[Fenwoodian]

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Today I was taking a photo of a retail building, from a public street.


I was testing the bokeh of a couple new lenses. I only wanted photos of the building, and landscaping around the building. I carefully waited until everyone was out of the photo to take my shots.

Well, one angry, 30ish, woman drove her car over to me and shouted and swore up a storm about how she didn't want her photo taken. I expect she likely called the cops after she left (but I'll never know because I too left the area). By the way, she was alone in the car - no kids.


Really made my day. Have you ever had someone in your face about taking perfectly legal photos?


I believe that I'm legally permitted to shoot what ever is in eye-shot from a public location. While I did not take this angry woman's photo (or anyone else's), I believe that here in Wisconsin USA I would have the right to do so under these circumstances if I choose.

In the future, I'm thinking of carrying a copy of whatever law gives me permission to shoot on public property. That way, I can simply show it to such angry people (and ignorant cops too) should the need arise.

Might anyone have a link for the legal document I'm looking for?
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Last edited by Fenwoodian; 06-27-2019 at 12:15 PM.

[Not a Number]

The legal yardstick is if there is an "expectation of privacy". There is no "expectation of privacy" in public places.

[tuco]

You can web search photographer's legal tip sheet. The ones I've seen are from law schools and lawyers telling you what your rights are. And of those I've seen they are just words without a source/reference to law you can quote to someone. But with all that police can and have arrested people anyway. Then you have to defend yourself. You'll eventually win but you'll have to go through the hassle factor.

[Bob 256]

Sometimes you can deal with angry people like the woman you encountered by explaining what you're doing and that you are trying to get the opposite of what they think (no faces in the photo). Then again, people are crazy these days and get mad at the least provocation (perceived or otherwise). In the case where you can't win over the person on the other side, it's best to withdraw from the confrontation until they're gone, then finish what you set out to do. However, law rules and it is true that photographers are free to photograph (in this country [US]) any location whose inhabitants would not generally expect privacy. What you do with those photos in which individuals can be identified is another thing. There are exceptions for photographing private property and some landmark photography could be in question in some circumstances.

[texandrews]

about all the surveillance cameras? She was clearly an unreasonable person. A work friend of mine had a nasty experience with a woman of a different race that did wind up involving the police (transit police). But in the end the police got into it with her.

[Apet-Sure]

I worked in customer service for many years (over the phone, not face-to-face). We had training on dealing with angry people. One strategy is to mirror their level of concern. If she's angry that her picture might be taken, you energetically explain , honestly, that you share her concern, and that you would NEVER take someone's picture without their permission because you are against that sort of thing. Assuming that's actually true and you do feel that way. You are showing the same energy level on her side of the argument. You are an ally, not an antagonist. If you don't really feel that way, don't pretend you do. Most people can spot fakes a mile away.

[BigMackCam]

I'm sure you did nothing wrong and she was either unbalanced, having a bad day, over-reacting or mistaken as to your intentions (perhaps all of those).

That said...

Whatever our legal rights may be (and I know this varies by country), since this is merely my hobby and something I do for enjoyment, I try to avoid any kind of conflict or friction... and on the very rare occasions it occurs, I'll do whatever's necessary to resolve it, even if I know I'm technically in the right. If that means me switching off my camera, walking away, missing some shots and finding somewhere and something else to photograph, so be it. I'm sure some photographers and members here might view that as being weak, yet I'm anything but that. I'm perfectly capable of standing up for myself, my family and friends when the need arises. But my first choice is always to diffuse a situation if at all possible.

If someone seriously objects to what I'm doing, I'll simply move on and pay the matter no more heed. There will be other days, and other photographs a-plenty

[Fenwoodian]

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Thanks to everyone! I greatly appreciate all of your wise advice.

I've never tried "Street Photography". And given how irate this woman was, I don't think I'll ever try it.

By the way, this happened in a medium sized city where everyone's a stranger (not unlike the Internet). I doubt it would have happened in a small town where everybody knows your name.

[DeadJohn]

1) A cop for a smaller NYC law enforcement agency (MTA Bridge & Tunnel, not NYPD) claimed that it was illegal to take "any photo that included a bridge" because of terrorism. I knew he was wrong and I asked him if every TV show, movie, advertisement that shows the NYC skyline was illegal. He started ranting about how he didn't care what the law said, I couldn't take photos of "his" bridge, then he burned rubber in his cruiser and sped off. It was bizarre and I pursued the issue with internal affairs to a satisfactory resolution.

