictures and tell more people about them.
I think an article about places that fell out of favor for no dangerous reason would be more interesting.
But then they will become popular again, wouldn't they?
I think there's got to be a reason why a place is eschewed/not actively sought by the masses... be it inconvenience, remoteness, danger, small perceived value etc.

If one doesn't explore, then he has very little chance of finding "diamonds in the rough".

Then there are places which are popular, but for the wrong reasons.
An example, the small town of Gallipoli (the one in Apulia, IT, not the one of the battle) is swarmed every year with throngs of young people that go to night clubs and such, drink like sponges and binge all night long.
In the morning there's a few tourists in the fish market and at the beaches, and there's one fellow or two still puking their soul out of their stomach, but the quaint city center is almost deserted.
12-15-2018, 04:00 AM - 4 Likes   #18
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I think there are a couple of things. First of all, my touristy photos that have my kids in them are different from other people's touristy photos because they don't have my kids in them. I like those sort of photos even though they are cliche because I scrapbook them later and write something about our trip and they remember the trip better as years go by. Memories that aren't periodically jogged are lost.

Second, the most important thing about my landscape photos is that they were taken by me. Truly for me when it comes to photography, the journey is as important as the destination. I get up early before my wife and kids are up, go out to a place I picked out the night before and try to snag some sunrise shots. Or waterfall shots. Or whatever shots.

The final thing is that I do think it is silly to take photos of everything. If you go to a museum and take photos of every vehicle or exhibit in the museum, I have to think that you actually lose your enjoyment of the experience. I tend to snap a few photos at the beginning and then along the way if there is something particularly interesting, but most of all, I try to enjoy the experience of being with family and interacting with them. To me that is where memories are truly made and what makes trips enjoyable -- not just the amazing photos you come back with.


Last edited by Rondec; 12-15-2018 at 04:07 AM.
12-15-2018, 04:02 AM - 1 Like   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by LensBeginner Quote
Then there are places which are popular, but for the wrong reasons.
An example, the small town of Gallipoli (the one in Apulia, IT, not the one of the battle) is swarmed every year with throngs of young people that go to night clubs and such, drink like sponges and binge all night long.
In the morning there's a few tourists in the fish market and at the beaches, and there's one fellow or two still puking their soul out of their stomach, but the quaint city center is almost deserted.
Like Bourbon Street here. Except much more than a fellow or two.

12-15-2018, 04:25 AM - 2 Likes   #20
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Perhaps we live in such a photography saturated world now that there's almost nowhere left that you can go to and take a truly original photo. And it's not just us amateur vacationers. A couple of days ago I was looking through the Travel Photographer of the Year award winners, and I kept getting the feeling that I'd seen most of the photos before. Not those exact photos, but ones of such similar places treated in such similar ways that there was a definite feeling of deja vu. Travel Photographer of the Year (TPOTY) - Travel Photographer of the Year

I spent my early years in the travel industry working in a high street agency, and there's no doubt that for many people one of the main influences on their choice of destination is just to brag that they are a real traveller because they've been there. Over and over again a certain type of customer would say: "Send me somewhere I can get away from those ghastly tourist hordes." And then I knew that all I had to do to close the sale was pander to their ego, while privately thinking that part of the tourist horde was all they would actually ever be.

Although I haven't worked in retail travel for a long time, I'd bet money that the best way to clinch a sale nowadays is to tell the customer that the trip will look great when they post their photos on Instagram.


Edit:
I should probably also mention that I live in a tourist area, and many of my photos are taken at well known touristy locations. But I've got the advantage of being able to go back again and again, when the light is better than the average visitor will be lucky enough to get.

Last edited by Dartmoor Dave; 12-15-2018 at 05:00 AM.
12-15-2018, 05:09 AM - 2 Likes   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
Often when I've been in a situation like that, I've spent my time looking for a good position from which to photograph the scrum of photographers {plus their target if possible}
That is a good idea.

I do not do this enough, but I'd love to carry a 10 stop ND filter and take those long exposure shots that make a crowd disappear from the scene I'm trying to capture.

For me, I don't need to make my own shot of a picture that has been taken 1,000,000,000 times before, probably in better light than I had on that day, and probably by someone with more skill in post processing than I have. I'd rather get a unique shot . I've also learned to try and use the crowd to add interest to a shot if I can't make them disappear with a very long exposure. If you watch a scene for a minute or two, you'll notice something that makes the shot a bit more than a "postcard snap"I try to take good shots, even when out and about with non-photographers, but there have been times I've left the camera at home and enjoyed time out with friends and family, then gone back alone to get the shots I wanted. My family knows I might get up early or stay up late during vacation to get a shot, too, and as long as I don't wake them up, they don't mind.

I do agree that snapping away collecting images replaces actually seeing a sight and remembering it. My memory always captures images in their best light, I'll stick to that if I had to choose.

On a related note, I think it's perfectly fine for a photographer not to publish the location of a shot to keep it from being overrun by others.

Last edited by robgski; 12-15-2018 at 05:15 AM.
12-15-2018, 05:28 AM - 6 Likes   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dartmoor Dave Quote
Although I haven't worked in retail travel for a long time, I'd bet money that the best way to clinch a sale nowadays is to tell the customer that the trip will look great when they post their photos on Instagram.
Very important to millennials and Gen Z. If they're single, they do due diligence (polite words for stalking) on Instagram/Twitter feeds (Facebook is for your mum, dad and nan). Someone who doesn't have a presence is considered a weirdo. Someone who seems to have a job, wears the right brands, and does trendy things is dateable. The supermarket worker who finally saves up enough to go to Ibiza or Bali? For God's sake take poolside selfies when you're there. It's social capital at stake!
12-15-2018, 06:29 AM - 1 Like   #23
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A general reaction: There is not necessarily a distinction between interacting with family and making photographs. My wife and I are both photographers, and when we are making photographs on a trips were are sharing the experience at a deep level.

