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09-25-2018, 03:30 PM - 1 Like   #1
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Corrupt Images: Any last suggestions before I send the K1 in for repairs?

Hello,
I've been searching the web and the forums for any hint at what might be causing my problem, and I've think I've replaced everything I can to rule out a hardware issues. I've attached an image here so there isn't any question about what I'm seeing. As a few of you have experienced this. So here's what I've done over the past 2 years to address this:
1. Laptop and harddrives have been replaced - I upgraded the system so this was an easy swap. Currently I'm using a 1TB SSD drive to store my images. The drive is in Slot 2 of the laptop. NOT connected via USB.

2. I've used several different types of SD CARD readers from usb 2.0, usb 3.0 to USB C reader to import the images.

3. To rule out a LR import issue, I've copied the files manually to a HD source before import. The images are bad on the SD Card

3. Swapped out cables like there was no tomorrow.
4. Purchased different SD cards (great way to justifying my larger cards)
5. Tested different Import methods: Import from SD Card via Lightning reader to LR on my IPAD Pro, Multiple SDCARD readers to Laptop Windows LR. Either way, I find corrupt images.
6. No difference writing to Slot 1 or Slot 2 in the camera.

What I haven't tried:
A. Setup camera to write to SLOT 1 and SLOT 2 simultaneously and do a comparison of the images and see if the same images show corruption..What would that mean?
B. Shoot only in JPG, Not really an option, but I don't know what this would prove.



I'll be done vacationing soon so I can send in the camera for repairs, but I can't reproduce the problem and I'm not sure that they'd be able to debug this. I would assume that they'd start to replace hardware and hope for the best. So any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Regards,
Rodney

Attached Images
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PENTAX K-1 Mark II  Photo 
09-25-2018, 03:47 PM   #2
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How many images has this occurred on, Rodney? Is it just the JPEG preview that's showing as corrupted, or both the preview and the raw?

Also, have you tried a different post-processing software (such as Pentax's own)? Have you tried it on a different computer?

Some months ago, I had a similar problem with my Q7 files imported to digiKam under Linux, and it turned out that the files were actually fine. There was something wrong with digiKam. Deleting and re-installing the latest version resolved the problem...
09-25-2018, 04:26 PM - 1 Like   #3
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If this is showing up on your camera when you review an image, you can immediately rule out everything else downstream (card reader, computer, etc.). It would have to be either your camera or the SD card and since you have used multiple SD cards, it would most likely be camera related.

If this doesn't show up until you look at your images outside your camera, then it can be something else and software can most certainly be suspect as BigMackCam suggested.

Have you formatted each SD card in your camera prior to use? That would be the only thing which could affect SD card performance across different SD cards. Just out of curiosity, how large and what type of SD cards are you using? What version of Windows are you running?
09-25-2018, 04:29 PM - 2 Likes   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by lazarustx Quote
but I can't reproduce the problem
Dang! Intermittent problems are the hardest sort!
  • Do they look like this with in-camera review or image preview? If so, they were corrupted either as part of image processing or on write to the card.
  • Is this RAW-only or is there the occasional JPEG?
  • As noted above, if the embedded JPEG preview for RAW is fine, the issue may be with the RAW converter. The preview JPEGs may be extracted using ExifTool or dcraw. If shooting DNG and have the Adobe DNG codecs installed, the OS finder previews use the embedded JPEGs. The embedded JPEGs are also used by the camera for the in-camera review mode.
  • Have you tried reformatting using the utility from the SD Association?
That last is sort of the go-to solution for all manner of SD card issues. A format using the SD Associations tool with the overwrite option will often correct card issues. Follow-up with an in-camera format and see if things improve.

SD Association | SD Card Format Utility

Note: It is advisable to not use the computer operating systems format utility on SD cards.


