Using a Manual Focus Lens on the K-1

**UncleVanya** · 09-03-2016, 10:14 PM

Originally posted by clackers

You're thinking about this is the wrong way round. The Olympus can't change the lens aperture, your Pentax can temporarily with the green button.

The Pentax focusing can be more precise because it's done wide open, the Oly can't do that.

Of course the Oly can focus wide open, it just can't also meter at the same time. Most DA type k to m43 adapters have a collar that lets you switch from stopped down to wide open easily. So you compose and focus wide open, then rotate the collar and meter.

---------- Post added 09-04-16 at 01:16 AM ----------

Originally posted by awscreo

Got my K-1 today, enjoying the hell out of it. One thing to note - the Olympus EM1 did legacy glass easier imo. Or maybe I'm not setting it up correctly, not sure. Basically, any manual lens can be used in any mode (including aperture priority) on the Olympus camera, and camera would automatically meter the light according to what aperture is used. I guess on K-1 it'll be the same for the non K mount lenses (that don't have that leaver at the bottom that controls aperture), but I found it a bit awkward that I can't meter the K mount lens that I have with the green button in aperture priority, basically have to use the M mode. I mostly shot in Av mode on my previous camera, where it would control the ISO, and I would just adjust the aperture on the lens and use exposure comp to set the image where I want it. Another thing I will miss is the histogram in the viewfinder

EVF's are good for some things)

Mirrorless cameras keep the aperture stopped down and compensate by making it brighter in the evf or lcd.

**clackers** · 09-04-2016, 12:06 AM

Originally posted by UncleVanya

Of course the Oly can focus wide open, it just can't also meter at the same time. Most DA type k to m43 adapters have a collar that lets you switch from stopped down to wide open easily. So you compose and focus wide open, then rotate the collar and meter.

Well, that's handy - thanks for the correction, UV.

Neither of my K to E mount adapters will do that, wish they did.

**UncleVanya** · 09-04-2016, 06:26 AM

Originally posted by clackers

Well, that's handy - thanks for the correction, UV.

Neither of my K to E mount adapters will do that, wish they did.

I agree, it operates a lot like a Preset type lens making the workflow a lot easier. The key is to find one designed for DA style lenses. The idea being that this gives crude aperture control to lenses without any aperture ring.

Look for one's labeled DA to E - they also can be used for stepless aperture control on DA lenses - but there is no calibration and frankly it isn't for the faint of heart. Using it with a lens with an aperture ring is however really nice.

My dad has one like this for K to m43 and FD to m43.I have a K to NX like this.

https://www.amazon.com/Fotasy-Pentax-Adapter-aperture-control/dp/B00FAAK1UY

awscreo · 09-04-2016, 06:41 AM

The lenses I have, specifically my helios 44k-4 which I used in both Olympus, and now on k-1 have aperture rings, so I could use whatever aperture on Olympus, and camera would automatically adjust exposure to the level it will be in the final image. It's a very seamless process, seemed really natural and camera did all the work. If it was metering wrong, you could adjust the exposure comp right away without taking an eye off of EVF and see what it would do to the final image. I understand this is probably the one advantage EVFs have over OFV. Just gonna take some getting used to)

**UncleVanya** · 09-04-2016, 07:01 AM

Originally posted by awscreo

The lenses I have, specifically my helios 44k-4 which I used in both Olympus, and now on k-1 have aperture rings, so I could use whatever aperture on Olympus, and camera would automatically adjust exposure to the level it will be in the final image. It's a very seamless process, seemed really natural and camera did all the work. If it was metering wrong, you could adjust the exposure comp right away without taking an eye off of EVF and see what it would do to the final image. I understand this is probably the one advantage EVFs have over OFV. Just gonna take some getting used to)

As said by Clackers, that workflow means focusing is done with less precision due to the lens being stopped down. In practical terms it may not matter however.

