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03-05-2016, 05:15 AM   #16
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Price war.... I do not think that Canon, Nikon care about Pentax that much, sorry guys but Pentax is entering the market and may start competing in a couple months with reviews out...
The lens I wanted a year ago from Pentax is just about to be released, and the lenses I would like to buy now, may appear in 2017.

05-06-2016, 05:15 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
Price war? Depends where you live.

I read recently that from April Nikon, Sony, Canon and Panasonic and other Japanese manufacturers will be raising their prices, in Canada due to currency movements, and for Nikon, big price increases of up to 30% are on the way in Europe. Plus Nikon only recently announced increased prices in Japan for lenses and accessories due to 'increased cost of raw materials'.

Give with one hand, take away with the other.
Interestingly, it is much cheaper to order the K-1 in the US from Japan. I was surprised to see the price difference. A quick comparaison between Amazon.co.jp and Amazon.com tells everything! Body only: JPY 250,290 in Japan, $1,799.95 in the US... a $500 difference!
05-06-2016, 10:50 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by clockworkrat Quote
Anyone willing to speculate as to whether Canon and Nikon are going to try to price to kill Pentax, or just enough to not haemorrhage quite so many future buyers?
Well I think they will push harder for the successor of the D810 and especially Mark D III and push the prices of the current bodies down a little. The only thing going for them is that Pentax is such a niche brand to many so the buzz is small.


Side note Ricoh's U.S. marketing is probably the worst I've seen out of any brand. Fujifilm is smart enough to provide bodies to a bunch of pros who create free marketing via YouTube and release really good photos months in advance. The K1 was like some great mystery until it was officially released.
05-06-2016, 10:54 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by richmondthefish Quote
Well I think they will push harder for the successor of the D810 and especially Mark D III and push the prices of the current bodies down a little. The only thing going for them is that Pentax is such a niche brand to many so the buzz is small.


Side note Ricoh's U.S. marketing is probably the worst I've seen out of any brand. Fujifilm is smart enough to provide bodies to a bunch of pros who create free marketing via YouTube and release really good photos months in advance. The K1 was like some great mystery until it was officially released.
Market share in the US is so small they really can't effectively market unless Ricoh intentionally invests (loses money) here. I wouldn't be surprised if that is a line on the long term strategic Plan, but not yet.

05-06-2016, 11:15 AM - 1 Like   #20
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Nikon can't afford any war on price. They are bleeding bad. Closing offices in many countries. People i know on the inside, even say that it is a possibility that Sony will buy Nikon.
05-06-2016, 01:58 PM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Market share in the US is so small they really can't effectively market unless Ricoh intentionally invests (loses money) here. I wouldn't be surprised if that is a line on the long term strategic Plan, but not yet.


They don't even do much basic marketing such as providing impressive preproduction image samples or even something small like partnering up with a few pros like fujifilm does. I'm not talking about Richoh buying TV ad time but just be a little better about their online presence.

---------- Post added 05-06-16 at 02:01 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by kenspo Quote
Nikon can't afford any war on price. They are bleeding bad. Closing offices in many countries. People i know on the inside, even say that it is a possibility that Sony will buy Nikon.


Whats the actually story behind financial losses though? Too many oil filled D600s returned?
05-06-2016, 02:19 PM   #22
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^^ The USA VP Marketing position was just filled Nov. 1st. I think their website is still outsourced (but it is much better). The store in really Shopatron. They have a few reps and some more brokers, but not much support. They're really small - 50 people or something including secretaries and such. There's just so much to do I wouldn't even know where to start.

I'd love to know what the actual sales of K-1 in the USA are. Adam said the B&H pre-order alone for the D810 was +50,000 units. I'll bet not more than 1000 K-1's have sold here, all-in.

I walked in a retail store yesterday and bought a K-1. They ordered 5 and 3 were pre-sold. I bought the 4th. The 5th is still on the (one) Pentax shelf. There was an entire wall of Nikon, 2/3 as much Canon, a section of Sony and way down at the end a collection of oddbal stuff with the Pentax.
05-06-2016, 02:25 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by richmondthefish Quote
Whats the actually story behind financial losses though? Too many oil filled D600s returned?
Unit volume down 40% from 2013 and therefor idle factories bleeding capital costs.

