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10-21-2020, 11:30 AM - 1 Like   #61
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
This is called being neighborly around here and is still something that is valued.
I am afraid that in many places fear and anger have displaced many of the important attributes that help initiate and maintain human relationships.
@Rondec, I read your post this morning at breakfast (on my iPad). Thanks, made my day!

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10-21-2020, 12:32 PM   #62
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QuoteOriginally posted by Astro-Baby Quote
......and looked like a collection of bulldogs sucking wee off a nettle and......
10-21-2020, 12:38 PM - 4 Likes   #63
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fenwoodian Quote
.
This morning was a beautiful autumn morning here in northern Wisconsin USA. This time of year I love to take my camera out shooting the beautiful fall colors.

Last year while shooting the autumn colors on a rural road from my car, a local farmer drove up to my car and got in my face about why I was taking photos of his farmstead.

Well on my morning stroll around the neighborhood this morning, while on a public sidewalk I was angrily confronted by a 30ish year old male home owner about taking photos of the colorful maple tree in his front yard.

In my area there are fewer and fewer places where photography with a large DSLR-style camera (especially with a large lens and a tripod) are accepted/allowed. While ubiquitous cell phone photographers are welcomed, those using "BIG" cameras/lenses/tripods are viewed with suspicion. For example, at the local farmers market, iphoneographers are ignored, but when I shoot the very same photo with my big camera I often get dirty looks.

In my area, places where I can photographic with my DSLRs in peace are becoming fewer and fewer. Mostly I'm left with shooting at governmental parks and botanical gardens (sometimes having to pay extra for being a proper "photographer", while of course the iphone photographer is not so charged).

I'm finding that for a truly stress free photographic experience I'm more and more turning inward and shooting on my own property, in my own gardens, or inside in my little studio.

These increasingly unpleasant encounters have me seriously considering dumping my DSLR gear and getting the new iPhone 12 (larger sensor & RAW files).

Are you too finding the "photographic oases" where you are allowed to photograph in your area are disappearing? Are you too turning inward with your photography and shooting more at home? Or maybe are you feeling the pull to switch to the more acceptable iphone camera to be less conspicuous?
I hate to say it, but this is a symptom of a sick society. That level of unreasonable paranoia is not healthy.
I can take my camera pretty much everywhere and take pictures of just about anything and not get hassled. I don't take pictures of little kids in playgrounds because that isn't a subject that interests me, but I live 5 minutes from my city's airport glide path and have never been questioned by anyone if I decide to set up the 600 on it's tripod and take pictures of what is taking off or landing.
I will wander around downtown doing architectural images, no one bothers me.
I will wander around our city parks taking pictures of defaced statues of our founding fathers, no one interrupts me.
I find it sad that your freedom to photograph is being impinged on, I find it sadder still that the reason for this is because the society you live in is devolving to failed state status.
10-21-2020, 05:59 PM - 1 Like   #64
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QuoteOriginally posted by Astro-Baby:
... The trick is stay polite but dont give ground, let them lose their temper not you ...
Confidently asserting your rights is often a good idea. I disagree with goading people into losing their temper, though. You end up wasting your time extending the unpleasant encounter, and increase the odds of it escalating.

Every photographer needs to customize their approach to their own personality and the surroundings.

10-21-2020, 09:34 PM   #65
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If any encounter causes conflict however small then, for me, any subsequent creativity vanishes. For this reason alone I will try and avoid it.
10-22-2020, 06:49 PM - 1 Like   #66
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I had the same problem back in 2001-2003 after the 911 disaster, but after that I never had any problems. Sure it's easier/safer to use your iphone, or a point-and-shoot, but your satisfaction is going to be limited with those tools. I developed sort of a sixth-sense of when to pull my camera out and when not too. In some areas that are not accustomed to tourist with cameras, sometimes you have to think twice, especially if you are carrying expensive equipment. The other day, I was driving in a very rural area with out-of-sate license plates, where nobody knew me and vise versa. I saw many beautiful scenes and I had my camera(DSLR) with me, but I chose to use my iphone to take pictures, because those pictures would not be so important that I should risk a confrontation. Sometimes people ask me "are you a professional photographer ?" and I say "YES working on an assignment" which of course is a big LIE, but at least I get them off my back... You are right though, things have closed up a little. These days, there are "designated tourist spots" where you can take your DSLR with 300mm lens and fire away without a worry, but if you saw some mysterious dude shooting away at your home with the same equipment how would you feel ?
10-22-2020, 11:45 PM - 1 Like   #67
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QuoteOriginally posted by DeadJohn Quote
Confidently asserting your rights is often a good idea. I disagree with goading people into losing their temper, though. You end up wasting your time extending the unpleasant encounter, and increase the odds of it escalating.

Every photographer needs to customize their approach to their own personality and the surroundings.
Yes, I didnt mean goad them into a tantrum just that if anyone is going to lose their temoer it should be them not you, stay calm and polite but dint give in. Giving in just allows them to close the gate to everyone else. You have to be willing to make a stand and not give in to people just because they are aggressive or threaten to call the cops.

---------- Post added 10-23-20 at 12:04 AM ----------

‘but if you saw some mysterious dude shooting away at your home with the same equipment how would you feel ?’

