[K David]

I would expect that final quality checks would involve a few exposures, but over 10 is excessive, IMHO.

My K-3 had zero but my K-7 had 23 prior to my first shot. I would agree that more than 10 seems a lot, unless they saw something they didn't like in the first batch and re-ran some tests to see if it was the camera or the testing equipment.

[ScooterMaxi Jim]

I'm not in the market for the K-1, but if someone got a K-1 with - say 50 actuations on it - and the authorized dealer for good reason (as in not the valid reason the OP gave) then refused to take the return, I would very happily purchase said body for half the retail price. For the most part, the real-world marketplace is not anal, thankfully.

On a more thoughtful note, quality advanced electronics that have an initial mortality rate of under 5% is considered highly reliable. It seems rare these days to hear of initial mortality in Pentax bodies - certainly well below 3%. For those of you fretting about a few dozen actuations on a new product sent to you from the maternity ward in the Philippines - be thankful you have a properly functioning advanced computer that happens to take really great photos. Most other brand patrons have reason for lesser confidence.

[stevebrot]

On a more thoughtful note, quality advanced electronics that have an initial mortality rate of under 5% is considered highly reliable. It seems rare these days to hear of initial mortality in Pentax bodies - certainly well below 3%.

Yep...less than 5% would be doing real well. I have not seen initial quality figures, but estimated failure rates for Pentax ILC at three years (per Consumer Reports) is about 7% (the same as Sony and less than Nikon or Olympus).* Canon and Panasonic owners are somewhat happier than we.


Steve

* Based on 2010-2015 member surveys

[HoustonBob]

Yep...less than 5% would be doing real well. I have not seen initial quality figures, but estimated failure rates for Pentax ILC at three years (per Consumer Reports) is about 7% (the same as Sony and less than Nikon or Olympus).* Canon and Panasonic owners are somewhat happier than we.


Steve

* Based on 2010-2015 member surveys

Consumer reports is probably the least reliable testing organization out there; they try to test everything under the sun. Testing a vacuum cleaner or a breakfast cereal is hardly like testing a camera. In other words they don't know what they are talking about; its the "jack of all trades master of none" phenomenon on display there. I used to believe in them before I got involved in electronic engineering back in the early 1970's and learned how much you have to know about a subject before you can even begin to do accurate testing.

[ukhozi]

K-1 is on its way back to the dealer. I made contact via e-mail and shortly afterwards received an answer including a retoure ticket for sending it back at his expense. So far so good. As asked, I included a detailed error report, also stating that I believe the camera was not brand new, but had been handled before. I just hope I get a replacement soon, without him making too much fuss about it.


As to what caused this error, I have no idea. I think any explanation is purely speculative. Maybe production error, maybe a faulty component, maybe the package was bumped around too much during transport.

---------- Post added 06-24-16 at 03:11 PM ----------

My K-3 had zero but my K-7 had 23 prior to my first shot. I would agree that more than 10 seems a lot, unless they saw something they didn't like in the first batch and re-ran some tests to see if it was the camera or the testing equipment.

Agree. A shuttercount of above 30, as in this case, seems a bit too much for a new camera. Still, I would probably not have complained about it, if all would have been good. Anyway, checking the shuttercount is a good idea. Especially if you buy online (which I usually don´t do!!)

[bigdavephoto]

The only answer I can come up with for a shutter count to be above 10 is if the camera was pulled off the line and used for a test camera where they test everything for quality. It would be the same as the truck I bought new. Most brand new vehicles have at most 15 to 20 miles on them from other people test driving the vehicle. My truck, when I bought it, had 63 miles. It also had a sticker on the window explaining that this truck had been pulled from the line and run through the test track.


In this case though, I think the key is the mode dial. If this camera had been used as a quality test, the mode dial would have been put back into the auto position. When ukhozi un-boxed this K1, he said in his opening post that the mode dial was not in auto. This would lead me to believe that this camera was used as a demo by the camera store or was sold and returned, which could lead to the camera being dropped or mishandled in some way causing the defect. In either case, the store made a mistake in selling this camera new. It should have been sold as a demo at a reduced price or sold as used.

[ukhozi]

The only answer I can come up with for a shutter count to be above 10 is if the camera was pulled off the line and used for a test camera where they test everything for quality. It would be the same as the truck I bought new. Most brand new vehicles have at most 15 to 20 miles on them from other people test driving the vehicle. My truck, when I bought it, had 63 miles. It also had a sticker on the window explaining that this truck had been pulled from the line and run through the test track.


