[JensE]

For an automated trigger project, I measured the time from triggering the camera with external cable release to firing a manual flash for both K-5 (done previously) and K-1. Expecting a slight improvement due to faster X-sync time, to my surprise, those were the results:

K-5 w/o MLU: ~80ms
K-5 MLU: 10ms

K-1 w/o MLU: 87ms
K-1 with MLU: 130ms - 230ms

I turned off every conceivable feature in the K-1 in order to speed this up and make it as much K-5ish as possible, but I always end up with times that are longer than the non-MLU lag.
Things I turned off: SR, Horizon correction, AF (used a manual lens), GPS, any exposure automation (X with M-lens and fixed ISO), ES, Catch-In-Focus, Auto-WB, status display, focus confirmation in viewfinder, ...

Is this a firmware bug? Any ideas what unusual things to watch out for?

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Last edited by JensE; 01-17-2018 at 01:13 PM.

[pschlute]

Just to be clear you are talking about delay with MLU for the second press of the remote ? The first press obviously locks the mirror up and starts the camera beep.

[photoptimist]

Is the K-1 in liveview when you do this? (I'm wondering if reconfiguring/reseting the K-1 sensor takes the added time).

[pschlute]

Is the K-1 in liveview when you do this? (I'm wondering if reconfiguring/reseting the K-1 sensor takes the added time).

You cannot select MLU (or its gets de-selected) when in Live view. The mirror is of course always up in LV already

[JensE]

So yes, both correct: Measured from the 2nd shutter press (with a delay of 2s after the first shutter press) until the flash fires. And obviously no live view - which is not very fast either, but I haven't noted down the times for it.

[pschlute]

I cannot explain why this would be the case. It would not bother me as the only time I would use MLU (in fact Live View Electronic Shutter is better) is when on a tripod and photographing a scene that was not time-critical.

Your prospective use is perhaps very time critical, hence your experimentation. Cannot help i am afraid.

[JensE]

I still have a fine working K-5 :-)

The wider field of view of the K-1, at the same resolution/magnification, would have made my application, an automatic trigger to photograph insects (especially bees) in flight, a little less time-critical.
Their speed reaches about 5m/s or 5mm/ms. That's 50mm in 10ms, so I will likely only be able to catch slower flights anyway. But you see how a wider field of view may help.
I wonder if by mistake the sensor may be cleared out needlessly. Maybe I'll try an old pre-ES firmware when I get a little time and see if anything changes.

[AstroDave]

Is your flash your primary light source for the insect pictures?

If so, you want your trigger to fire the flash rather than the camera. There is essentially no delay here (well, maybe a few tens of microseconds - I've actually measured it).

PS I've also measured the shutter lag on the K-1 and get the same value as you do - 87 millisec or so. I used a common trigger to fire the camera and start a timer which I then took a picture of. I'll have to try my set up with the mirror lock up mode.

[biz-engineer]

Their speed reaches about 5m/s or 5mm/ms.

It's ok, their speed is well below the speed limit of 20 miles/hour, you can't fine them and ask them to pay the fine with honey, unless some of the bees would exceed the legal speed limit.

[JensE]

Is your flash your primary light source for the insect pictures?
If so, you want your trigger to fire the flash rather than the camera. There is essentially no delay here (well, maybe a few tens of microseconds - I've actually measured it).

Unfortunately bees tend to fly in bright daylight, so keeping the shutter open for a long time (much longer than X-sync) isn't an option. I'd fry the bees with a flash powerful enough for that :-)

[derekkite]

So do hummingbirds, and yet that is how the wing movement is captured. You don't need to have the shutter open for long, only long enough so you can fire your flash while it is open. Set up the exposure so that it is almost dark. Your flash would be at 1/8th power or so, that gives you 1/6000 approx. You probably could go to 1/4 power which is double that. If you have the capacity to time things well, you can open your shutter, hold for the time it takes for the body to stabilize, fire your flash, then end exposure.

Under expose 3 or 4 stops and illuminate your subject.

1/10 f11 70mm. 1/8 with multiple flashes.

[JensE]

You don't need to have the shutter open for long, only long enough so you can fire your flash while it is open.

The problem is that with the incredibly thin depth of field in the macro range, you can't predict when your subject is in focus with enough precision and timing. It enters/leaves that predictable range within a few ten milliseconds - much shorter than the shutter normally needs to open (87ms on the K-1 without M-LU), but still frequently requires you to wait several seconds. That is the reason that I have been working on an electronic trigger in the first place, not freezing the motion blur as such. With the 10ms on the K-5, it gets feasible to detect and fire with a reasonable success rate. For a much more elaborate implementation than I'm aiming at, see fotoopa on flickr.

The traditional approach is to create artificially constrained flight paths - which is fine for purely documentary purposes. But it also limits what you can capture in terms of interesting natural habitat/context and requires a lot more time.