Constant preview of the exposure is something I turned off on my GX7 since I prefer to see the scene like it would appear in an optical viewfinder (bright etc. ) even if I am intentionally underexposing or overexposing. Typically when shooting raw I have enough lattitude that being in the ballpark is sufficient. Plus with experience I know what will give the results I want.

My point being that evf dies allow you this feature, and I can understand that you are used to working that way... And I can see how it is difficult to adjust to ovf after using an evf for constant preview. I have the same angst going the other way...

awscreo · 09-04-2016, 08:26 AM

Originally posted by UncleVanya

As said by Clackers, that workflow means focusing is done with less precision due to the lens being stopped down. In practical terms it may not matter however.

Constant preview of the exposure is something I turned off on my GX7 since I prefer to see the scene like it would appear in an optical viewfinder (bright etc. ) even if I am intentionally underexposing or overexposing. Typically when shooting raw I have enough lattitude that being in the ballpark is sufficient. Plus with experience I know what will give the results I want.

My point being that evf dies allow you this feature, and I can understand that you are used to working that way... And I can see how it is difficult to adjust to ovf after using an evf for constant preview. I have the same angst going the other way...

I'm pretty sure i'll be able to adjust quickly) I'm a bit confused why would focusing with a stopped down lens would be less precise? You mean optically, because it's easier to see with dof being shallow on both ends? I never had any issues with focusing a stopped down lens, even down to f11 or so.

**UncleVanya** · 09-04-2016, 09:17 AM

Originally posted by awscreo

I'm pretty sure i'll be able to adjust quickly) I'm a bit confused why would focusing with a stopped down lens would be less precise? You mean optically, because it's easier to see with dof being shallow on both ends? I never had any issues with focusing a stopped down lens, even down to f11 or so.

Yes exactly. The precision is less but honestly if it appears in focus while stopped down it probably is but sometimes not quite as sharp as it would be if stopped down after focusing. Honestly I have heard that a few lenses have focus shift issues when stopped down so in those circumstances it would help to focus stopped down. I still prefer focusing wide open - old habits.

awscreo · 09-04-2016, 09:20 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by UncleVanya

Yes exactly. The precision is less but honestly if it appears in focus while stopped down it probably is but sometimes not quite as sharp as it would be if stopped down after focusing. Honestly I have heard that a few lenses have focus shift issues when stopped down so in those circumstances it would help to focus stopped down. I still prefer focusing wide open - old habits.

The EM1 was my first digital camera (I had an old russian SLR when I was very young, but I didn't really start learning photography until I got the olympus), so my habits are all coming from mirrorless systems

**UncleVanya** · 09-04-2016, 09:25 AM

Originally posted by awscreo

The EM1 was my first digital camera (I had an old russian SLR when I was very young, but I didn't really start learning photography until I got the olympus), so my habits are all coming from mirrorless systems

Completely understand... My experiences started with rangefinder film cameras... So what you see is not what you get is what I got used to first...

**gaweidert** · 09-04-2016, 09:45 AM

Originally posted by awscreo

I'm pretty sure i'll be able to adjust quickly) I'm a bit confused why would focusing with a stopped down lens would be less precise? You mean optically, because it's easier to see with dof being shallow on both ends? I never had any issues with focusing a stopped down lens, even down to f11 or so.

In the ancient days of my youth SLR cameras had focusing aids like split image and/or micro prism viewfinders. As you stopped down the lens these became more difficult to use. At a certain point they were essentially useless. The advent of "fast" lenses had more to do with fine focusing than image quality. More light made it easier to adjust focus on you manual focus lenses.

awscreo · 09-05-2016, 07:33 AM

Yup I have two old film slrs at home, my Zenit 212k and a very old Yashica in great condition. The split prisms and micro prisms help a lot with focusing

stevebrot · 09-05-2016, 11:38 AM

Originally posted by awscreo

I'm a bit confused why would focusing with a stopped down lens would be less precise? You mean optically, because it's easier to see with dof being shallow on both ends? I never had any issues with focusing a stopped down lens, even down to f11 or so.

