[gaweidert]

Here is a sample from last May in Yellowstone. D FA 28-105 at 53mm, F10 at 1/125 second. No shake reduction. This artifact is consistent across several images from this group so it wasn't me shaking the camera. First shot is image with just a little foreground cropped out. Second one is heavily cropped. You cannot really see this when reviewing the image in the screen on the back of the camera. To say I was disappointed when I drove 2,100 miles back home and started processing the images is a bit of an understatement. From what I have seen, the Nikon D810 and D850 seem to have the same problem. I have been working around the issue for awhile, but I need to test using Live View and the Electronic Shutter combination.

FWIW, I have had my camera since June 2016.

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Last edited by gaweidert; 12-19-2017 at 12:42 PM.

[UncleVanya]

Here is a sample from last May in Yellowstone. D FA 28-105 at 53mm, F10 at 1/125 second. No shake reduction. This artifact is consistent across several images from this group so it wasn't me shaking the camera. First shot is image with just a little foreground cropped out. Second one is heavily cropped. You cannot really see this when reviewing the image in the screen on the back of the camera. To say I was disappointed when I drove 2,100 miles back home and started processing the images is a bit of an understatement. From what I have seen, the Nikon D810 and D850 seem to have the same problem. I have been working around the issue for awhile, but I need to test using Live View and the Electronic Shutter combination.

FWIW, I have had my camera since June 2016.

Why not use SR here? (Not that I think that 1/125th at 53mm is a problem for most handheld without SR.)

[agp1337]

Sunday 10th December was difficult! The Christchurch 10K was taking place, and the conditions were horrific. It was pouring with rain, frequently near-horizontal, and I had to keep wiping the 28-105 lens every minute or so with a hanky. Fortunately it has a protection filter on it. I was worried, it was the K1, and I'd heard about focusing difficulties. Anyway, it was all I had with me, so I put the camera on a monopod and kept pressing and hoping for the best, most of the time shooting virtually blind and hoping that my shivering wouldn't shake the camera too much. I took over a hundred pictures and was delighted that over 90% of them were sharp. Considering the conditions I think that is a good result. The two here are not specially chosen to show the camera - others are as sharp, or sharper, but these two are fun! The bottom one is a closer version. No sharpening or post-processing applied except for curves. JPEG only.

[stevebrot]

This artifact is consistent across several images from this group

Sorry for the disappointment. I have had a few trips where the ratio of keepers was low and it sucks.

The heavily cropped image shows obvious "doubling". Assuming this is a full-resolution crop (1:1 pixel mapping), the image is also much softer than I would expect at 53mm with that lens. Also assuming that no filter was mounted and that there was no frost on the lens, I wonder if there is a flaw in the lens optics.


Steve

[harpoh]

A few extend the D FA 28-105 issues to the K-3/K-3II as well as the K-1. I believe the theory is that there is some sort of resonance in the D FA 28-105 that amplifies shutter vibration and/or creates a transient misalignment of the lens elements

This is my observation, too. On the K-3ii the 28-105 performed better than on the K-1 (maybe due to a lighter/smaller shutter) but, as I said earlier, not as well as the 16-85 (an excellent walkaround lens). So this "sort of resonance in the DFA" could be a QC issue, since not all samples seem to be affected, which is obvious from other users' experiences.

What I have not seen is direct comparison of a "shocked" photo with the same subject using electronic shutter and identical focus.

If anyone would tell me why I when trying to upload images get the "Error 404! Oops page not found etc", I'd gladly provide some samples, too.

Second one is heavily cropped. You cannot really see this when reviewing the image in the screen on the back of the camera.

That's a HEAVY crop, but I can see the same kind of ghosting as in my own images. The first one looks quite alright (very low resolution, of course) as it does (misleadingly) on the camera screen.

@agp1337: on my screen they look fine with their low resolution! So, maybe you got lucky and have a good copy! I still wonder how much "luck" it takes statistically.

[stevebrot]

If anyone would tell me why I when trying to upload images get the "Error 404! Oops page not found etc", I'd gladly provide some samples, too.

I am not sure what restrictions might apply to new members, but you can post a detailed description of how you are denied to the site suggestions and help forum...

Site Suggestions and Help - PentaxForums.com

Another option is to simply link through to your images on a site such as Flickr. Flickr makes it easy by providing the BBCode for the image and required link-back and has the additional feature of allowing links to "private" images. I routinely mark technical examples "private" before sharing the images here. There is no sense making a mess of my public view.


Steve

[gaweidert]

Sorry for the disappointment. I have had a few trips where the ratio of keepers was low and it sucks.

The heavily cropped image shows obvious "doubling". Assuming this is a full-resolution crop (1:1 pixel mapping), the image is also much softer than I would expect at 53mm with that lens. Also assuming that no filter was mounted and that there was no frost on the lens, I wonder if there is a flaw in the lens optics.


Steve

No flaw in the lens. It works great. No filters mounted either. Shots taken in this focal length range at 1/250 of a second a short time later are very sharp. When I first viewed the image it looked soft to me too. Zooming in I found out why. I just didn't know the cause of the artifact at the time.

[rawr]

I think you're referring to that camera's being prone to SS, too?

Not directly.

