Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
02-12-2020, 02:55 PM - 1 Like   #76
Pentaxian
Wheatfield's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The wheatfields of Canada
Posts: 11,834
QuoteOriginally posted by camera_nut Quote
Here are mine. l won't buy a body that doesn't have front/back focus correct for multiple lenses. Over the last 20 years since l've been into photography, l've had several film and digital SLRs that would front or back focus with certain lenses. l won't buy a body that has a rear screen less than 2.7 inches or less than 5 MP(those are non issues with anything less than about 12 years old). lf it doesn't have live view, it's a no go for me. l use LV with the image zoomed in for critical focus in close up photography when on a tripod. l won't buy a camera that has no viewfinder(but that's a mirrorless issue). No supersized bodies with a "built in" vertical grip that can't be removed. And full frame is out-they cost too much. What are yours?
I won't buy a body that has any lens mount other than Pentax K or Fuji X.

02-12-2020, 10:37 PM   #77
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
UncleVanya's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2014
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 16,447
QuoteOriginally posted by Serkevan Quote
I think there is no current camera company that has not orphaned at least one or two mounts.
Canon will stop development of new EF lenses (or at least drastically slow it down), but their portfolio is large enough for that to be a veritable "first world problem".
?

Pentax m42 lenses still work fine on modern bodies. K mount also. Orphaning means the body will not function effectively with the old lenses. Nikon did it to most but not all bodies dropping screw drive and crippling metering to a degree but kept the better bodies viable with older lenses so they get a D grade but not F. The adapter for Z mirrorless tries to make older lenses viable. Similarly Sony made A mount adapters with some success. M43 gave us adapters but the lack of pdaf sensor chips at the time made some lenses impossibly slow.

Really only Canon had the hubris to design a new mount that could not adapt old lenses. FDn to EF was a rotten deal. But that's not my beef.
02-13-2020, 01:04 AM   #78
Senior Member




Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: Riga
Posts: 126
Yes, but here the question is not so much like or dislike, but also purely commercial. If you want to sell your ef 35mm f/2is in a couple of years, will you get at least 50 percent of its price?Why invest in a dead system?I have already seen a drop in EF prices in the market, in my own country.A funny situation when you pay 50-100 eu extra and get L series.

---------- Post added 02-13-20 at 01:12 AM ----------

Management of canon lenses by wires, which will be, let's say , not very convenient.And reliability is questionable.Repairs are about 100eu and this is not a limits.This is not the M42 at all.

Last edited by Ivan; 02-13-2020 at 01:13 AM.
02-13-2020, 03:02 AM   #79
Pentaxian




Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 2,024
QuoteOriginally posted by UncleVanya Quote
?

Pentax m42 lenses still work fine on modern bodies. K mount also. Orphaning means the body will not function effectively with the old lenses. Nikon did it to most but not all bodies dropping screw drive and crippling metering to a degree but kept the better bodies viable with older lenses so they get a D grade but not F. The adapter for Z mirrorless tries to make older lenses viable. Similarly Sony made A mount adapters with some success. M43 gave us adapters but the lack of pdaf sensor chips at the time made some lenses impossibly slow.

Really only Canon had the hubris to design a new mount that could not adapt old lenses. FDn to EF was a rotten deal. But that's not my beef.
The comment I replied to *specifically* said "Don't forget the declared orphaning of a second mount in 2019". Stevebrot clearly meant orphaning the EF mount for the RF mount. In that regard, what I said is true.

I was not even alive when Canon killed the FD mount, so I can't comment on how outraged people were - but clearly it was not a lot because the EOS system skyrocketed Canon to top dog position.