2) A security guard walked out of a building and said I couldn't take photos outdoors because "the government is watching the building". He tried to grab my camera, I gently pushed him back while I stepped away to create some space, and I said something like "you just tried to steal my camera". He went back into his building without responding.

I've had other security guards say I was on private property and couldn't take photos, or could take photos but not setup a tripod. In each of the cases I thought about it, looked around, realized that yeah, I may have been on private property rather than the public right of way, and complied. There was no stress in any of those cases because they provided information in a non-confrontational manner.

[aslyfox]

I had a similar situation when photographing burrowing owls in a pasture:

" . . . while attending my first Wings and Wetlands Festival - Wings & Wetlands Birding Festival – Kansas Wetlands Education Center - ( held every two years - already plaining to attend again )

It is held in Great Bend Kansas and obviously the participants did not limit themselves to what could be found in the wetlands

( owls, prairie dogs and horses were on private property and owner was not happy with all the people who attended the festival coming by to photograph his pastures from the public road - he even called the Sheriff on my group but we had the right to photograph from public road way [ we also had the long time assistant County Coroner driving the vehicle, along with an licensed attorney [ me ] among the 4 people in the car ] "

Read more at: Wildlife - Page 10 - PentaxForums.com

deputy told us the farmer was concerned we were photographing the residence. Of course, we weren't and the deputy had to admit we could do what we were doing

afterwards I wondered about how the farmer felt about google earth ?

_______________________________________

. . .

Whatever our legal rights may be (and I know this varies by country), since this is merely my hobby and something I do for enjoyment, I try to avoid any kind of conflict or friction... and on the very rare occasions it occurs, I'll do whatever's necessary to resolve it, even if I know I'm technically in the right. If that means me switching off my camera, walking away, missing some shots and finding somewhere and something else to photograph, so be it. I'm sure some photographers and members here might view that as being weak, yet I'm anything but that. I'm perfectly capable of standing up for myself, my family and friends when the need arises. But my first choice is always to diffuse a situation if at all possible.

If someone seriously objects to what I'm doing, I'll simply move on and pay the matter no more heed. There will be other days, and other photographs a-plenty

I agree,

some times it can be like arguing with an vehicle that doesn't grant you the right of way

you may be correct but it is better to give way than insist on your rights

[PDL]

.
In the future, I'm thinking of carrying a copy of whatever law gives me permission to shoot on public property. That way, I can simply show it to such angry people (and ignorant cops too) should the need arise.

Might anyone have a link for the legal document I'm looking for?
.

Try these:
http://www.billadler.net/Photographer%27s_Legal_Rights_Card.pdf
Bert P. Krages - Attorney at Law

[aslyfox]

very nice but

be sure to read the disclaimer in the article by the attorney

second if you intend on making money from your photographs of people, I am not sure you don't need some form of release

I am not offering a legal opinion because I have not researched the issues involved and I am not engaged in the practice of photography as a business

[BigMackCam]

I've never tried "Street Photography". And given how irate this woman was, I don't think I'll ever try it.

I do very little street photography, but when I do, I tend to use my Q-7 or an old compact. Most people don't notice those, or if they do, they're not so concerned about them (some still are, though - I've had a few quizzical or wary looks on occasion). Even then, I never knowingly point the camera directly towards someone at close range.

I know some folks use DSLRs and larger mirrorless cameras for street work, but I just wouldn't want the attention and potential friction that can generate

[DeadJohn]

Might anyone have a link for the legal document I'm looking for?

Here's one reference that might help you Bert P. Krages - Attorney at Law

Some local police departments have issued their own memos intended for police officers and photographers.

Note that if someone has confronted you, police or civilian, their adrenaline has likely already kicked in, they think they are right (or else they wouldn't have started the confrontation), and they are unlikely to welcome your request that they read a pamphlet. Be aware of your adrenaline, too; their yelling at you can trigger reflexive responses that make it more difficult for you to stay calm.

If an enraged driver is yelling and you are on foot, position yourself so they can't run you over. Look for an exit route where a car can't follow. Put your camera back in your bag and fold your tripod so you can run or defend yourself if needed.

[swanlefitte]

I have security confront me. My 18-35mm at the Smoothie King Center from 100 yards was clearly for terrorist scounting.😂

I was cordial and explained my intentions and pointed out you can Google images better for scouting.
After much concern and radio talk I took my pictures surrounded by security. I thanked them for their diligence in following up instead of just being dicks. I suspect it was more to justify taking me down which didn't pan out. Instead I panned for my panorama. 😀

Photograpy, threat level 10!!!!!