Sigma announcement about K-1 lens issue

jake14mw · 05-11-2016, 12:39 PM

So much bluster in here about not much of an issue.

Sigma said, "We are planning to provide a repair service for this issue." I think that is great of Sigma do commit to a fix so quickly, before most of us even knew there was an issue. Kudos to Sigma for that.

ogl · 05-11-2016, 12:39 PM

Maybe Sigma makes company safe from complaints of users...? Some lenses from this list work fine with K-1...

stevebrot · 05-11-2016, 12:42 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Quartermaster James

Aw, shucks! You got me quoted before I deleted the pants line.

Anyway, thanks for the reply!

That is why it is better to use ~~strikeout~~ and add a little sheepish grin

Steve

(...I hate it when I get quoted before I edit...

)

stevebrot · 05-11-2016, 12:52 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by jake14mw

Sigma said, "We are planning to provide a repair service for this issue." I think that is great of Sigma do commit to a fix so quickly, before most of us even knew there was an issue. Kudos to Sigma for that.

Thank you for saying this. Several of the affected lenses have been out of production for a few years. Sigma could just suggest to their installed base that they tough up and move on, yet they instead opted to do well with their customers and the market in general. They pushed the limits of what, in light of historic norms, constitutes a compatible mount and sort of got caught short as a new Pentax model came to market. It could have just as easily been Nikon or Canon.

Steve

**Quartermaster James** · 05-11-2016, 01:48 PM

Originally posted by jake14mw

So much bluster in here about not much of an issue.

Sigma said, "We are planning to provide a repair service for this issue." I think that is great of Sigma do commit to a fix so quickly, before most of us even knew there was an issue. Kudos to Sigma for that.

Guilty as charged, and I don't even have a K-1.

**monochrome** · 05-11-2016, 01:52 PM

Originally posted by stevebrot

Several of the affected lenses are current production with life spans overlapping the K-1 design cycle. What is possible is that Pentax did due diligence with those lenses, but Sigma made a recent change in their manufacturing. For the non-current product, Pentax should have known that the installed user base was significant.

Steve

Is the installed user base significant? Do you or I really know that? Sigma doesn't seem to think so.

Should Pentax choose to violate its own, published standard to accommodate users who've bought lenses from a hostile competitor that do not comply with the very design standard?

While I am personally empathetic, I don't think Pentax is responsible to design around Sigma's sloppy engineering.

kvetcha · 05-11-2016, 01:54 PM

Originally posted by tariq

In some cases they do. I know a few folks who have considered buying the K-1 because Sigma offers the Art 35/1.4 in Pentax mount. There is not a great Pentax offering in a 35/1.4 and if that is ones main focal length of choice, the availability of the Sigma option most certainly could make Pentax some $$ via the sell of a K-1 (and possibly other Pentax lenses and future bodies down the road thereafter).

Technically you can get any new Sigma lens remounted on K-Mount for a fee.

Call it a Pen-Tax.

dakight · 05-11-2016, 02:08 PM

Originally posted by Na Horuk

Ah, that explains it (check the original post, as the quote is missing the photo)
Its really too bad that after the K-30 this issue wasn't thought about more, by Ricoh and Sigma.
I assume a fix is coming soon from Sigma, and hopefully the K-1II will have a steeper angle around the mount.

I assume this might also cause trouble for mirror lenses and possible some T/S lenses at maximum shift.
Stay safe, everyone

I have and Opteka 500mm mirror lens and it fits with no issues at all. It has plenty of clearance.

**boriscleto** · 05-11-2016, 02:19 PM

Originally posted by kvetcha

Technically you can get any new Sigma lens remounted on K-Mount for a fee.

Call it a Pen-Tax.

Only if Sigma already makes that lens in K-mount. And most Sigma lenses aren't.

stevebrot · 05-11-2016, 02:25 PM

Originally posted by monochrome

Should Pentax choose to violate its own, published standard

This is the part that I find puzzling. What is this published standard and where can I read it?

Near I can tell, the 65mm clearance "standard" that surfaced in this thread was broken at least once by Pentax itself in the design of my Super Program. That being said, it was pretty cheeky of Sigma to make lenses whose mount design was clearly outside accepted practice for Pentax-K. Ricoh, for its part could easily have done a survey of lens physical compatibility during its first round of alpha testing as part of due diligence. Regardless of where the blame might be placed, Sigma has stepped up to the plate and has offered to modify the affected lenses.

Steve

tariq · 05-11-2016, 02:36 PM

Originally posted by kvetcha

Technically you can get any new Sigma lens remounted on K-Mount for a fee.

Call it a Pen-Tax.

I wish. I have a great Sigma Art 24/1.4 that I would love to use on my K-1. That will not be possible unless Sigma offers this lens in Pentax KA mount. IF/ when this lens is made available in Pentax mount, I will gladly pay the $250 or so fee to have the mount changed by Sigma.

