Win a Pentax Limited Lens: Raffle Now Live!

johnkrumm · 09-30-2016, 05:54 AM

I'm used to my cameras taking the full image and keeping all the data whatever the crop. For instance, on my EM1 I could set the crop to 1:1 or 3:2 or 16:9 or even a portrait crop, but then it's all adjustable in Lightroom, or can be reverted to the normal 4:3. That's one of the main advantages of digital, being able to change things after the fact.

I was a little surprised that the K1 didn't offer more crop modes at least in live view, but it's not a huge deal.

andymuns · 09-30-2016, 09:57 AM - **1 Like**

Pentax gave us a little gift of another feature the 1:1 crop, here is an idea i you don't want to use it then don't. Really we don't need anymore Complaining...

**acoufap** · 09-30-2016, 12:00 PM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by Tjompen1968

I do find it very convenient to be able to see the final crop in the OVF or LV.

It is very convenient to be able to see the final crop in the OVF or LV.

I did a test and generated a raw DNG file. Mac Preview shows the square image - think that is the original camera preview.

When I import the image into Capture One it generates an image from the square crop and shows a preview stretched to 3:2 - really unfortunate. Seems there is no implementation standards for camera defined raw crops? Or it's simply a bug in CO9.

Since I always shoot raw and use CO to develop the images I won't use the crop mode as long as it is not properly usable within CO.

Edit:
Did a test using Adobe Bridge CS4 - Camera Raw. No problem. The DNG file is shown as square crop and the generated JPG file also looks good. So I guess Capture One 9 has a problem. I'll report it to Phase One.

Edit:
Now reported to Phase One.

Class A · 09-30-2016, 06:54 PM

Originally posted by acoufap

Now reported to Phase One.

Thanks!

A workaround for now would be to shoot using the PEF format -- images appear uncropped but also undistorted in C1 -- and then use the 1x1 ratio option to get the square format crop relatively quickly.

Not a Number · 09-30-2016, 09:58 PM - **1 Like**

So you're pretty much back to stage one and have to do 1:1 crop in post-processing. All you've gained are crop marks in the viewfinder and in Liveview. So an "easy to do firmware change" is a lot more involved then you'd think. Which brings me back to the question I asked in the easy-to-do firmware thread - what makes you think the changes are easy to do?

If you do in camera editing you can choose a 1:1 crop. It's there in the K5 and the K3. I'd be surprised if it wasn't there in the K-1 too.

And let us not forget that we are talking about the Pentax K-1 not an Olympus E-M1. If you want your camera to behave like an E-M1 use the E-M1. If all cameras behaved and performed the same you would only one camera to choose from.

photoptimist · 10-01-2016, 06:06 AM - **1 Like**

I like how Ricoh/Pentax has done this:

The philosophy of RAW is to preserve all the image data for maximum flexibility & control during post processing and that's what they've done by storing the FF image with a 1:1 crop flag.

The philosophy of JPEG is to maximize convenience for SOOC images and that's what they've done by outputting a cropped JPEG.

**BarryE** · 10-02-2016, 09:32 AM - **2 Likes**

Just installed 1.3 firmware and the 1:1 crop is bringing a big smile to my face. I've just tried 3 APSC Limiteds (21, 35 and 40) *all* show no vignetting in the f7 to f11 range I tried. Also the extremes of the square frame are as good, or better with all the Limiteds than the DFA 24-70. The 21mm is just great. The barrel distortion of the zoom is quite noticeable, whereas on the 21mm it's not relevant. I don't think I'd be far wrong saying the 21mm and the 35mm in 1:1 mode are better (for me) than the DFA zoom.

As one of the reasons I bought the K-1 was for a square crop option with more resolution than the k-3. Being able to use the Limiteds is wonderful.

As an aside the cropped RAWs work exactly how I'd expect in ACR CC - seemless. 4912x4912 pixels to play with.

Quite happy ...

Kunzite · 10-02-2016, 12:35 PM

I also like that the full data is preserved - but perhaps they should make it an option? This way we'd all be happy.
Works nicely in SilkyPix, too, by the way - you see the cropped image, but can "recover" the full data with the crop tool. DNG and PEF.

MJKoski · 10-02-2016, 01:16 PM

BarryE: Yes, D-FA 24-70 is a rather mediocre lens.

