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03-07-2016, 05:49 AM - 1 Like   #16
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I disagree. The technical side of photography is as important as the artistic side.

03-07-2016, 07:23 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by awaldram Quote
A lens never deteriorates whatever material it casting the image on to.
But some lens designs work better on one medium than another. For example, a sensor may have more trouble than a film at handling the corners of certain wide angle lenses. (Didn't Leica run into problems with this? Or need a special design for the micro-lenses on the sensors?)
03-07-2016, 02:16 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tjompen1968 Quote
I disagree. The technical side of photography is as important as the artistic side.
Don't know. Hmmm, lets say landscape and nature. you are right. none will take joy in a blurry landscape shot that has no sharp edges or focus false etc. but in reportage and street you are wrong. some amazing street shot are motion blurred or technical not 100% in the hurry. so one cannot say "as important" or not its a matter of usage. Downside, if you are not able to compose a shot you can create wonderful technical sharp and perfect but BS boring photography.
03-07-2016, 02:28 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by i5_david Quote
Don't know. Hmmm, lets say landscape and nature. you are right. none will take joy in a blurry landscape shot that has no sharp edges or focus false etc. but in reportage and street you are wrong. some amazing street shot are motion blurred or technical not 100% in the hurry. so one cannot say "as important" or not its a matter of usage. Downside, if you are not able to compose a shot you can create wonderful technical sharp and perfect but BS boring photography.
On the other hand, if you take away enough of the technology you will not even have a camera.

03-07-2016, 05:21 PM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by i5_david Quote
Don't know. Hmmm, lets say landscape and nature. you are right. none will take joy in a blurry landscape shot that has no sharp edges or focus false etc. but in reportage and street you are wrong. some amazing street shot are motion blurred or technical not 100% in the hurry. so one cannot say "as important" or not its a matter of usage. Downside, if you are not able to compose a shot you can create wonderful technical sharp and perfect but BS boring photography.
So it is either one or the other?

No seriously;

When I hold courses in beginners photography the focus is on composition and learning about light. What happens is that the majority comes back and asks me why the images is this or that and they do not have the technical understanding to correct their mistakes. So part 2 is more technical. Learning to leave the fully automatic mode and getting a deeper understanding of exposure. And the learning goes on and on.
To understand why an image is blurry at f/22 you need to know about diffraction and when this comes into play etc etc and the list goes on.

It is my belief that to be able to predict and correct for errors you will need an understanding of the tech. Also to understand why the great, but blurry, image became how it became. If your expression is blurry street images or whathever you will need to understand how to make them blurry.

Same goes for when I develop film and want a certain result, I need to know how to get there and to beable to tweek it I need a deeper understanding.

I am not sure my english is correct but those are my thoughts...

Thinking about it... this forum is mainly about the technical side of photography.
03-07-2016, 06:04 PM   #21
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My belief is that the technical side is the foundation of photography, the price of entry we sometimes say. You have to understand the basics before you can even turn on the camera or change the settings. But, IMHO, that is just the basics and too much time is argued over little details that make no practical difference to whether an image is 'good' or 'bad'. Some of the best images I have admired were, on close examination, blurry or not really in focus or had some other obvious technical fault. The image itself was so good you never noticed that it was not sharp.

What I am trying to say is that you must understand the technology, be it film or digital but that images are far more than that. Does it really matter that camera 'A' can give a half stop better dynamic range than camera 'B'? Or any other technical specification. When I can consistently produce better images than Ansel or Henri then I can start worrying about the half stop. Until then perhaps I would be better off studying or working on my composition or style. YMMV

---------- Post added 03-07-16 at 05:05 PM ----------

Nice K-1 badge by the way. Do we get to fly that when we pre-order or when it arrives?
03-07-2016, 06:20 PM - 1 Like   #22
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From another thread. 6 MP camera cropped to 5 MP blown up to 20x30 inch canvas, and looks great. People spend way too much time sweating the small stuff. The stuff the technical guys say you can't do, rarely have much truth to them.

If you ask the technical guys can you take a 2570 pixel wide image print it 20 inches by 30 inches and have it look sharp, they'll say no. Yet, it's on my wall, as taken by my 6 MP Opito 80W and it looks sharp.

SO don't listen to the guys who say it' won't or it can't, listen to the guys who've done what you want to do and figure out how to make it work for you. Most of the time folks who say, this won't work or that won't work, if they haven't tried it, they're probably wrong. It's pretty much guaranteed that any FF lens will give you more resolution on a K-1 as it will on a K-3. Probably about 25-35% more based on approximate Nikon D810 numbers.

But will your pictures look better? No one knows, but based on printing my 5 MP image large, I doubt it. 36 MP is oodles of overkill for landscape.

03-07-2016, 06:34 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
My belief is that the technical side is the foundation of photography, the price of entry we sometimes say. You have to understand the basics before you can even turn on the camera or change the settings. But, IMHO, that is just the basics and too much time is argued over little details that make no practical difference to whether an image is 'good' or 'bad'. Some of the best images I have admired were, on close examination, blurry or not really in focus or had some other obvious technical fault. The image itself was so good you never noticed that it was not sharp.

