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AfterPentax Mark II · 04-19-2021, 05:38 AM

Originally posted by D1N0

Why are so many people limited by convictions about the way they think things should be?

Because that is how we were brought up

.

photoptimist · 04-19-2021, 07:12 AM - **2 Likes**

Why are cameras limited by design? Three reasons:

1) Because people have limited budgets in money or weight: Features like pop-up flash and flippy screens add cost, weight, and bulk. Maybe it's not a lot of cost or weight but it's there and it rankles. Ironically, the more expensive the camera, the more aggrieved the customer feels if the camera has stuff they don't need. (BTW: I agree with others that the blogger's pop-up flash use sucks. Those pictures are evidence that pop-up flash should be banned.)

2) Because people don't want extraneous stuff that can break: Flippy screens and popup flashes are fragile. For photographers that want robust, weather-sealed, impact-tolerant gear, the fewer the fidgety articulated tidbits, the better. (Note: I do love the flippy screen of the K-1 but prior to owning a K-1, I used a ref convertor on the eyepiece which handled most of the low-angle, short-tripod, table-top scenarios of flippy screen use. If anything the ref convertor was superior to a flippy screen because the screen has problems in full sun.)

3) Because some people like the challenge of a limitation: that blogger is utterly wrong about monochrome cameras not being able to control the contrast in the image based on the colors in the scene. The difference between a monochrome camera and post-processing a color image into monochrome is that a monochrome camera forces the photographer to make any color-contrast choices BEFORE hitting the shutter button. Intelligent decisions in the use of physical color filters enable a monochrome camera user to modulate the brightness/darkness of flowers, autumn leaves, green foliage, blue skies, etc. Yes, that's "harder" than using a color sensor and some app's automagical monochrome button but some photographers love the challenge.

Sometimes less is more!

**FozzFoster** · 04-19-2021, 07:14 AM - **1 Like**

Personal preferences instead of true design limitations.
This article reads as first-draft ramblings.
Incoherent and unconcise.

**c.a.m** · 04-19-2021, 08:06 AM

The article appears to be simply a reflection of the author's personal preferences -- it's an opinion piece.

I think the title is misleading -- the 'limitations' he describes are certainly design choices, but could also be considered as advantages in the overall design. I believe the author is a longtime Engineer who has experience in several fields. I'm surprised he didn't cover the pros and cons, and the article doesn't really answer why certain features are omitted by design.

- Craig

Last edited by c.a.m; 04-19-2021 at 08:18 AM.

stevebrot · 04-19-2021, 08:18 AM - **1 Like**

Limitation by design sort of comes with the territory. The first cameras were simply light-tight boxes and were limited by the lack of shutters. Silly first camera makers!

Addendum: The crazy part is that pinhole and some barrel lens shooters still make photos that way...silly photogs!

Steve

stevebrot · 04-19-2021, 08:21 AM

Originally posted by AfterPentax Mark II

"Why write an atricle about monocrome cameras if you dont understand them." Well, explain the monochrome camera then. It seems you understand so you can explain them.

It is all about results.

Steve

(...would like a monochrome digital camera, just not willing to pay that much...)

Wheatfield · 04-19-2021, 08:27 AM

Originally posted by wed7

Thoughts?

Why Are So Many Cameras Limited by Design? | PetaPixel

This thread would be better served on DPReview.
Just a thought.

stevebrot · 04-19-2021, 08:43 AM

Originally posted by Wheatfield

This thread would be better served on DPReview.
Just a thought.

Do they actually click through to PetaPixel over there?

Steve

bertwert · 04-19-2021, 08:53 AM - **1 Like**

It's almost as if PetaPixel is having an article writing contest, where you get more tickets to the draw for a big prize the more articles you write... hence coming up with garbage articles... sound familiar?

Wheatfield · 04-19-2021, 09:01 AM

Originally posted by stevebrot

Do they actually click through to PetaPixel over there?

Steve

I was thinking more it is the level of thread topic expected there.

**EssJayEff** · 04-19-2021, 09:02 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by bertwert

hence coming up with garbage articles... sound familiar?

I know I will have a hard time coming up with 6, 5, 4 salient things to say today.

**Bob 256** · 04-19-2021, 09:04 AM

You can buy a house but it will never have enough bathrooms. Very limited.

However if you buy one with enough bathrooms, it will never have enough closets...............................................

house · 04-19-2021, 09:06 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by EssJayEff

"Form ever follows function." — Louis Henry Sullivan, architect"

^Detail by Louis Sullivan

Posting as a funny aside. His buildings were, compared to previous ones, rational in their overall structure and facade but that's not as interesting to point out

stevebrot · 04-19-2021, 09:07 AM

Originally posted by Bob 256

You can buy a house but it will never have enough bathrooms. Very limited.

However if you buy one with enough bathrooms, it will never have enough closets...............................................

Closet vs. water closet...so many choices

Steve

(...is it four posts yet...)

**EssJayEff** · 04-19-2021, 10:57 AM

Originally posted by house

but that's not as interesting to point out

Great example of functional ornamentation!