Steve


Last edited by stevebrot; 09-25-2018 at 04:50 PM.
09-25-2018, 06:29 PM   #5
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Same Problem - Ricoh GRII

Guys,

I have owned Pentax DSLRs from the K10D to the K1 and have never had a problem. However I have also owned the Ricoh GR and currently the GRII and both have produced these corrupt images on what appears to be a random basis.

I have attempted to find a fix in the past through the Ricoh Forum, without success and haven't been able to get much traction here.


I commonly save images to the same SD (GR only has one) as both DNG and JPG. On occasions where I find a corrupt image, it seems to be the DNG file only - the JPG is my fall back.

I have historically used LR but have also tried Capture One , DxO and RawTherapee as editors as well as a freeware app called Irfanview. Each can read DNG files, occasionally (not often) the fault shows in one and not the other, however predominantly, the same fault appears apparently regardless of software. Frustratingly, the correct image has often shown in preview mode before the banding and colour corruption overlay as the image is chosen for editing.

For the above reasons, I don't think it is your camera, leastwise the hardware, it may be the firmware or perhaps the brand or type of SD card. I haven't been able to check or trial them.


Anyway, that is my experience and I probably lose maybe 1% of my images on the Ricoh. Murphy's Law, it always seems to be that perfect shot too lol.

A solution would be wonderful.

Here is a screenshot of a recent corrupt image https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/members/39261-frankoz/albums/12778-misc/picture120158.jpg


Rgds,
John

Last edited by frankoz; 09-25-2018 at 11:26 PM. Reason: add image
09-25-2018, 06:30 PM   #6
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I don't have too much to add beyond what others have said. However, I will mention that the resulting image look similar to those I saw from time to time from aging Canon P&S Powershot cameras from my photo lab days. The issue was with faulty CCDs from Sony, or rather "disconnected internal wiring of the CCD". This was apparently seen correlating with high temperature, high humidity environments, but should have still operated properly. Of course, the K-1 has a CMOS sensor, but I suppose either technology could produce something like this.

It's too bad the problem isn't regular reproduced - If I'm not mistaken you could set the camera for instant review and shoot without a card. Naturally, you won't get a saved image, but anything taken by the sensor will at least be presented on the screen for a limited period of time. This would rule out a glitchy card.

What about using Live View? Don't actually shoot anything, just use the screen as your viewfinder and see if you get any odd results over a period of time.
09-25-2018, 06:34 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Dang! Intermittent problems are the hardest sort!
  • Do they look like this with in-camera review or image preview? If so, they were corrupted either as part of image processing or on write to the card.
  • Is this RAW-only or is there the occasional JPEG?
  • As noted above, if the embedded JPEG preview for RAW is fine, the issue may be with the RAW converter. The preview JPEGs may be extracted using ExifTool or dcraw. If shooting DNG and have the Adobe DNG codecs installed, the OS finder previews use the embedded JPEGs. The embedded JPEGs are also used by the camera for the in-camera review mode.
  • Have you tried reformatting using the utility from the SD Association?
That last is sort of the go-to solution for all manner of SD card issues. A format using the SD Associations tool with the overwrite option will often correct card issues. Follow-up with an in-camera format and see if things improve.

SD Association | SD Card Format Utility

Note: It is advisable to not use the computer operating systems format utility on SD cards.


Steve
Thanks for the link to the SD Association utility; I never knew the animal existed. I will try that with my GR's SD

---------- Post added 26th Sep 2018 at 11:06 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by LowVoltage Quote
I don't have too much to add beyond what others have said. However, I will mention that the resulting image look similar to those I saw from time to time from aging Canon P&S Powershot cameras from my photo lab days. The issue was with faulty CCDs from Sony, or rather "disconnected internal wiring of the CCD". This was apparently seen correlating with high temperature, high humidity environments, but should have still operated properly. Of course, the K-1 has a CMOS sensor, but I suppose either technology could produce something like this.

It's too bad the problem isn't regular reproduced - If I'm not mistaken you could set the camera for instant review and shoot without a card. Naturally, you won't get a saved image, but anything taken by the sensor will at least be presented on the screen for a limited period of time. This would rule out a glitchy card.