**felixkh** · 10-03-2016, 02:43 AM

Originally posted by MJKoski

BarryE: Yes, D-FA 24-70 is a rather mediocre lens.

Hi,

Why do you say that the D-FA 24-70 is mediocre?

MJKoski · 10-03-2016, 03:03 AM

Buy/rent it and see for yourself. You won't believe anyway if I say that it draws acceptably from image center to about 2/3 towards the edges and then turns into mush.

**felixkh** · 10-03-2016, 03:13 AM

Originally posted by MJKoski

Buy/rent it and see for yourself. You won't believe anyway if I say that it draws acceptably from image center to about 2/3 towards the edges and then turns into mush.

Here in Singapore, there is not way for me to rent one and to buy it is a ridiculous price of USD $1758.19 or SGD$2399.00. So I will need to look at more reviews about the lens.

Thanks for the input.

MJKoski · 10-03-2016, 03:21 AM

I read quite a many reviews about both Tamron 24-70 and Pentax variant before purchase. The problem with those reviews is they are using close range targets and those results seem to differ from landscape usage with infinity / near infinity focusing. Your price is about the same we have in Finland - ridiculous that is.

**felixkh** · 10-03-2016, 06:17 AM

Originally posted by MJKoski

I read quite a many reviews about both Tamron 24-70 and Pentax variant before purchase. The problem with those reviews is they are using close range targets and those results seem to differ from landscape usage with infinity / near infinity focusing. Your price is about the same we have in Finland - ridiculous that is.

Thanks for the info. Will need to ask a few of the friends who have the 24-70 to see if they have issues with it too.

**BarryE** · 10-03-2016, 06:59 AM

Originally posted by felixkh

Thanks for the info. Will need to ask a few of the friends who have the 24-70 to see if they have issues with it too.

Do report back what they think, please.

09-30-2016, 09:57 AM - 1 Like	#17
andymuns New Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Brisbane Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 22	Pentax gave us a little gift of another feature the 1:1 crop, here is an idea i you don't want to use it then don't. Really we don't need anymore Complaining... Last edited by andymuns; 09-30-2016 at 10:02 AM.

09-30-2016, 12:00 PM - 2 Likes	#18
acoufap Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Munich, Germany Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,191	Originally posted by Tjompen1968 I do find it very convenient to be able to see the final crop in the OVF or LV. It is very convenient to be able to see the final crop in the OVF or LV. I did a test and generated a raw DNG file. Mac Preview shows the square image - think that is the original camera preview. When I import the image into Capture One it generates an image from the square crop and shows a preview stretched to 3:2 - really unfortunate. Seems there is no implementation standards for camera defined raw crops? Or it's simply a bug in CO9. Since I always shoot raw and use CO to develop the images I won't use the crop mode as long as it is not properly usable within CO. Edit: Did a test using Adobe Bridge CS4 - Camera Raw. No problem. The DNG file is shown as square crop and the generated JPG file also looks good. So I guess Capture One 9 has a problem. I'll report it to Phase One. Edit: Now reported to Phase One. Last edited by acoufap; 09-30-2016 at 12:42 PM. Reason: Test using Adobe Bridge CS4 - Camera Raw

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09-30-2016, 05:54 AM	#16
johnkrumm Senior Member Join Date: May 2016 Location: Duluth, MN Posts: 141 Original Poster	I'm used to my cameras taking the full image and keeping all the data whatever the crop. For instance, on my EM1 I could set the crop to 1:1 or 3:2 or 16:9 or even a portrait crop, but then it's all adjustable in Lightroom, or can be reverted to the normal 4:3. That's one of the main advantages of digital, being able to change things after the fact. I was a little surprised that the K1 didn't offer more crop modes at least in live view, but it's not a huge deal.

09-30-2016, 06:54 PM	#19
Class A Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Wellington, New Zealand Posts: 11,251	Originally posted by acoufap Now reported to Phase One. Thanks! A workaround for now would be to shoot using the PEF format -- images appear uncropped but also undistorted in C1 -- and then use the 1x1 ratio option to get the square format crop relatively quickly.