In this case though, I think the key is the mode dial. If this camera had been used as a quality test, the mode dial would have been put back into the auto position. When ukhozi un-boxed this K1, he said in his opening post that the mode dial was not in auto. This would lead me to believe that this camera was used as a demo by the camera store or was sold and returned, which could lead to the camera being dropped or mishandled in some way causing the defect. In either case, the store made a mistake in selling this camera new. It should have been sold as a demo at a reduced price or sold as used.

And I forgot to mention, apart from the mode dial being in the P position, the autofocus was on AF-C with autofocus points shifted to the left. Now that can only be done manually. So, as you suspect, I think that this camera was either returned to the dealer previously, or it was on display at his store. In any case definitly not brand new and untouched.

So for my part, I am not going to blame Pentax for a bad product. I blame it on a previous handling error!! Makes me feel better while I am awaiting replacement

[stevebrot]

Consumer reports is probably the least reliable testing organization out there; they try to test everything under the sun. Testing a vacuum cleaner or a breakfast cereal is hardly like testing a camera. In other words they don't know what they are talking about; its the "jack of all trades master of none" phenomenon on display there. I used to believe in them before I got involved in electronic engineering back in the early 1970's and learned how much you have to know about a subject before you can even begin to do accurate testing.

I tend to agree in regards to their reviews/testing and take those with a grain of salt.* That being said, I don't remember anything in my comment about reviews or testing.

I was talking about their survey-driven product reliability estimates. In addition to product testing, CU surveys their members several times a year regarding the reliability of their purchases and the types of issues that they encountered. I have taken part in their camera, electronics, auto, and appliance surveys several times. At present, the camera reliability figures are the result of predictive statistics applied to five years survey results with the current crop including data from 2010 through 2015. The numbers project the percentage of cameras that may fail or require repair by year three of ownership.

In other words, no cameras were harmed or tested to determine reliability ratings. It is actuarial science in action, similar to that used for determining insurance risk and projection of election results. I know enough about that stuff to be dangerous (graduate coursework in prob 'n stat) and to appreciate what they have done. I find their camera and electronics reliability ratings accurately reflect my personal experience as well as that of friends and acquaintances.

To be complete, here are the current ratings (projected failure rates at three years) for interchangeable lens cameras, by brand:

Panasonic: 4%
Canon: 5%
Sony: 7%
Pentax: 7%
Nikon: 8%
Olympus: 8%

According to CR, differences of less than 5 points are insignificant. They also include a YMMV disclaimer.


Steve

* I use their ratings as a way to start product research, particularly for price/feature spread. Often enough, my purchase decision will match their recommendation/rating. Case in point might by my Lawn Boy mower which cannot handle the heavy growth of damp grass typical of my region, but also refuses to die. That goes to show that I am at least as dumb as their staff.

[stevebrot]

And I forgot to mention, apart from the mode dial being in the P position, the autofocus was on AF-C with autofocus points shifted to the left.

Definitely not fresh and factory sealed!!!


Steve

[StevenLS]

Received my K-1 and used it successfully with crop and FF lenses. Mounted D FA 28-105 that arrived today and after mounting it, the auto focus system would not work. (Although pushing the auto focus button does get it to focus.) Tried to focus on a variety of objects at differing difference and there is no response. So I tried it on the 17-70 crop lens and it would not focus either. Also, I suddenly was unable to use 4 way controller. Any ideas?

[GRB]

I've had my K1 long enough to take several hundred photos with it while learning its operation and have experienced no issues. I have not been using a dedicated lens, rather the lenses I used with my K50 (APS C). The issue cited sounds like a problem I had with my K50 after dropping it out of my truck on the Denali Highway last year.

[rawr]

Any ideas?

Adam made a response to your other thread.
The K-1 has a few new buttons and controls compared to previous Pentaxes that may take a little while to get familiar with.

[fromunderthebridge]

Get thee back under the bridge.
NikonForums

You rang? ;P

[monochrome]

You rang? ;P

Heh.

[ukhozi]

A friendly lady contacted me on the phone.
She apologised and agreed that this camera was not new and factory sealed. They are still investigating the matter, as this camera was not meant for retail and should never have been sent to me. She promised that they normally only send out brand new products. I don´t have much reason to doubt that. This dealer has quite a good reputation with good feedback for his online shop as well as for a small number of stores.

In exchange I will get a brand new K-1 from the last shipment! Should be on its way right now!