What about using Live View? Don't actually shoot anything, just use the screen as your viewfinder and see if you get any odd results over a period of time.
Thanks @LowVoltage, from memory, the corruption isn't evident when reviewing images "in camera".
09-25-2018, 07:28 PM - 1 Like   #8
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This is most likely from a faulty SD card or the SDCard not being formatted. It will not show up on in camera review because you are seeing a small imbedded jpg there. Perhaps your K-1 has a software fault and does not properly format the cards. I few years ago I bought a couple Sony SD cards that nearly always had the first one or two images corrupted. So I always wasted two shots after formatting the cards, until I replaced them with SanDisk cards. several years ago I lost several photos when I forgot to format a new card. I now format after every time I transfer photos, which is specified by some camera manufacturers.

09-25-2018, 09:17 PM - 1 Like   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by lazarustx Quote
A. Setup camera to write to SLOT 1 and SLOT 2 simultaneously and do a comparison of the images and see if the same images show corruption..What would that mean?
B. Shoot only in JPG, Not really an option, but I don't know what this would prove.
In case A, if you had a corrupted file on one card, but not the other, that might indicate that the writing process is the problem; if they were both corrupted in the exact same way, it would perhaps indicate that there is a problem in the camera's memory/processing. Though corruption that is different on one card to the other could still be ambiguous as to whether it is the camera or the cards.

Different corruption where one card is corrupted but the other is not, might indicate a bad card, but yo shod switch the cards to the other slots and see if the corruption follows the cards, or the card slots.
09-26-2018, 06:47 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Bob 256 Quote
If this is showing up on your camera when you review an image, you can immediately rule out everything else downstream (card reader, computer, etc.). It would have to be either your camera or the SD card and since you have used multiple SD cards, it would most likely be camera related.

If this doesn't show up until you look at your images outside your camera, then it can be something else and software can most certainly be suspect as BigMackCam suggested.

Have you formatted each SD card in your camera prior to use? That would be the only thing which could affect SD card performance across different SD cards. Just out of curiosity, how large and what type of SD cards are you using? What version of Windows are you running?
I've using anything from an 8 GB to 128 gb cards from a few reputable SD Card makers. The corruption doesn't appear to be specific to one slot or a type/brand of card. Thanks!

---------- Post added 09-26-18 at 08:55 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
How many images has this occurred on, Rodney? Is it just the JPEG preview that's showing as corrupted, or both the preview and the raw?

Also, have you tried a different post-processing software (such as Pentax's own)? Have you tried it on a different computer?

Some months ago, I had a similar problem with my Q7 files imported to digiKam under Linux, and it turned out that the files were actually fine. There was something wrong with digiKam. Deleting and re-installing the latest version resolved the problem...
Way too many, about 3 - 5% of my images so its frequent, but sometimes its NONE of the images in a shoot. With Ricoh's Digital Camera Utility, I don't see the corruption! Perhaps I need to remove and reinstall LR.....Hmmmmm

---------- Post added 09-26-18 at 09:00 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by frankoz Quote
Thanks for the link to the SD Association utility; I never knew the animal existed. I will try that with my GR's SD

---------- Post added 26th Sep 2018 at 11:06 AM ----------


Thanks @LowVoltage, from memory, the corruption isn't evident when reviewing images "in camera".
Interesting...I don't recall ever seeing the faulty image on my camera's LCD. I'll start monitoring this. I could also focus on doing a live shoot one day and see if any of those images show up as bad. Hmmmm...These are all great tips/suggestions!

I never use the PC to format the cards and I don't always format them. I'll begin to do so although I was holding off doing so in case I could recover some of the images. I guess I'll put the stake in the ground and start fresh and see where that goes.

---------- Post added 09-26-18 at 09:01 AM ----------

The biggest bummer, I think, is that I purchased an extended warranty on the K1. And I could probably submit it for repair if I thought it was a hardware problem. However, I'm not sure how the 3rd Party warranty folks are going to take the fact that the K1 was upgraded to a K1 Mk II.

