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12-02-2018, 09:35 AM   #1
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Right to fixing a fault under warranty?

Hello,


sorry if this is the wrong part of the forum , please move if so. Im just looking for some advice on if a K50 fault can be refused for repair if under warranty? Its a John Lewis warranty, its likely the aperture issue that ive seem mentioned on here - (all images were suddenly very dark despite the light available)


They are claiming that 'it cannot be fixed' there was also mention of 'Beyond Economical Repair.' they have not confirmed what the fault is, I have requested their report.


Would the cost to fix an aperture fault really be above the price of the camera? ( im based in the UK)


They will only offer me refund which isn't really what I would like as I got it at a reduced price because it was the last of its type and they were clearing stock, so getting an equivalent is going to be difficult.


I noticed this on their website:


If we can't repair your item, we'll replace it with an item of equivalent specification. If no equivalent product is available, we'll either offer you the nearest equivalent specification or its selling price value , and we'll always do our best to make sure you're satisfied with the outcome

They have offered me no 'equivalent' which I assume would exists across their range of Canon etc? this also makes no mention of choosing not to repair because it is deemed to expensive.


Would really appreciate if anyone has had to deal with this and could advise on if I can do anything.


Thanks!

12-02-2018, 10:20 AM   #2
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QuoteOriginally posted by chutzpah Quote
Would the cost to fix an aperture fault really be above the price of the camera? ( im based in the UK)
The cost to repair is about $150 - $180 USD here in the U.S., but who knows what it may cost in the U.K.. The fix is to replace a small solenoid that controls the aperture actuator. The current market equivalent in the Pentax range is the K-70.


Steve
12-02-2018, 10:31 AM - 1 Like   #3
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I have always found John Lewis to be one of the most honourable stores in the UK. My advice is to pursue a dialogue with them.

I thought aperture block failure (which I think you refer to) is fixable ? The fact that the authorised Pentax repairers have very recently changed may be causing an issue. You could try at least speaking with new Pentax authorised agents:
John Pye & Sons Ltd
Contact details:
Tim Kessel - KesselT@jpss.co.uk
Tel: 01782 753 342

This situation does crop up quite regularly with consumer goods. A retailer offers a low price deal on a product, perhaps to shift stock. Product is faulty, cannot be repaired and retailer has no more stock to sell at that price. Retailer offers a refund of the purchase price , but consumer expects to get the product replaced. I can see both sides of the argument. Retailer has sold you a 600 camera for 300 so considers its liability to be 300. You consider you have bought a 600 camera and want a perfect example of one. I dont think JL sells Pentax anymore.

For what it is worth I always buy kit from a specialist camera shop that is a main dealer in Pentax. Not from a general retailer like JL. But at least with John Lewis you are dealing with a decent company.

Last edited by pschlute; 12-02-2018 at 10:45 AM.
12-02-2018, 10:48 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by chutzpah Quote
I noticed this on their website:


If we can't repair your item, we'll replace it with an item of equivalent specification. If no equivalent product is available, we'll either offer you the nearest equivalent specification or its selling price value , and we'll always do our best to make sure you're satisfied with the outcome
So I guess this is not warrenty from Pentax, wich lasts for 2 years in the EU, but instead an extra warrenty from the shop. These are very different for consumers. They do offer something that is said in the warrenty, giving back your money. The cheapest offering for them, but nontheless it is part of your agreement. Maybe a good talk could change that, but there is no law in Europe backing you up on this.

12-02-2018, 10:51 AM   #5
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Thanks both, that clarifies things a little more.


and yes I suspect half the issue is that they don't carry Pentax anymore, which makes finding an equivalent more difficult, and that they sold to me at a reduced price, if it was ex display I could understand them wanting to stick to the 'ex display' price - but it was bought perfect in the box its had low usage and been cared for very well!


I will contact the new repairers direct as you advise and wait for the report. Im assuming if they confirm the repair price as being similar to my reduced price I can still push for a fix?


Is the K70 not a much better camera? the prices certainly seem to be the next rung up, how about the K-S1 or K-S2? although if they don't sell them its sort of academic! what I was thinking was I could ask for a similarly priced simpler camera ( think they are called bridge?) then try and buy a Pentax equivalent down the line - JL have Panasonic Lumix, Sony Cybershot and Nikon Coolpix.

---------- Post added 12-02-18 at 05:53 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
So I guess this is not warrenty from Pentax, wich lasts for 2 years in the EU, but instead an extra warrenty from the shop. These are very different for consumers. They do offer something that is said in the warrenty, giving back your money. The cheapest offering for them, but nontheless it is part of your agreement. Maybe a good talk could change that, but there is no law in Europe backing you up on this.


Hi Ron,


im assuming im under warranty for both - the camera was bought Jan 2017, I went to JL first because you are supposed to go to the merchant first from what I recall. Is the Pentax warranty any different?


Thanks

---------- Post added 12-02-18 at 05:56 PM ----------

Forgot to add - they have made no effort to find an equivalent product first which it appears is what they should be doing - that would of course be another brand but it doesn't look like they are too invested in coming up with a goosd solution for me.
12-02-2018, 11:06 AM   #6
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I'm not familiar with John Lewis, other than having bought a few things at one of their London outlets. Their statement of guarantee seems to be open to interpretation, although it suggests that they'll try hard to take care of their customer.

It's not clear what is meant by a product of "equivalent specification" and its availability. Certainly, the intent is not to necessarily replace the original product with one of identical specification. One might reasonably claim that the camera lens mount is one of the primary specifications that would need to be met by a replacement, which in this case drives the replacement towards a Pentax model. But if they don't carry or deal in Pentax currently -- i.e., it's not available from within their line of merchandise -- what is a reasonable course?