As DOF increases, the ability of your eye to discern an out-of-focus condition decreases. At moderate image size (enlargement) stop-down focusing may be adequate, but will not work well if critical focus at the subject plane is intended.

Steve

awscreo · 09-05-2016, 01:34 PM

Originally posted by stevebrot

As DOF increases, the ability of your eye to discern an out-of-focus condition decreases. At moderate image size (enlargement) stop-down focusing may be adequate, but will not work well if critical focus at the subject plane is intended.

Steve

That's what I thought. It's not really an issue for modern EVF's because you can zoom in and be very precise. Peaking can help sometimes too. I'm getting used to optical viewfinder though. At least on K-1 it's a rather big one

peterh337 · 11-13-2017, 10:54 AM

Picking up an old thread...

I have a brand new Zeiss Milvus 18mm f2.8 converted from Nikon to Pentax, as per this thread
Is there a high quality compact prime around 17-18mm for K1? - Page 7 - PentaxForums.com

I must be missing something obvious because the camera does exactly nothing. I have it set to M and manual focus, but all I see is a flashing "F--" indication on the LCD and half-pressing the shutter does nothing too. No focus confirmation and the shutter does not work.

**eccs19** · 11-13-2017, 11:23 AM

Originally posted by peterh337

Picking up an old thread...

I have a brand new Zeiss Milvus 18mm f2.8 converted from Nikon to Pentax, as per this thread
Is there a high quality compact prime around 17-18mm for K1? - Page 7 - PentaxForums.com

I must be missing something obvious because the camera does exactly nothing. I have it set to M and manual focus, but all I see is a flashing "F--" indication on the LCD and half-pressing the shutter does nothing too. No focus confirmation and the shutter does not work.

Good information here...

Shooting manual lenses on Pentax DSLRs « robertsdonovan.com

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09-03-2016, 10:14 PM	#16
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,402	Originally posted by clackers You're thinking about this is the wrong way round. The Olympus can't change the lens aperture, your Pentax can temporarily with the green button. The Pentax focusing can be more precise because it's done wide open, the Oly can't do that. Of course the Oly can focus wide open, it just can't also meter at the same time. Most DA type k to m43 adapters have a collar that lets you switch from stopped down to wide open easily. So you compose and focus wide open, then rotate the collar and meter. ---------- Post added 09-04-16 at 01:16 AM ---------- Originally posted by awscreo Got my K-1 today, enjoying the hell out of it. One thing to note - the Olympus EM1 did legacy glass easier imo. Or maybe I'm not setting it up correctly, not sure. Basically, any manual lens can be used in any mode (including aperture priority) on the Olympus camera, and camera would automatically meter the light according to what aperture is used. I guess on K-1 it'll be the same for the non K mount lenses (that don't have that leaver at the bottom that controls aperture), but I found it a bit awkward that I can't meter the K mount lens that I have with the green button in aperture priority, basically have to use the M mode. I mostly shot in Av mode on my previous camera, where it would control the ISO, and I would just adjust the aperture on the lens and use exposure comp to set the image where I want it. Another thing I will miss is the histogram in the viewfinder EVF's are good for some things) Mirrorless cameras keep the aperture stopped down and compensate by making it brighter in the evf or lcd.

09-04-2016, 12:06 AM	#17
clackers Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Melbourne Photos: Albums Posts: 16,397	Originally posted by UncleVanya Of course the Oly can focus wide open, it just can't also meter at the same time. Most DA type k to m43 adapters have a collar that lets you switch from stopped down to wide open easily. So you compose and focus wide open, then rotate the collar and meter. Well, that's handy - thanks for the correction, UV. Neither of my K to E mount adapters will do that, wish they did.