04-19-2021, 08:18 AM - 1 Like	#20
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Limitation by design sort of comes with the territory. The first cameras were simply light-tight boxes and were limited by the lack of shutters. Silly first camera makers! Addendum: The crazy part is that pinhole and some barrel lens shooters still make photos that way...silly photogs! Steve Last edited by stevebrot; 04-19-2021 at 08:28 AM.

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04-19-2021, 05:38 AM	#16
AfterPentax Mark II Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2021 Posts: 1,467	Originally posted by D1N0 Why are so many people limited by convictions about the way they think things should be? Because that is how we were brought up .

04-19-2021, 07:12 AM - 2 Likes	#17
photoptimist Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2016 Photos: Albums Posts: 5,129	Why are cameras limited by design? Three reasons: 1) Because people have limited budgets in money or weight: Features like pop-up flash and flippy screens add cost, weight, and bulk. Maybe it's not a lot of cost or weight but it's there and it rankles. Ironically, the more expensive the camera, the more aggrieved the customer feels if the camera has stuff they don't need. (BTW: I agree with others that the blogger's pop-up flash use sucks. Those pictures are evidence that pop-up flash should be banned.) 2) Because people don't want extraneous stuff that can break: Flippy screens and popup flashes are fragile. For photographers that want robust, weather-sealed, impact-tolerant gear, the fewer the fidgety articulated tidbits, the better. (Note: I do love the flippy screen of the K-1 but prior to owning a K-1, I used a ref convertor on the eyepiece which handled most of the low-angle, short-tripod, table-top scenarios of flippy screen use. If anything the ref convertor was superior to a flippy screen because the screen has problems in full sun.) 3) Because some people like the challenge of a limitation: that blogger is utterly wrong about monochrome cameras not being able to control the contrast in the image based on the colors in the scene. The difference between a monochrome camera and post-processing a color image into monochrome is that a monochrome camera forces the photographer to make any color-contrast choices BEFORE hitting the shutter button. Intelligent decisions in the use of physical color filters enable a monochrome camera user to modulate the brightness/darkness of flowers, autumn leaves, green foliage, blue skies, etc. Yes, that's "harder" than using a color sensor and some app's automagical monochrome button but some photographers love the challenge. Sometimes less is more!

04-19-2021, 07:14 AM - 1 Like	#18
FozzFoster Custom User Title Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Alberta Photos: Albums Posts: 6,808	Personal preferences instead of true design limitations. This article reads as first-draft ramblings. Incoherent and unconcise.

04-19-2021, 08:06 AM	#19
c.a.m Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Ottawa, Canada Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,193	The article appears to be simply a reflection of the author's personal preferences -- it's an opinion piece. I think the title is misleading -- the 'limitations' he describes are certainly design choices, but could also be considered as advantages in the overall design. I believe the author is a longtime Engineer who has experience in several fields. I'm surprised he didn't cover the pros and cons, and the article doesn't really answer why certain features are omitted by design. - Craig Last edited by c.a.m; 04-19-2021 at 08:18 AM.

04-19-2021, 08:21 AM	#21
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by AfterPentax Mark II "Why write an atricle about monocrome cameras if you dont understand them." Well, explain the monochrome camera then. It seems you understand so you can explain them. It is all about results. Steve (...would like a monochrome digital camera, just not willing to pay that much...)

04-19-2021, 08:27 AM	#22
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,987	Originally posted by wed7 Thoughts? Why Are So Many Cameras Limited by Design? \| PetaPixel This thread would be better served on DPReview. Just a thought.

04-19-2021, 08:43 AM	#23
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by Wheatfield This thread would be better served on DPReview. Just a thought. Do they actually click through to PetaPixel over there? Steve

04-19-2021, 08:53 AM - 1 Like	#24
bertwert Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Golden, BC Posts: 15,172	It's almost as if PetaPixel is having an article writing contest, where you get more tickets to the draw for a big prize the more articles you write... hence coming up with garbage articles... sound familiar?

04-19-2021, 09:01 AM	#25
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,987	Originally posted by stevebrot Do they actually click through to PetaPixel over there? Steve I was thinking more it is the level of thread topic expected there.

04-19-2021, 09:02 AM - 1 Like	#26
EssJayEff Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: near Saxapahaw, NC Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 975	Originally posted by bertwert hence coming up with garbage articles... sound familiar? I know I will have a hard time coming up with 6, 5, 4 salient things to say today.

04-19-2021, 09:04 AM	#27
Bob 256 Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Idaho Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,378	You can buy a house but it will never have enough bathrooms. Very limited. However if you buy one with enough bathrooms, it will never have enough closets...............................................

04-19-2021, 09:06 AM - 1 Like	#28
house Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 3,306	Originally posted by EssJayEff "Form ever follows function." — Louis Henry Sullivan, architect" ^Detail by Louis Sullivan Posting as a funny aside. His buildings were, compared to previous ones, rational in their overall structure and facade but that's not as interesting to point out

04-19-2021, 09:07 AM	#29
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by Bob 256 You can buy a house but it will never have enough bathrooms. Very limited. However if you buy one with enough bathrooms, it will never have enough closets............................................... Closet vs. water closet...so many choices Steve (...is it four posts yet...)

04-19-2021, 10:57 AM	#30
EssJayEff Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: near Saxapahaw, NC Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 975	Originally posted by house but that's not as interesting to point out Great example of functional ornamentation!