Argh!
09-26-2018, 08:12 AM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by lazarustx Quote
................................... With Ricoh's Digital Camera Utility, I don't see the corruption! Perhaps I need to remove and reinstall LR.....Hmmmmm.....................................Interesting...I don't recall ever seeing the faulty image on my camera's LCD. I'll start monitoring this. I could also focus on doing a live shoot one day and see if any of those images show up as bad....................... and I don't always format them. I'll begin to do so
I'm pretty sure it's your software and not your camera. Being that you've never seen it on your LCD in review mode says that the card is being written properly and can be read without errors. What happens if you put the card back in your camera and try to look at the "bad" image using the LCD screen?

You ALWAYS need to format a card before using it the first time. Failure to do so could certainly contribute to problems later on in both writing and reading from that card. It's a good idea to format a card whenever you copy it to a permanent file and want to clear it and start reusing it again. Formatting will not only erase the card (not good for security purposes but for camera use), it will give you a card with a proper structure for writing. Formatting is best done in the camera since some computer "formatting" procedures are not implemented correctly.

If your software is at fault, you can find out by reading a bad image with a software that normally works all the time like the one you mentioned. Unless the bad software is actually corrupting your card, you will not only be able to recover the bad image, but pull it off the card for use. Of course, do this before you format the card. The fact that a given software works most of the time, doesn't mean it can't "burp" once in a while and do something strange, though it shouldn't. Your suggestion about reloading Lightroom is plausable but keep in mind, that copy of the software may have a fault and reloading won't fix it. You can try it but if the issue persists, I would request a new copy of the software from Adobe (or move to some other software which is dependable).

Last edited by Bob 256; 09-26-2018 at 08:21 AM.
09-26-2018, 09:12 AM   #12
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You could also find several corrupted images, and then see if those images are still on the card, and try copying them again and see if you get the same result. If the corruption does not exist on the newly-copied versions of the images, then it is probably not the camera or the card.

You could also copy several copies of an image folder from the card to your computer initially, then compare the images for corruption either as a test, or at a later date when you detect corruption in one of them.
09-26-2018, 11:12 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by lazarustx Quote
With Ricoh's Digital Camera Utility, I don't see the corruption! Perhaps I need to remove and reinstall LR.....Hmmmmm
So there's likely nothing wrong with your camera, cards, or PC.
If you use the same hardware to view the same file and one piece of software shows it fine, and the other not, them the software looks the likely culprit.
Apologies if I'm mis-reading.
09-26-2018, 11:02 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by leekil Quote
You could also find several corrupted images, and then see if those images are still on the card, and try copying them again and see if you get the same result. If the corruption does not exist on the newly-copied versions of the images, then it is probably not the camera or the card.

You could also copy several copies of an image folder from the card to your computer initially, then compare the images for corruption either as a test, or at a later date when you detect corruption in one of them.


Iíll report back after tomorrowís travels...I hope to get a chance to shoot some...




---------- Post added 09-27-18 at 01:04 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by leekil Quote
You could also find several corrupted images, and then see if those images are still on the card, and try copying them again and see if you get the same result. If the corruption does not exist on the newly-copied versions of the images, then it is probably not the camera or the card.

You could also copy several copies of an image folder from the card to your computer initially, then compare the images for corruption either as a test, or at a later date when you detect corruption in one of them.


Iíll test this tomorrow....

---------- Post added 09-27-18 at 01:20 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by MrMojo Quote
So there's likely nothing wrong with your camera, cards, or PC.

If you use the same hardware to view the same file and one piece of software shows it fine, and the other not, them the software looks the likely culprit.

Apologies if I'm mis-reading.


Iím going to test this tomorrow after my next outing...
09-26-2018, 11:34 PM - 1 Like   #15
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As an aside, it's a pretty cool effect! If it turns out to not be your camera or card you might have a gold mine for modern art!
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