09-04-2016, 06:26 AM	#18
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,402	Originally posted by clackers Well, that's handy - thanks for the correction, UV. Neither of my K to E mount adapters will do that, wish they did. I agree, it operates a lot like a Preset type lens making the workflow a lot easier. The key is to find one designed for DA style lenses. The idea being that this gives crude aperture control to lenses without any aperture ring. Look for one's labeled DA to E - they also can be used for stepless aperture control on DA lenses - but there is no calibration and frankly it isn't for the faint of heart. Using it with a lens with an aperture ring is however really nice. My dad has one like this for K to m43 and FD to m43.I have a K to NX like this. https://www.amazon.com/Fotasy-Pentax-Adapter-aperture-control/dp/B00FAAK1UY

09-04-2016, 06:41 AM	#19
awscreo Veteran Member Join Date: May 2016 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,722	The lenses I have, specifically my helios 44k-4 which I used in both Olympus, and now on k-1 have aperture rings, so I could use whatever aperture on Olympus, and camera would automatically adjust exposure to the level it will be in the final image. It's a very seamless process, seemed really natural and camera did all the work. If it was metering wrong, you could adjust the exposure comp right away without taking an eye off of EVF and see what it would do to the final image. I understand this is probably the one advantage EVFs have over OFV. Just gonna take some getting used to)

09-04-2016, 07:01 AM	#20
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,402	Originally posted by awscreo The lenses I have, specifically my helios 44k-4 which I used in both Olympus, and now on k-1 have aperture rings, so I could use whatever aperture on Olympus, and camera would automatically adjust exposure to the level it will be in the final image. It's a very seamless process, seemed really natural and camera did all the work. If it was metering wrong, you could adjust the exposure comp right away without taking an eye off of EVF and see what it would do to the final image. I understand this is probably the one advantage EVFs have over OFV. Just gonna take some getting used to) As said by Clackers, that workflow means focusing is done with less precision due to the lens being stopped down. In practical terms it may not matter however. Constant preview of the exposure is something I turned off on my GX7 since I prefer to see the scene like it would appear in an optical viewfinder (bright etc. ) even if I am intentionally underexposing or overexposing. Typically when shooting raw I have enough lattitude that being in the ballpark is sufficient. Plus with experience I know what will give the results I want. My point being that evf dies allow you this feature, and I can understand that you are used to working that way... And I can see how it is difficult to adjust to ovf after using an evf for constant preview. I have the same angst going the other way...

09-04-2016, 08:26 AM	#21
awscreo Veteran Member Join Date: May 2016 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,722	Originally posted by UncleVanya As said by Clackers, that workflow means focusing is done with less precision due to the lens being stopped down. In practical terms it may not matter however. Constant preview of the exposure is something I turned off on my GX7 since I prefer to see the scene like it would appear in an optical viewfinder (bright etc. ) even if I am intentionally underexposing or overexposing. Typically when shooting raw I have enough lattitude that being in the ballpark is sufficient. Plus with experience I know what will give the results I want. My point being that evf dies allow you this feature, and I can understand that you are used to working that way... And I can see how it is difficult to adjust to ovf after using an evf for constant preview. I have the same angst going the other way... I'm pretty sure i'll be able to adjust quickly) I'm a bit confused why would focusing with a stopped down lens would be less precise? You mean optically, because it's easier to see with dof being shallow on both ends? I never had any issues with focusing a stopped down lens, even down to f11 or so.

09-04-2016, 09:17 AM	#22
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,402	Originally posted by awscreo I'm pretty sure i'll be able to adjust quickly) I'm a bit confused why would focusing with a stopped down lens would be less precise? You mean optically, because it's easier to see with dof being shallow on both ends? I never had any issues with focusing a stopped down lens, even down to f11 or so. Yes exactly. The precision is less but honestly if it appears in focus while stopped down it probably is but sometimes not quite as sharp as it would be if stopped down after focusing. Honestly I have heard that a few lenses have focus shift issues when stopped down so in those circumstances it would help to focus stopped down. I still prefer focusing wide open - old habits.