**monochrome** · 05-11-2016, 02:36 PM - **1 Like**

dcshooter has a post on another thread about the public (and private) K-mount spec., which has never, ever changed. Apparently the spec. Includes a MINIMUM clearance standard above the mount itself, which these Sigma lenses violate by 3-5mm. K-1 clearance is apparently more than the minimum, but does not accommodate the largest of the Sigma mounts (up to 65.2mm vs 58.5 standard). According to Brian, Ricoh did leave some room - just not quite enough for these specific lenses.

Our Superprograms have more clearance than the minimum K-mount standard, even though they look different from an LX or K10 or something else.

I can't get my brain around the idea that Ricoh 'should' have done anything. By that standard they 'should' have designed around the Ricoh Pin and the Vivitar flange, right?

**Weevil** · 05-11-2016, 02:54 PM

I have tried my Sigma 70-200 OS today, and it is flush, but did not scratch the K-1 ....
But it is VERY close...

Parallax · 05-11-2016, 02:58 PM

Originally posted by monochrome

dcshooter has a post on another thread about the public (and private) K-mount spec., which has never, ever changed.

Originally posted by monochrome

K-1 clearance is apparently more than the minimum, but does not accommodate the largest of the Sigma mounts

Then Pentax is clearly in the wrong for not changing their ages old standard to accommodate a competitor.
This is just one of the reasons the K-1 is doomed.

They didn't consult with Sigma on its design.
They added pixel shift which is totally useless to any pro photographer.
It isn't as good at video as a dedicated video camera.

Why did they even bother releasing this thing? Very few are going to buy it, and those poor unfortunates who do are going to find it virtually useless because of those horrendous shortcomings.

Winder · 05-11-2016, 03:09 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Parallax

Okay, but how much will they lose due to people buying the Sigma lenses instead of Pentax lenses?

I actually bought into Pentax because several of the lenses I wanted were offered by Sigma. I bought into Pentax expecting a future FF body and I wasn't interested in the DA lenses. The reason I am shooting with a K-1 today is because of 3rd party lens support. There are a lot of people who look at 3rd party options like Sigma, Tamron, or Zeiss when making a decision. Ricoh benefits from that.

05-11-2016, 12:42 PM - 1 Like	#138
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by Quartermaster James Aw, shucks! You got me quoted before I deleted the pants line. Anyway, thanks for the reply! That is why it is better to use ~~strikeout~~ and add a little sheepish grin Steve (...I hate it when I get quoted before I edit... ) Last edited by stevebrot; 05-11-2016 at 12:53 PM.

05-11-2016, 02:36 PM - 1 Like	#147
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	dcshooter has a post on another thread about the public (and private) K-mount spec., which has never, ever changed. Apparently the spec. Includes a MINIMUM clearance standard above the mount itself, which these Sigma lenses violate by 3-5mm. K-1 clearance is apparently more than the minimum, but does not accommodate the largest of the Sigma mounts (up to 65.2mm vs 58.5 standard). According to Brian, Ricoh did leave some room - just not quite enough for these specific lenses. Our Superprograms have more clearance than the minimum K-mount standard, even though they look different from an LX or K10 or something else. I can't get my brain around the idea that Ricoh 'should' have done anything. By that standard they 'should' have designed around the Ricoh Pin and the Vivitar flange, right? Last edited by monochrome; 05-11-2016 at 02:42 PM.

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05-11-2016, 12:39 PM	#136
jake14mw Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Connecticut, USA Posts: 977	So much bluster in here about not much of an issue. Sigma said, "We are planning to provide a repair service for this issue." I think that is great of Sigma do commit to a fix so quickly, before most of us even knew there was an issue. Kudos to Sigma for that.

05-11-2016, 12:39 PM	#137
ogl Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Sankt Peterburg Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 8,382	Maybe Sigma makes company safe from complaints of users...? Some lenses from this list work fine with K-1...

05-11-2016, 12:52 PM - 1 Like	#139
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by jake14mw Sigma said, "We are planning to provide a repair service for this issue." I think that is great of Sigma do commit to a fix so quickly, before most of us even knew there was an issue. Kudos to Sigma for that. Thank you for saying this. Several of the affected lenses have been out of production for a few years. Sigma could just suggest to their installed base that they tough up and move on, yet they instead opted to do well with their customers and the market in general. They pushed the limits of what, in light of historic norms, constitutes a compatible mount and sort of got caught short as a new Pentax model came to market. It could have just as easily been Nikon or Canon. Steve

05-11-2016, 01:48 PM	#140
Quartermaster James Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: Anchorage, Alaska Posts: 653	Originally posted by jake14mw So much bluster in here about not much of an issue. Sigma said, "We are planning to provide a repair service for this issue." I think that is great of Sigma do commit to a fix so quickly, before most of us even knew there was an issue. Kudos to Sigma for that. Guilty as charged, and I don't even have a K-1.