A refund might be a reasonably generous outcome, but if the customer is not satisfied, has JL done their "best."?

Does John Lewis expect the camera to be returned to them? Assuming it can't be repaired or is not repairable economically, let's assume that they have concluded that the original camera is worthless (to them). Perhaps you could accept their refund, but keep the camera and get it repaired yourself?

- Craig
12-02-2018, 11:19 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by c.a.m Quote

Does John Lewis expect the camera to be returned to them? Assuming it can't be repaired or is not repairable economically, let's assume that they have concluded that the original camera is worthless (to them). Perhaps you could accept their refund, but keep the camera and get it repaired yourself?

- Craig


You know, this could be a good option if the authorized repair company give a decent quote, ive emailed them.


I don't want to sound unreasonable, I do realise that JL not carrying Pentax complicates it for them - 'equivalent' could mean in price thus me looking at their point and shoots in the similar price range or as you said finding a DSLR to a similar standard - im assuming though that brand shouldn't come into it of that's the case?
12-02-2018, 11:27 AM - 1 Like   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by chutzpah Quote
Hi Ron,


im assuming im under warranty for both - the camera was bought Jan 2017, I went to JL first because you are supposed to go to the merchant first from what I recall. Is the Pentax warranty any different?


Thanks.
O yes this is very different. You should ask (or demand) to send the camera to Pentax for repair under warrenty. That should be free of cost for you. The camera shop is your dealer and as such should do his work and serve the warrenty you have a legal right to with in the EU for two years after purchase.

12-02-2018, 11:31 AM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
O yes this is very different. You should ask (or demand) to send the camera to Pentax for repair under warrenty. That should be free of cost for you. The camera shop is your dealer and as such should do his work and serve the warrenty you have a legal right to with in the EU for two years after purchase.


Thanks! will get the repair quote and fault report first then go back to them




I'm assuming that the Pentax warranty wouldn't refuse a fix that is considered 'close' in cost to the original price paid?
12-02-2018, 11:42 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by chutzpah Quote
Thanks! will get the repair quote and fault report first then go back to them




I'm assuming that the Pentax warranty wouldn't refuse a fix that is considered 'close' in cost to the original price paid?
Pentax should invest the camera and repair it. Or if not possible replace it.


About the difference between the warrenty from Pentax (the first two years) and the extended warranty from the store. This is mostly for three extra years up to the camera is 5 years old. The three extra years are from a legal position not a warrenty, but act as an insurance that wil cover some problems that can occur, but with limitations on the things offered as problem sollutions.

---------- Post added 02-12-18 at 19:48 ----------

Only of the camera would come from grey import......then this might be different.....
12-02-2018, 11:57 AM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by chutzpah Quote
im assuming im under warranty for both - the camera was bought Jan 2017
QuoteOriginally posted by chutzpah Quote
I'm assuming that the Pentax warranty wouldn't refuse a fix that is considered 'close' in cost to the original price paid?
What is the length on the Pentax warranty. What is the length of the JL warranty ?

You need to be a bit clearer with the details
12-02-2018, 11:58 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote

About the difference between the warrenty from Pentax (the first two years) and the extended warranty from the store. This is mostly for three extra years up to the camera is 5 years old. The three extra years are from a legal position not a warrenty, but act as an insurance that wil cover some problems that can occur, but with limitations on the things offered as problem sollutions.

---------- Post added 02-12-18 at 19:48 ----------

...
I remember coming across this with my previous Pentax ( the 5 year ), it was within the extended period but had been in storage for some time - I coudn't prove that the fault was inherent from the beginning and the vendor had gone out of business, Pentax refused to fix or replace, I recall it being very difficult to get accepted, in the end my credit card gave me a partial refund ( bearing in mind its age) and that was a pain to get as well.


Is there really no 'just above entry level' Pentax available these days that would be considered equivalent?

---------- Post added 12-02-18 at 06:59 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by pschlute Quote
Pentax warranty is 12 months I believe, so you are out of time on that. What is the JL warranty ?

You need to be a bit clearer with the details


JL 2 years -I said it was bought in Jan '17 so its within 2 years?
12-02-2018, 12:06 PM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by chutzpah Quote
JL 2 years -I said it was bought in Jan '17 so its within 2 years?
OK so you are relying on the JL warranty, which will be subject to their terms and conditions.

I suggest speaking directly to them and try and get them to improve the offer of your money back.

They won't be wanting to supply you with a new KP if that is what you are thinking ! But then again, JL is a good company, maybe they will.
12-02-2018, 12:19 PM - 1 Like   #14
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The K-70 is the current equivalent. It is indeed a superior camera, having numerous upgrades. Not saying that repairing the K-50 is not worthwhile, but since there apparently are difficulties there getting that done, the alternative might be a consideration.
12-02-2018, 12:25 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by pschlute Quote
They won't be wanting to supply you with a new KP if that is what you are thinking ! .
Ha! No - just trying for a little more than - 'we will keep the camera and give you the lower price back'


Honestly it puts me off buying discounted cameras if its going to be really hard to get the RRP of that time if it gets a fault...

---------- Post added 12-02-18 at 07:26 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by mikesbike Quote
The K-70 is the current equivalent. It is indeed a superior camera, having numerous upgrades. Not saying that repairing the K-50 is not worthwhile, but since there apparently are difficulties there getting that done, the alternative might be a consideration.

Yes that makes sense - I just didn't want to walk in there all cavalier demanding a camera that is much better - anyway as they have stopped doing Pentax it sort of puts a spanner in the work in terms of actual 'equivalent'
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