The K-1 shares the same sensor as the D800, so there are lessons to be learnt from the D800 Technical Guide for K-1 users, particularly those upgrading from lower-MP cameras.

While its groundbreaking 36 megapixels give the D800/D800E resolution unrivalled by previous digital SLR cameras, a side effect of such high resolution is that blur, whether the result of imprecise focus or camera shake, becomes that much more noticeable. Realizing the full potential of a camera with over 30-million pixels involves a thorough understanding of the causes and characteristics of blur, careful selection of settings and tools (lenses, tripods, etc.), and working with the best possible subjects.

[harpoh]

iginally posted by harpoh Quote I think you're referring to that camera's being prone to SS, too? Not directly. The K-1 shares the same sensor as the D800, so there are lessons to be learnt from the D800 Technical Guide for K-1 users, particularly those upgrading from lower-MP cameras. QuoteQuote: While its groundbreaking 36 megapixels give the D800/D800E resolution unrivalled by previous digital SLR cameras, a side effect of such high resolution is that blur, whether the result of imprecise focus or camera shake, becomes that much more noticeable. Realizing the full potential of a camera with over 30-million pixels involves a thorough understanding of the causes and characteristics of blur, careful selection of settings and tools (lenses, tripods, etc.), and working with the best possible subjects.

When I look at photos posted on this forum I am easily convinced that I can't hold a candle to many/most of you guys here both aestetically and technically. But still, considering those many settings I've tried out (different lenses, handheld/beanbag/tripod shots, SR on/off, PDAF/CDAF etc) I'm tempted to say there's something wrong with the camera and/or lens. The only convincing results I got were 28-105 LV+ES, Tamron 90 @ 1/320 + f2.8 (from tripod and beanbag) and randomly a few with Tamron 70-200 (LV not possible with Tamron). And then of course there are similar reports from other users.

Be that as it may, the K-1 combo is on its way back to the retailer, who btw is really cooperative (sent replacement before having the faulty one back).

As soon as the new one is here I'll check it out and, of course, report back to you. So, wish me luck (and some better light in this North German winter).

Regards
harpoh

[Mikesul]

Good luck with the new camera! Most of us have had such positive experiences with the K-1 that it is distressing to see a new user have such difficulty. Let us know how it works out.

[wanderer2]

<<randomly a few with Tamron 70-200 (LV not possible with Tamron). >>

This confuses me. Are you saying you can't use live view on your K-1 with a Tamron 70-200? I've used this combination with my K-1 since I bought it 1 1/2 years ago and have shot hundreds of photos using LV with no problems whatsoever. It isn't clear to me what your focusing settings and technique are for a landscape shot, for example. That's probably just my slowly functioning old brain since there's a lot to digest on this thread but If you could summarize these it would be of interest.

Good luck with your new camera. I've had nothing like the many problems you have. What a shame that's happened with such a great camera.

[gaweidert]

While I do find the problem a bit frustrating, the K1 is still a great camera. Now I know and understand the issue and how to work around it. Yest the blown shots at Yellowstone are frustrating. I guess I will just have to return and thy again.

Other brands of full frame DSLR's have similar issues. Pentax offers two ways around it. LV+ES or TAv mode. Both are easy to set up.

[kjphilippona]

Best of luck with you new combo!

[harpoh]

Are you saying you can't use live view on your K-1 with a Tamron 70-200?

Yes, I am. But tbh I didn't try because it definitely doesn't work on the (my) K-3ii (other users have reported the issue, too), so I assumed the same to be true for the K-1 (shame on me). That would be good news indeed if coupled with the K-1 one could use the Tamron 70-200 in LV mode although I don't like LV too much; but still, one option more is always a good thing.

It isn't clear to me what your focusing settings and technique are for a landscape shot, for example

That depends on the lighting conditions. "Normally" I use PDAF AF-S (Single Sel) f7.1-11 and if possible/necessary a beanbag or tripod.

LV+ES or TAv mode. Both are easy to set up.

Yes and no, I think. For many occasions I find LV+ES a little annoying and it surely is not for the quick shot. TAv might force you to bump up ISO (which I wouldn't like too much even with the K-1) or use a wider aperture, which might not be desirable, either. It has been suggested elsewhere IIRC to use PS and then just the first frame for which ES will have been used. Well, mabe, but... And all this in order to avoid the abysmal 1/x range. So, it's still a compromise, and imo a huge one considering the 2k spent on a hobby. But since there are so many happy users I have not given up hope, yet.

Best of luck with you new combo!

Thank you, tomorrow I'll know.

[bibz]

How is the QC on the 28-105? Tolerances and percussive transfer could be the culprit. I have a K1 and would like a weather sealed companion to get wet and dirty with, but this makes me a little hesitant. What I'm seeing in this thread is its highly unlikely the issue exists on all units and that both the camera AND lens have to be working together to create the blur. All cameras will have their harshest clunks, and I assume its well engineered by now to its minimum. Especially from Pentax, pioneering the whole returning mirror shutter combo and all. Being mechanical and percussive I'm sure there is a wide range of severity to the shutter shock, from body to body. Equally, the susceptibility of each lens to exhibit optical gremlins because of it. If the items weren't in need of extensively technical disassembly and reassembly I'd love to take a few apart and test the shutters and lenses! I'm sure Pentax will on this issue if it continues to cause problems.