I also see no distinction between photographing and experiencing a place. On the contrary, photographing a place requires a deeper awareness of it than just standing at the viewpoints and going “wow!”

I think the article is about people who make photos not for the sake of expression but merely to post on Facebook and the like to show their friends that they were there, sort of like mailing postcards. That’s what I call adventure signaling (“look what we did instead of buying things”), which is, of course, every bit as competitive as buying things.

But I think the natural scene is dynamic enough to survive a million still photos without repeating itself.

Rick “who wrote an essay on this topic recently” Denney

12-15-2018, 06:43 AM - 2 Likes   #24
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I should have mentioned previously that I prefer to travel in the off season whenever possible. For example, I live near Monticello, a UNESCO World Heritage site, the home of Thomas Jefferson, and visit it a few times a year, usually when we have visitors. At the height of the season, the place is packed, the gardens are thronged with tourists, there is no place one can photograph without having people in the shot, people who are holding up cellphones to get heir own shot. Not the most attractive human interest idea. Alternately, if I visit there on a late afternoon during the week in fall, or in winter, there are days when I've been nearly alone. It's a pleasant change, and I can take my time to enjoy the place and compose the shots.

Certain places, like Cape Cod, are better in the off season, the weather might be a bit too cold to enjoy sunbathing on the beach, but the autumn light and the sea make for images that are unmatchable.
12-15-2018, 07:19 AM - 1 Like   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
Very important to millennials and Gen Z. If they're single, they do due diligence (polite words for stalking) on Instagram/Twitter feeds (Facebook is for your mum, dad and nan). Someone who doesn't have a presence is considered a weirdo. Someone who seems to have a job, wears the right brands, and does trendy things is dateable. The supermarket worker who finally saves up enough to go to Ibiza or Bali? For God's sake take poolside selfies when you're there. It's social capital at stake!
...that sounds like a secret-service-like approach
...how did we manage to get an idea of what the other person was like, before all that? we... talked?
12-15-2018, 07:22 AM - 1 Like   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by LensBeginner Quote
...that sounds like a secret-service-like approach
...how did we manage to get an idea of what the other person was like, before all that? we... talked?
People's dating profiles used to be scratched onto the walls of bathroom stalls.
12-15-2018, 07:26 AM - 6 Likes   #27
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Obligatory XKCD:
12-15-2018, 07:59 AM - 1 Like   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by LensBeginner Quote
...how did we manage to get an idea of what the other person was like, before all that? we... talked?
Well, it's a relatively new, and maybe largely Western phenomenon, choosing your own spouse.

I suspect most marriages centuries ago were arranged, and probably still are in developing countries. Sensibly thought out cattle trading by families would be the justification. Information exchange between the kids concerned, even meeting them first? Optional!

Is romantic love just that - an aspiration? Dunno what comparing divorce rates can prove, very different societies are involved.

In any case, today's teenagers will go to the web to research everything … including the guy who gave his number at the party. He talked a lot, LensBeginner, but if true, a lot of what he said should be verified when the girl scrolls through his Instagram feed.

An impressive feed can pick up a lot of followers and the person becomes sought after by companies, an Influencer.

An Australian photographic example is Lauren Bath, who attracted so much attention she gets paid gigs to shoot content for hotels/resorts and tourism agencies in various countries.

Last edited by clackers; 12-15-2018 at 08:11 AM.
12-15-2018, 09:01 AM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by LensBeginner Quote
I find that kind of picture a little bit sad... I've done that as well a couple of times, but they are not satisfying to me when I look at them on my PC.
Personally, instead of snapping pictures of "places you have to go to" I'd rather go to a "less scenic" place where there's no tourists. Pictures I took in those situations are among the most rewarding, even if photographically imperfect.
My 0.02
I guess this is how we differ. These days I prefer to have at least a few people in a shot - they provide scale, and unless it is a truly 'unspoiled' area, they justify its condition, even existence.

Many years ago I read a Science Fiction story in which a group of beings discover a beautiful, green planet. After wandering around and finding a number of abandoned cities, they find an abandoned rocket launch area with a sign something like "Welcome to Sol's Terra" - realizing this was the to-them mythical 'Cape Canaveral' on the mythical 'earth' affected all of them, especially the 'earthling'. The whole thing was very haunting; a person-thing without persons is incomplete, IMHO.
12-15-2018, 09:06 AM - 1 Like   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
Well, it's a relatively new, and maybe largely Western phenomenon, choosing your own spouse.

I suspect most marriages centuries ago were arranged, and probably still are in developing countries. Sensibly thought out cattle trading by families would be the justification. Information exchange between the kids concerned, even meeting them first? Optional!

Is romantic love just that - an aspiration? Dunno what comparing divorce rates can prove, very different societies are involved.

In any case, today's teenagers will go to the web to research everything … including the guy who gave his number at the party. He talked a lot, LensBeginner, but if true, a lot of what he said should be verified when the girl scrolls through his Instagram feed.

An impressive feed can pick up a lot of followers and the person becomes sought after by companies, an Influencer.

An Australian photographic example is Lauren Bath, who attracted so much attention she gets paid gigs to shoot content for hotels/resorts and tourism agencies in various countries.
Divorce rate can be meaningless, if a society disapproves divorce. People can be persuaded to keep going with a relationship even when it's on life support. That's what happened in the first half of the past century, even in "Western" countries.

I don't know if "true love" exists, but I've discovered that one can get at least pretty darn close to plant the seed of doubt in one's mind.
Or one can be less fortunate, and live bad to ok-ish relationships, and be absolutely sure that "true love" doesn't exist.
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