02-13-2020, 10:00 AM   #80
Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Steve Beswick's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Ontario, California
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,696
QuoteOriginally posted by dlh Quote
touchscreens; I hate touchscreens

lack of an optical viewfinder

bad business practices, esp. refusal to honor warranties
On every touchscreen equipped DSLR Iíve ever seen, you donít actually need the touchscreen. Is its mere existence a problem, or only if it is required to use it?
02-13-2020, 12:23 PM   #81
Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Alex645's Avatar

Join Date: May 2015
Location: Kaneohe, HI
Photos: Albums
Posts: 2,764
QuoteOriginally posted by Steve Beswick Quote
On every touchscreen equipped DSLR Iíve ever seen, you donít actually need the touchscreen. Is its mere existence a problem, or only if it is required to use it?
Touchscreens are more expensive and often the manufacture will eliminate other features to justify it's cost. For example the Nikon D7500 has touchscreen but they went from the D7200 two card slot to one slot, lower res screen, and shorter battery life from greater draw from the screen.

There is also more tech needed for the screen to detect is it being touched by a finger or a face.....and how many times have you missed your target button on a touchscreen and then had to back out vs. a D-pad?
02-13-2020, 10:41 PM   #82
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
UncleVanya's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2014
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 16,447
QuoteOriginally posted by Serkevan Quote
The comment I replied to *specifically* said "Don't forget the declared orphaning of a second mount in 2019". Stevebrot clearly meant orphaning the EF mount for the RF mount. In that regard, what I said is true.

I was not even alive when Canon killed the FD mount, so I can't comment on how outraged people were - but clearly it was not a lot because the EOS system skyrocketed Canon to top dog position.

What you said was:

QuoteQuote:
I think there is no current camera company that has not orphaned at least one or two mounts.
Own what you say. You can't defend this.
02-13-2020, 10:59 PM   #83
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
twilhelm's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Florida
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 2,355
Some of us were affected by the orphaned Canon FD mount. It didn’t make my camera take any less quality pictures, but when I was ready to go to autofocus, the last company I was going to look toward was Canon. Which ultimately led me to Pentax.

But, as far as deal-breakers go... No K mount, I doubt I’ll buy it. If (or when) I add another body, I’d like to have the two card slots. I have no need of the built in flash, I’ll attach one when needed, but the GPS built in is a nice feature. I want a camera with a battery grip, but I need to be able to detach it, something I have always applauded Pentax for.

02-13-2020, 11:35 PM   #84
Pentaxian




Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 2,024
QuoteOriginally posted by UncleVanya Quote
What you said was:



Own what you say. You can't defend this.

Yes I can. Stevebrot said that Canon orphaned the EF mount in 2019. My reply said that every camera company has done *the same*: no more lenses for whatever the mount (A-mount, M42, EF, you name it). If our usage of the word "orphaning" is not the same as yours, then that sounds like totally not my problem; we are referring to two different things (and yes, for the FD, there is no other instance I can think of with completely axing a camera series - not counting all the rangefinder mounts killed to go SLR instead). I'm not going to discuss semantics in here anyway.

Last edited by Serkevan; 02-13-2020 at 11:44 PM.
02-14-2020, 12:01 AM - 1 Like   #85
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
UncleVanya's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2014
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 16,447
QuoteOriginally posted by Serkevan Quote
Yes I can. Stevebrot said that Canon orphaned the EF mount in 2019. My reply said that every camera company has done *the same*: no more lenses for whatever the mount (A-mount, M42, EF, you name it). If our usage of the word "orphaning" is not the same as yours, then that sounds like totally not my problem. I'm not going to discuss semantics in here.
I feel like we are at cross purposes. I'm not debating semantics just to annoy you. But I may have been misunderstanding your view.
You didn't live through those mount changes so maybe our perspective is different.

When a camera mount is discontinued, the impacts are mainly to future reuse of the lenses. Camera tech changes faster than lens tech. Even in film days the urge to change bodies was higher than the urge for new lenses that were mostly the same.

So when Canon changed to the ef mount, ever camera body using FD was obsolete for using new lenses, but more importantly every new body required an entire new lineup of lenses. That was far more disruptive than the examples I gave from Nikon or Pentax. In those cases adapters made reuse possible and allowed a slow transition keeping lens investments relevant.