What I am trying to say is that you must understand the technology, be it film or digital but that images are far more than that. Does it really matter that camera 'A' can give a half stop better dynamic range than camera 'B'? Or any other technical specification. When I can consistently produce better images than Ansel or Henri then I can start worrying about the half stop. Until then perhaps I would be better off studying or working on my composition or style. YMMV

---------- Post added 03-07-16 at 05:05 PM ----------

Nice K-1 badge by the way. Do we get to fly that when we pre-order or when it arrives?

Well, I paid for the camera so I decided that I got one even if it is in a factory in Asia... =)


Last edited by Tjompen1968; 03-08-2016 at 01:06 AM.
03-07-2016, 06:55 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tjompen1968 Quote
Well, I paid for the camera so I desided i got one even if it is a factory in Asia... =)
Good point. I think I'll hang mine out as well then. Since you gave me permission
03-08-2016, 01:05 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
Good point. I think I'll hang mine out as well then. Since you gave me permission
How do you put more than one banner? I tried to get my K-3 as well...
03-08-2016, 03:35 AM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by Barry Pearson Quote
But some lens designs work better on one medium than another. For example, a sensor may have more trouble than a film at handling the corners of certain wide angle lenses. (Didn't Leica run into problems with this? Or need a special design for the micro-lenses on the sensors?)
Because of registration distance and micro lens on the sensor you can get some awe-full CA and funny light fall off not related directly to the host lens characteristics

The results tend to be consistent so if a sensors exhibits bad habits it across all lens (normally focal length related) but some show it more than others.

The last sensor I remember having such issues was the k10d or k20d cant remember which causing excessive PF.

As the quality of the lens has no bearing on this you cant define it until tested.
03-08-2016, 04:00 AM   #27
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Really like this community. It feels that we are on the same page here
MPx overated? To me of course. And seeing this 5MP shot above... wow such an amazing shot, great light and colors, beautifully composed - what should you want more.
(don't tell but I hope that somehow the K-1 will be able to have different resolution settings for different occasions, that I can shoot some events at work in a smaller resolution)
03-08-2016, 04:54 AM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
From another thread. 6 MP camera cropped to 5 MP blown up to 20x30 inch canvas, and looks great. People spend way too much time sweating the small stuff. The stuff the technical guys say you can't do, rarely have much truth to them.

If you ask the technical guys can you take a 2570 pixel wide image print it 20 inches by 30 inches and have it look sharp, they'll say no. Yet, it's on my wall, as taken by my 6 MP Opito 80W and it looks sharp.

SO don't listen to the guys who say it' won't or it can't, listen to the guys who've done what you want to do and figure out how to make it work for you. Most of the time folks who say, this won't work or that won't work, if they haven't tried it, they're probably wrong. It's pretty much guaranteed that any FF lens will give you more resolution on a K-1 as it will on a K-3. Probably about 25-35% more based on approximate Nikon D810 numbers.

But will your pictures look better? No one knows, but based on printing my 5 MP image large, I doubt it. 36 MP is oodles of overkill for landscape.
Off course you can blow up your files to whathever size you want. Sometimes the detail is not needed. Make a billboard with the 5-6 MP file. No problem. I have a 4MP print on my wall at A3+ size and it looks great. The difference is how much detail you can see when comparing a 4MP and a 36MP print.

The main reason for me to buy the K-1 is the better tonality that comes with the larger sensor. Not the MP, the sharpness or lesser noise compared to the K-3 but the tonality. Looking on a 645Z image and comparing it to the K-3 it is the tonality that catches my eye.
Same when I compare 135-film to 120-film or 4x5.
03-08-2016, 08:09 AM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tjompen1968 Quote
How do you put more than one banner? I tried to get my K-3 as well...
Took me awhile to figure that out. Just copy the first one then paste it into a new document in PS or whatever editor. Increase the size of the canvas vertically to match the second banner then copy/paste it in. Align to suite. Save as jpeg. In the Signature editor upload the file you built. Make sure the [SIG] brackets are in place and all you should have to do is swap the images.
03-08-2016, 08:14 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by Alex645 Quote
Comparing an $1800 K1 to a $2800 D810 is like comparing a D810 to a D5 ($6500) with 14 fps.

The D810 can at best (I assume using fast shutter speeds, with jpegs, fast memory card, etc.) shoot "up to 5 fps" which means 5 fps is a best case scenario. Up to 4.5 fps for the K1 is not "sub-standard" if Canon's $1800 FF 6D runs at up to 4.5 fps, and perhaps the Nikon D610 at $1300 can brag about 6 fps. But this is really splitting hairs and for the price, it IS the standard. The only thing substandard is the analysis and the statement.

And if anyone really wants a sense of how certain lenses perform on FF (corners and edges), to a degree, shooting tests with 35mm Ilford Pan F, Fujichrome Velvia 50, or Kodak Ektar 100 and pixel peeping will reveal a lot.
Except that you can have a $ 1899 D810 from grey market. (Not in Europe)
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