05-06-2016, 03:45 PM - 1 Like   #24
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Cannon and Nikon both upscaled into the compact camera and "DSLR for soccer rmums boom" that has now died due to mobile phones. Then they were competing for market share with expensive advertising and sales incentives for sales staff. Now with sensor tech hitting its limits disrupting the replacement cycle, and third party lens manufactures upsetting the IQ apple cart they are in trouble. The biggest problem for a small player like Pentax was keeping up with the tech war, Now that its over they can schedule their releases to minimise remaining stock and keeps cost as low as possible. In some ways the lack of third party lens choice increases their profitability when they release an amazing product like the K1.
05-06-2016, 04:37 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
There was an entire wall of Nikon
Every camera, lens and flash sitting on that wall is money spent to manufacture it, not yet recouped by selling it. Nikon have slammed their heads into the wall with their new FF flagship; it's stupidly expensive, and there will be some people who would probably rather shop around for a slightly used 645Z and go into medium format. Meanwhile Pentax's brand new flagship full-frame undercuts everything comparable that Nikon has, and offers some incentive to Nikonites who are looking to go FF but who only ever bought DX lenses to go with their existing DX cameras. Nothing to lose by selling the DX gear and switching brands, and they get to use all that juicy SMC and Takumar glass their Canon- and Sony-shooting friends have been raving about & on its native platform too.
05-06-2016, 06:00 PM   #26
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I think I read on the Photography Life website that Nikon is offering a free Nikon brand battery grip with purchase of any of their FF bodies. I don't think they would have if they weren't worried about the K-1. Those kinds of promotions usually happen during the holidays
05-06-2016, 08:33 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
I'd love to know what the actual sales of K-1 in the USA are. Adam said the B&H pre-order alone for the D810 was +50,000 units. I'll bet not more than 1000 K-1's have sold here, all-in.
50k D810s on preorder? That seems awfully high..
05-07-2016, 12:43 AM   #28
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The problem for Nikon and Canon is not only losing long term customers to Pentax. Right now, people switching to K-1 are flooding the market with used Nikon gear that provides further erosion. Even if its a relatively small number of customers selling their lenses, it is happening all at once, and gear bought slowly over the decades.
05-07-2016, 01:39 AM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by laddy Quote
The problem for Nikon and Canon is not only losing long term customers to Pentax. Right now, people switching to K-1 are flooding the market with used Nikon gear that provides further erosion.
I think you'll find very few swapping brands to the K-1, Laddy.

You can see by the advertising that Ricoh don't expect that to happen, either, because it's pitched at existing Pentaxians.

It's good that you're excited, though! ☺



05-07-2016, 03:32 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
^^ The USA VP Marketing position was just filled Nov. 1st. I think their website is still outsourced (but it is much better). The store in really Shopatron. They have a few reps and some more brokers, but not much support. They're really small - 50 people or something including secretaries and such. There's just so much to do I wouldn't even know where to start.

I'd love to know what the actual sales of K-1 in the USA are. Adam said the B&H pre-order alone for the D810 was +50,000 units. I'll bet not more than 1000 K-1's have sold here, all-in.

I walked in a retail store yesterday and bought a K-1. They ordered 5 and 3 were pre-sold. I bought the 4th. The 5th is still on the (one) Pentax shelf. There was an entire wall of Nikon, 2/3 as much Canon, a section of Sony and way down at the end a collection of oddbal stuff with the Pentax.
I do wonder, as pathdoc says, what the cost of producing all this gear and just have it sitting on random shelves waiting to be sold. Assuming there are still a bunch of D800s and D810s out there, what does Nikon do when they decide to release the D820? This whole over production followed by deep discounts to get rid of gear model has got to hurt the brands that do it a lot. This is particularly true as brands run out of major reasons to upgrade. 4K video doesn't seem to sell as many cameras as some would think.
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