However since your point appears focused on the loss of opportunity to use new lenses on old bodies and that that bodies get left behind by newer lens features or mounts: I agree. The evolution of the k mount clearly shows some loss of forward compatibility in the bodies which could be seen as orphaning those bodies.
02-14-2020, 12:26 AM   #86
Pentaxian




Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 2,024
Yeah, no hard feelings; I wouldn't have even posted were not because I felt the criticism on the EF/RF was too harsh (since you can use all EF lenses on RF bodies without any hassle, and as long as they are in production, the EF system is very much a great one already)
It was mostly a comment motivated by the fact that my M135/3.5 works better on my ME than my K-1
02-14-2020, 12:32 AM   #87
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
UncleVanya's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2014
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 16,447
QuoteOriginally posted by Serkevan Quote
Yeah, no hard feelings; I wouldn't have even posted were not because I felt the criticism on the EF/RF was too harsh (since you can use all EF lenses on RF bodies without any hassle, and as long as they are in production, the EF system is very much a great one already)
Same here. Common ground is hard to understand sometimes on a forum.

Modern mirrorless mount changes like Nikon and Canon and even Sony have come with good options for reuse of older glass. But the animosity against Canon stems from the fd transition. No other camera manufacturer has ever stranded as many lenses as they did. Ironically now that they finally have mirrorless some of the old FD lenses will finally see use again on Canon bodies!
02-14-2020, 12:36 AM   #88
Pentaxian




Join Date: Jan 2018
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 921
The FD to EF changeover was some time ago, in 1989. Thirty one years ago. Might we move away from discussing history or shall we rather lament Leica dropping the 39mm screw thread?
02-14-2020, 12:47 AM   #89
Pentaxian




Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 2,024
QuoteOriginally posted by UncleVanya Quote
Same here. Common ground is hard to understand sometimes on a forum.

Modern mirrorless mount changes like Nikon and Canon and even Sony have come with good options for reuse of older glass. But the animosity against Canon stems from the fd transition. No other camera manufacturer has ever stranded as many lenses as they did. Ironically now that they finally have mirrorless some of the old FD lenses will finally see use again on Canon bodies!
They were clearly playing the VERY long game
I can imagine that a lot of FD customers were substantially disgruntled with the "this is it, thanks and bye, buy EF" moment and I wouldn't be surprised if they got to that point without communicating anything to squeeze more sales out of unsuspecting photographers.
02-14-2020, 01:00 AM   #90
Veteran Member
redcat's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Paris
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,927
One word : EyeAF ! Mirrorless has that magic and now changes the game forever, Sony mastered it, Nikon and Canon follow closely. The Milc market is still open, Pentax can still have a piece of it, not too late like the FF one, dont't need to "test the water", jump right in pls !!!
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
85mm, advantage, bloggers, body, business, camera, canon, canon mirrorless, cars, crop, dislike, dslr, ef, eos, f1.2l, focus, generation, interface, lenses, line, mirror, photography, pm, post, sensors, sharpness, statement, systems, time
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Old tech shootout: your MX-1 vs your phone. Is your MX-1 still holding it's own? MD Optofonik Pentax Compact Cameras 7 05-16-2019 07:40 PM
Vote here in survey/poll about lenses requested for your Pentax DSLR - your wishlist beholder3 Pentax SLR Lens Discussion 33 09-29-2016 12:52 PM
When Do You Use Your K-01 vs. Your DSLR? Biro Pentax K-01 33 11-18-2012 11:57 AM
Control your DSLR shooting from your Android phone app photoleet Pentax DSLR Discussion 4 01-31-2012 12:20 AM
Your first time with your first DSLR? LeDave Troubleshooting and Beginner Help 32 07-13-2009 11:05 PM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:38 AM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top