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08-25-2016, 04:51 AM   #46
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All right. Sorry for everything Mr. Elite. However, K-1 does not deliver above 0C barrier when doing long exposures. Not that hard to understand unless Pentax is a religion which it seems to be.

---------- Post added 08-25-16 at 04:54 AM ----------

It seems I cannot edit my posts, so

@banep: How can I check those from RAW files?

08-25-2016, 05:01 AM   #47
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QuoteOriginally posted by MJKoski Quote
Then, an example that 5Dsr which was deemed bad by some well-known elite photographer, produces spectacular results @ ISO100, 593 seconds, no LENR, -10C temp, pushed 0.8EV.
100% crop
Btw that 100% crop of ice doesn't look sharp to me.
Photo is usable but not sharp enough.
Maybe focus was somewhere else.
08-25-2016, 05:05 AM   #48
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It is unsharpened crop from original file from LR. Shot with polarizer and ND 3.0 filter in snowfall. So all kinds of smoothing factors there.
08-25-2016, 05:14 AM   #49
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QuoteOriginally posted by banep Quote
I'm not having "white dot" issue even with ISO 3200, 300 seconds exposures and similar 30+ temperatures celsius so I'm trying to help others to figure out what is the problem.
What software do you use to review your rawfile?
(To rule out that there isnít some automatic hot pixel removal going on.)

08-25-2016, 05:17 AM   #50
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I am interested in that production code yes. EXIF pilot -software could not show such information from RAW files. All the others were there though.
08-25-2016, 05:23 AM   #51
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QuoteOriginally posted by MJKoski Quote
All right. Sorry for everything Mr. Elite. However, K-1 does not deliver above 0C barrier when doing long exposures. Not that hard to understand unless Pentax is a religion which it seems to be.

---------- Post added 08-25-16 at 04:54 AM ----------

It seems I cannot edit my posts, so

@banep: How can I check those from RAW files?
Sorry, I currently don't have answer to that. For testing purposes I'm always shooting dng+jpeg and using exiftool on jpeg files (for K-1 it has to be version 10.25).
Developing jpeg from raw will strip off those and a lot of other technical informations.

EDIT:

Sorry my mistake 10.25 works directly with DNG raw files (don't know about PEF cause I'm not using it).
Exiftool download is here: http://www.sno.phy.queensu.ca/~phil/exiftool/
Unpack exiftool, copy your DNG file to the same directory and from command prompt type:
"exiftool(-k)" imgp9999.dng >imgp9999.exif
(you have to replace 9999 with the real file number)

---------- Post added 08-25-16 at 02:47 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Gimbal Quote
What software do you use to review your rawfile?
(To rule out that there isn’t some automatic hot pixel removal going on.)
With any software. In my case Picassa, Lightroom and Pentax software provided with K-1.
I'm talking about unmodified DNG files with "everything" disabled during shooting.
That includes every kind of in-camera noise reduction.
Have a look here, those are test print screens of dark frames from Picassa:
IMGP0788.DNG - Picasa Photo Viewer 24.8.2016 61540.bmp.jpg - Google Drive
IMGP0788.DNG - Picasa Photo Viewer 24.8.2016 61702.jpg - Google Drive
First is print screen of a whole DNG file, and second is 100% crop.
Parameters are 120s, ISO3200.

Last edited by banep; 08-25-2016 at 05:51 AM.
08-25-2016, 05:49 AM   #52
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QuoteOriginally posted by MJKoski Quote
You are not seeing fairies. In-camera LENR is quite destructive with K-1 and should never be used with PS function for example. Which is kind of shame because PS still retains details at ISO3200 but requires LENR or other tricks to get rid of excessive amount of white pixels. However using LENR in-camera makes PS image to loose all those fine details.
This makes no sense. Although the High-ISO Noise Reduction certainly is destructive to detail, the only "detail" removed by LENR is the fine-grain hot pixel noise (unless RICOH has botched the DFS algorithm with PS).

Do you have test images showing a destructive interaction between PS and LENR?
08-25-2016, 06:16 AM   #53
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Yes sir. I do recall I took one 30s PS example at ISO3200 with LENR in-camera when working with that skeleton thing. Of course I can take new ones and any K-1 owner can do it. It seems to work like A7R2 - when LENR in-camera is used, there is a very slight, crunchy, texture produced which diminishes small details somewhat.