These days I would not be bothered. Back about 20 years ago I was involved in a rather dubious business which is best forgotten but a friend and partner turned on me and threatened to expose the story to the media after a fractious dispute over money.
About two days later I woke up, looked out the window and saw a TV crew outside my house. Bloody hell I thought, get your story straight and look good. Dont answer the door straight out of bed you will look a mess. So I put my warpaint on, did my hair, got into a nice outfit, all the while worrying they would start banging on the door any second, had a cup of coffee while anxiously waiting for the TV crew to start banging on the door. After about an hour I thought maybe they are waiting for me to go out and hoping to blindside me so I stayed put. I thought why put my head in a beartrap but after a few hours I thought to hell with it, go git em and shoot from the lip. So I braced myself walked out my front door, walked straight up to the obvious reporter holding the mike and said ‘ok ...what are you waiting for ?’
He replied ‘oh we are doing a piece on the poor state of the roads round here....would you like to comment on that as a resident ?’
Hahahahaha....
I have never worried about that sort of stuff ever since, paranoia is a useful tool but its too easy to let it en up running your life and suspecting the worst of everyone.

I later learned that my so called friend had in fact blown the story but the newspapers and local TV had decided it just wasnt interesting enough to bother with, so low down on the news agenda it fell even behind the poor state of road maintenance a relief but also a bit chastening that your own dodgy past and dealings, no matter how large they may be in your mind, to an outside agency just seem piffling and unimportant and less of an issue than a few potholes. The guilty fleeth where no man pursueth is an interesting maxim and might well be true for major crime but it would be fair to say for minor misdeeds the guilty fleeth even when no man giveth a toss.
10-23-2020, 02:16 AM - 1 Like   #68
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At one time the National Trust (a UK guardian of many historic houses and other properties) would not allow indoor photos for the stated BS reason that they could be used to assess the value of contents for later burglary. Yet they sold postcard photos of these items in their gift shop! Then when phone cameras came along it was suddenly OK! The same thing happened where I work, except you can only include people in your picture with permission and you can only use a phone camera, not a "real" one.

Here is an extract from the National Trust's policy from Photographic access | National Trust Images
It still leaves something to the managers discretion.
QuoteQuote:
Visitor Photography

Out of doors at NT properties

All visitors to National Trust properties are allowed to take photographs out of doors for their own private use. Any requests from individuals wishing to sell or publish photographs should be directed to images@nationaltrust.org.uk

Indoors at NT Properties

Amateur photography (including filming) without flash is now permitted in historic interiors at the Property or General Manager's discretion. As with outdoor photography, any photographs taken are strictly for private use, and enquiries about selling or publishing photographs should be directed to images@nationaltrust.org.uk.


10-23-2020, 05:24 AM - 1 Like   #69
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fenwoodian Quote
.
This morning was a beautiful autumn morning here in northern Wisconsin USA. This time of year I love to take my camera out shooting the beautiful fall colors.

Last year while shooting the autumn colors on a rural road from my car, a local farmer drove up to my car and got in my face about why I was taking photos of his farmstead.

Well on my morning stroll around the neighborhood this morning, while on a public sidewalk I was angrily confronted by a 30ish year old male home owner about taking photos of the colorful maple tree in his front yard.

In my area there are fewer and fewer places where photography with a large DSLR-style camera (especially with a large lens and a tripod) are accepted/allowed. While ubiquitous cell phone photographers are welcomed, those using "BIG" cameras/lenses/tripods are viewed with suspicion. For example, at the local farmers market, iphoneographers are ignored, but when I shoot the very same photo with my big camera I often get dirty looks.

In my area, places where I can photographic with my DSLRs in peace are becoming fewer and fewer. Mostly I'm left with shooting at governmental parks and botanical gardens (sometimes having to pay extra for being a proper "photographer", while of course the iphone photographer is not so charged).

I'm finding that for a truly stress free photographic experience I'm more and more turning inward and shooting on my own property, in my own gardens, or inside in my little studio.

These increasingly unpleasant encounters have me seriously considering dumping my DSLR gear and getting the new iPhone 12 (larger sensor & RAW files).

Are you too finding the "photographic oases" where you are allowed to photograph in your area are disappearing? Are you too turning inward with your photography and shooting more at home? Or maybe are you feeling the pull to switch to the more acceptable iphone camera to be less conspicuous?
It is a holdover from the post-9/11 advice to report anyone “suspiciously” taking photos of office buildings, amplified by current protectiveness of personal space. People are responding to the burgeoning intrusIons in our lives by government, and general online harassment.
10-23-2020, 05:48 AM - 1 Like   #70
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When we start talking about the rules and regulations, then that's a horse of a different color---in the Wizard of Oz way. Trying to make sense of them is pretty futile---and they are never written after checking the law or consulting with photographers.
10-23-2020, 04:14 PM   #71
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lord Lucan Quote
At one time the National Trust (a UK guardian of many historic houses and other properties) would not allow indoor photos for the stated BS reason that they could be used to assess the value of contents for later burglary.
On my one trip to the UK I was caught taking photos inside of a National Trust building. I honestly had no idea it was prohibited but when the uniformed guard informed me it was not allowed I politely apologized and put the camera away. Being in a foreign country and all I certainly did not want to make a scene. Only after the guard left did I notice the large sign I was standing next to saying "No Photographs". The guard likely thought I was a real jerk.
10-24-2020, 01:25 AM - 1 Like   #72
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QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
On my one trip to the UK I was caught taking photos inside of a National Trust building. I honestly had no idea it was prohibited but when the uniformed guard informed me it was not allowed I politely apologized and put the camera away. Being in a foreign country and all I certainly did not want to make a scene. Only after the guard left did I notice the large sign I was standing next to saying "No Photographs". The guard likely thought I was a real jerk.
The National Trust have basically given up with the No Photos rule. Once smartphones became omnipresent, this rule was done for. Now they say you can take photographs, but not for professional use, or whatever words they use. This is the reality organisations that had this No Photos rule have had to adapt to. That didn't stop some high end restaurants trying to ban their customers from taking shots of the food they'd been served. I wonder how that played out if the customers walked out, after all they were paying for the (often) excessively priced food.
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