09-30-2016, 09:58 PM - 1 Like	#20
Not a Number Moderator Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Venice, CA Posts: 10,526	So you're pretty much back to stage one and have to do 1:1 crop in post-processing. All you've gained are crop marks in the viewfinder and in Liveview. So an "easy to do firmware change" is a lot more involved then you'd think. Which brings me back to the question I asked in the easy-to-do firmware thread - what makes you think the changes are easy to do? If you do in camera editing you can choose a 1:1 crop. It's there in the K5 and the K3. I'd be surprised if it wasn't there in the K-1 too. And let us not forget that we are talking about the Pentax K-1 not an Olympus E-M1. If you want your camera to behave like an E-M1 use the E-M1. If all cameras behaved and performed the same you would only one camera to choose from.

10-01-2016, 06:06 AM - 1 Like	#21
photoptimist Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2016 Photos: Albums Posts: 5,129	I like how Ricoh/Pentax has done this: The philosophy of RAW is to preserve all the image data for maximum flexibility & control during post processing and that's what they've done by storing the FF image with a 1:1 crop flag. The philosophy of JPEG is to maximize convenience for SOOC images and that's what they've done by outputting a cropped JPEG.

10-02-2016, 09:32 AM - 2 Likes	#22
BarryE Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Hampshire, UK Posts: 1,654	Just installed 1.3 firmware and the 1:1 crop is bringing a big smile to my face. I've just tried 3 APSC Limiteds (21, 35 and 40) *all* show no vignetting in the f7 to f11 range I tried. Also the extremes of the square frame are as good, or better with all the Limiteds than the DFA 24-70. The 21mm is just great. The barrel distortion of the zoom is quite noticeable, whereas on the 21mm it's not relevant. I don't think I'd be far wrong saying the 21mm and the 35mm in 1:1 mode are better (for me) than the DFA zoom. As one of the reasons I bought the K-1 was for a square crop option with more resolution than the k-3. Being able to use the Limiteds is wonderful. As an aside the cropped RAWs work exactly how I'd expect in ACR CC - seemless. 4912x4912 pixels to play with. Quite happy ...

10-02-2016, 12:35 PM	#23
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	I also like that the full data is preserved - but perhaps they should make it an option? This way we'd all be happy. Works nicely in SilkyPix, too, by the way - you see the cropped image, but can "recover" the full data with the crop tool. DNG and PEF.

10-02-2016, 01:16 PM	#24
MJKoski Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 1,784	BarryE: Yes, D-FA 24-70 is a rather mediocre lens.

10-03-2016, 02:43 AM	#25
felixkh Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Singapore Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,201	Originally posted by MJKoski BarryE: Yes, D-FA 24-70 is a rather mediocre lens. Hi, Why do you say that the D-FA 24-70 is mediocre?

10-03-2016, 03:03 AM	#26
MJKoski Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 1,784	Buy/rent it and see for yourself. You won't believe anyway if I say that it draws acceptably from image center to about 2/3 towards the edges and then turns into mush.

10-03-2016, 03:13 AM	#27
felixkh Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Singapore Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,201	Originally posted by MJKoski Buy/rent it and see for yourself. You won't believe anyway if I say that it draws acceptably from image center to about 2/3 towards the edges and then turns into mush. Here in Singapore, there is not way for me to rent one and to buy it is a ridiculous price of USD $1758.19 or SGD$2399.00. So I will need to look at more reviews about the lens. Thanks for the input.

10-03-2016, 03:21 AM	#28
MJKoski Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 1,784	I read quite a many reviews about both Tamron 24-70 and Pentax variant before purchase. The problem with those reviews is they are using close range targets and those results seem to differ from landscape usage with infinity / near infinity focusing. Your price is about the same we have in Finland - ridiculous that is.

10-03-2016, 06:17 AM	#29
felixkh Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Singapore Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,201	Originally posted by MJKoski I read quite a many reviews about both Tamron 24-70 and Pentax variant before purchase. The problem with those reviews is they are using close range targets and those results seem to differ from landscape usage with infinity / near infinity focusing. Your price is about the same we have in Finland - ridiculous that is. Thanks for the info. Will need to ask a few of the friends who have the 24-70 to see if they have issues with it too.

10-03-2016, 06:59 AM	#30
BarryE Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Hampshire, UK Posts: 1,654	Originally posted by felixkh Thanks for the info. Will need to ask a few of the friends who have the 24-70 to see if they have issues with it too. Do report back what they think, please.

1:1 behavior

Win a Pentax Limited Lens: Raffle Now Live!