---------- Post added 08-25-16 at 06:19 AM ----------

I will look it up when I get back home later tonight. No access to files now.

08-25-2016, 07:04 AM   #54
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QuoteOriginally posted by banep Quote
With any software. In my case Picassa, Lightroom and Pentax software provided with K-1.
I'm talking about unmodified DNG files with "everything" disabled during shooting.
That includes every kind of in-camera noise reduction.
Have a look here, those are test print screens of dark frames from Picassa:
IMGP0788.DNG - Picasa Photo Viewer 24.8.2016 61540.bmp.jpg - Google Drive
IMGP0788.DNG - Picasa Photo Viewer 24.8.2016 61702.jpg - Google Drive
First is print screen of a whole DNG file, and second is 100% crop.
Parameters are 120s, ISO3200.
I believe this is what I was talking about earlier, and it gives me hope that white noise is indeed a technical flaw on some sensors rather than a wide-spread issue. I'm hoping buying camera now, after couple of months have passed since launch, and camera just getting back in stock for big retailers, will increase my odds of getting a unit without this issue.
08-25-2016, 07:20 AM   #55
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What happens with those bodies that have the issue? If it is unit specific. I think it is not too much to ask to get at least D800E & D810 (fixed) level of performance out of the same sensor. Honestly I was quite disappointed when seeing standard 30 second long exposures from my unit. Yes, I even put it to freezer which diminishes the amount of white dots but not as much I expected.
08-25-2016, 08:35 AM   #56
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Honestly I'd love to see photos from bodies that were manufactured in July (maybe those are the ones being sold right now, bh just received a shipment of k1's). Maybe issue is not even there, at least one person here showed clean images free of white dots..
08-25-2016, 09:18 AM   #57
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QuoteOriginally posted by MJKoski Quote
What happens with those bodies that have the issue? If it is unit specific.
In my opinion that is a unit/batch specific and it is not a hardware/sensor problem at all.
Slightly internal adjustment in combination with latest firmware will do the trick.
But camera probably needs to be send to service.
Before that Ricoh should have a solution.
And before that Ricoh should be aware of the problem.
It is possible that they already have a solution but it is not yet published.
So contact your Ricoh representative, send description and sample photos, ask for a solution and wait for the answer.
08-25-2016, 09:30 AM   #58
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My K-1 dealer should have one new body which arrived last week with my 15-30 zoom as I went to pick it up. If time allows I try to visit the shop on my way home tomorrow.
08-25-2016, 09:53 AM   #59
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QuoteOriginally posted by banep Quote
With any software. In my case Picassa, Lightroom and Pentax software provided with K-1.
I'm talking about unmodified DNG files with "everything" disabled during shooting.
That includes every kind of in-camera noise reduction.
Have a look here, those are test print screens of dark frames from Picassa:
IMGP0788.DNG - Picasa Photo Viewer 24.8.2016 61540.bmp.jpg - Google Drive
IMGP0788.DNG - Picasa Photo Viewer 24.8.2016 61702.jpg - Google Drive
First is print screen of a whole DNG file, and second is 100% crop.
Parameters are 120s, ISO3200.
I just noticed the weirdest thing while looking at your 100% crop, there is a lot of hot pixels of red, green and blue type but not white. That looks kind of normal (except perhaps the huge amount of them), but "my" long exposures do not have any green hot pixels, they are blue, red and white.

So much depends on the raw converter used that I don't now what to think anymore. The red and blue ones are usually larger than one pixel, forming a little cross or line of 2-3 pixels, while the white dots are single pixels standing alone. (How is that even possible with a bayer pattern?).

Is there a chance you could upload the 120s exposure so that we (or I) could see how it looks in the raw converter I have? This to see if there is an actual difference in the files or if it is the raw converter that makes them look different.
08-25-2016, 10:17 AM   #60
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I've test my K-1,
I see some white dots when i use high Iso (on a dark shoot 1/1000s) from 1600. On my K-3 i see some white dots from 12800 (same settings for the shoot).
Edit : On maximum zoom on the K-1 screen. On my pc, i see it at 100% @ 6400 Iso / I only speak of White dots, on my K-3 the noise is more present before 12800 Iso
I don't know if my test is very good for tracking white dots...

When i go up (Iso 6400 for example and 60s exposure) the dots are more present.

Last edited by ZeGaby; 08-25-2016 at 10:27 AM.
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