05-11-2016, 01:52 PM	#141
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Originally posted by stevebrot Several of the affected lenses are current production with life spans overlapping the K-1 design cycle. What is possible is that Pentax did due diligence with those lenses, but Sigma made a recent change in their manufacturing. For the non-current product, Pentax should have known that the installed user base was significant. Steve Is the installed user base significant? Do you or I really know that? Sigma doesn't seem to think so. Should Pentax choose to violate its own, published standard to accommodate users who've bought lenses from a hostile competitor that do not comply with the very design standard? While I am personally empathetic, I don't think Pentax is responsible to design around Sigma's sloppy engineering.

05-11-2016, 01:54 PM	#142
kvetcha Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Posts: 92	Originally posted by tariq In some cases they do. I know a few folks who have considered buying the K-1 because Sigma offers the Art 35/1.4 in Pentax mount. There is not a great Pentax offering in a 35/1.4 and if that is ones main focal length of choice, the availability of the Sigma option most certainly could make Pentax some $$ via the sell of a K-1 (and possibly other Pentax lenses and future bodies down the road thereafter). Technically you can get any new Sigma lens remounted on K-Mount for a fee. Call it a Pen-Tax.

05-11-2016, 02:08 PM	#143
dakight Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Phoenix, AZ Photos: Albums Posts: 1,216	Originally posted by Na Horuk Ah, that explains it (check the original post, as the quote is missing the photo) Its really too bad that after the K-30 this issue wasn't thought about more, by Ricoh and Sigma. I assume a fix is coming soon from Sigma, and hopefully the K-1II will have a steeper angle around the mount. I assume this might also cause trouble for mirror lenses and possible some T/S lenses at maximum shift. Stay safe, everyone I have and Opteka 500mm mirror lens and it fits with no issues at all. It has plenty of clearance.

05-11-2016, 02:19 PM	#144
boriscleto Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: North Syracuse, NY Photos: Gallery Posts: 16,473	Originally posted by kvetcha Technically you can get any new Sigma lens remounted on K-Mount for a fee. Call it a Pen-Tax. Only if Sigma already makes that lens in K-mount. And most Sigma lenses aren't.

05-11-2016, 02:25 PM	#145
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by monochrome Should Pentax choose to violate its own, published standard This is the part that I find puzzling. What is this published standard and where can I read it? Near I can tell, the 65mm clearance "standard" that surfaced in this thread was broken at least once by Pentax itself in the design of my Super Program. That being said, it was pretty cheeky of Sigma to make lenses whose mount design was clearly outside accepted practice for Pentax-K. Ricoh, for its part could easily have done a survey of lens physical compatibility during its first round of alpha testing as part of due diligence. Regardless of where the blame might be placed, Sigma has stepped up to the plate and has offered to modify the affected lenses. Steve

05-11-2016, 02:36 PM	#146
tariq New Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 19	Originally posted by kvetcha Technically you can get any new Sigma lens remounted on K-Mount for a fee. Call it a Pen-Tax. I wish. I have a great Sigma Art 24/1.4 that I would love to use on my K-1. That will not be possible unless Sigma offers this lens in Pentax KA mount. IF/ when this lens is made available in Pentax mount, I will gladly pay the $250 or so fee to have the mount changed by Sigma.

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05-11-2016, 02:54 PM	#148
Weevil Site Supporter Join Date: May 2012 Location: Near Montréal, Québec Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,439	I have tried my Sigma 70-200 OS today, and it is flush, but did not scratch the K-1 .... But it is VERY close...

05-11-2016, 02:58 PM	#149
Parallax Senior Moderator Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: South Dakota Photos: Gallery Posts: 19,332	Originally posted by monochrome dcshooter has a post on another thread about the public (and private) K-mount spec., which has never, ever changed. Originally posted by monochrome K-1 clearance is apparently more than the minimum, but does not accommodate the largest of the Sigma mounts Then Pentax is clearly in the wrong for not changing their ages old standard to accommodate a competitor. This is just one of the reasons the K-1 is doomed. They didn't consult with Sigma on its design. They added pixel shift which is totally useless to any pro photographer. It isn't as good at video as a dedicated video camera. Why did they even bother releasing this thing? Very few are going to buy it, and those poor unfortunates who do are going to find it virtually useless because of those horrendous shortcomings.

05-11-2016, 03:09 PM - 1 Like	#150
Winder Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Tennessee Posts: 6,617	Originally posted by Parallax Okay, but how much will they lose due to people buying the Sigma lenses instead of Pentax lenses? I actually bought into Pentax because several of the lenses I wanted were offered by Sigma. I bought into Pentax expecting a future FF body and I wasn't interested in the DA lenses. The reason I am shooting with a K-1 today is because of 3rd party lens support. There are a lot of people who look at 3rd party options like Sigma, Tamron, or Zeiss when making a decision. Ricoh benefits from that.