09-04-2016, 09:20 AM - 1 Like	#23
awscreo Veteran Member Join Date: May 2016 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,722	Originally posted by UncleVanya Yes exactly. The precision is less but honestly if it appears in focus while stopped down it probably is but sometimes not quite as sharp as it would be if stopped down after focusing. Honestly I have heard that a few lenses have focus shift issues when stopped down so in those circumstances it would help to focus stopped down. I still prefer focusing wide open - old habits. The EM1 was my first digital camera (I had an old russian SLR when I was very young, but I didn't really start learning photography until I got the olympus), so my habits are all coming from mirrorless systems

09-04-2016, 09:25 AM	#24
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,402	Originally posted by awscreo The EM1 was my first digital camera (I had an old russian SLR when I was very young, but I didn't really start learning photography until I got the olympus), so my habits are all coming from mirrorless systems Completely understand... My experiences started with rangefinder film cameras... So what you see is not what you get is what I got used to first...

09-04-2016, 09:45 AM	#25
gaweidert Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Rochester, NY Photos: Gallery Posts: 5,325	Originally posted by awscreo I'm pretty sure i'll be able to adjust quickly) I'm a bit confused why would focusing with a stopped down lens would be less precise? You mean optically, because it's easier to see with dof being shallow on both ends? I never had any issues with focusing a stopped down lens, even down to f11 or so. In the ancient days of my youth SLR cameras had focusing aids like split image and/or micro prism viewfinders. As you stopped down the lens these became more difficult to use. At a certain point they were essentially useless. The advent of "fast" lenses had more to do with fine focusing than image quality. More light made it easier to adjust focus on you manual focus lenses.

09-05-2016, 07:33 AM	#26
awscreo Veteran Member Join Date: May 2016 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,722	Yup I have two old film slrs at home, my Zenit 212k and a very old Yashica in great condition. The split prisms and micro prisms help a lot with focusing

09-05-2016, 11:38 AM	#27
stevebrot Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Vancouver (USA) Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 42,007	Originally posted by awscreo I'm a bit confused why would focusing with a stopped down lens would be less precise? You mean optically, because it's easier to see with dof being shallow on both ends? I never had any issues with focusing a stopped down lens, even down to f11 or so. As DOF increases, the ability of your eye to discern an out-of-focus condition decreases. At moderate image size (enlargement) stop-down focusing may be adequate, but will not work well if critical focus at the subject plane is intended. Steve

09-05-2016, 01:34 PM	#28
awscreo Veteran Member Join Date: May 2016 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,722	Originally posted by stevebrot As DOF increases, the ability of your eye to discern an out-of-focus condition decreases. At moderate image size (enlargement) stop-down focusing may be adequate, but will not work well if critical focus at the subject plane is intended. Steve That's what I thought. It's not really an issue for modern EVF's because you can zoom in and be very precise. Peaking can help sometimes too. I'm getting used to optical viewfinder though. At least on K-1 it's a rather big one

11-13-2017, 10:54 AM	#29
peterh337 Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: London Posts: 573	Picking up an old thread... I have a brand new Zeiss Milvus 18mm f2.8 converted from Nikon to Pentax, as per this thread Is there a high quality compact prime around 17-18mm for K1? - Page 7 - PentaxForums.com I must be missing something obvious because the camera does exactly nothing. I have it set to M and manual focus, but all I see is a flashing "F--" indication on the LCD and half-pressing the shutter does nothing too. No focus confirmation and the shutter does not work.

11-13-2017, 11:23 AM	#30
eccs19 Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Lisle, Ontario Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,510	Originally posted by peterh337 Picking up an old thread... I have a brand new Zeiss Milvus 18mm f2.8 converted from Nikon to Pentax, as per this thread Is there a high quality compact prime around 17-18mm for K1? - Page 7 - PentaxForums.com I must be missing something obvious because the camera does exactly nothing. I have it set to M and manual focus, but all I see is a flashing "F--" indication on the LCD and half-pressing the shutter does nothing too. No focus confirmation and the shutter does not work. Good information here... Shooting manual lenses on Pentax DSLRs « robertsdonovan.com