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08-03-2018, 03:47 AM - 1 Like   #16
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The images transformed to frequency domain by an FFT definitly shows the signs of the noise reduction and information loss. If you don't see it, then it's not a problem for you, but it's there.
I would like to get a K-1II too when my savings allow it, this small issue won't stop me. I found it negligible.

DPreview did some really big mistakes that affected Pentax negatively, but in general I think they aren't biased, they just don't know how to operate a Pentax camera when it comes to the new, unique advanced features.

08-03-2018, 05:20 AM - 1 Like   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by 08amczb Quote
The images transformed to frequency domain by an FFT definitly shows the signs of the noise reduction and information loss. If you don't see it, then it's not a problem for you, but it's there.
I would like to get a K-1II too when my savings allow it, this small issue won't stop me. I found it negligible.

DPreview did some really big mistakes that affected Pentax negatively, but in general I think they aren't biased, they just don't know how to operate a Pentax camera when it comes to the new, unique advanced features.
I don't know that they are purposely biased towards Pentax, but I think they are biased negatively towards the (quite traditional) SLRs that Pentax has chosen to make.

There may be signs of slight noise reduction in the images, but certainly the verbiage they used in their review made it sound as though the files had been through some noise reduction engine that smoothed everything away.
08-03-2018, 05:36 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by 08amczb Quote
The images transformed to frequency domain by an FFT definitly shows the signs of the noise reduction and information loss. If you don't see it, then it's not a problem for you, but it's there.
I would like to get a K-1II too when my savings allow it, this small issue won't stop me. I found it negligible.
If it's very smart NR, it doesn't affect IQ so it could be easy to see by eyes. As for me K-1II's photos are even sharper. Yes, sharpness is not all, but the details are not worse than K-1.
08-03-2018, 05:39 AM   #19
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I've unregistered since the first K-1 review, when I felt that hostility against Pentaxians from Canonists' and Nikonists' posts...

The same thing arrived in France in June 2016 when Chasseur d'Images (french photo magazine) published the results of K-1 test :



The article says : "The burst mode is not the most highest (4.5 i/s), but the autofocus is reactive. The K-1 succeeds in following the subject until 2 m of distance. It is remarkable because many devices do not follow such low. The burst is correct and, especially, the mobile subjects will be exactly restored on the condition of having a good lens."

So their technicians succeeded having all shots focused from 50 to 2 meters !

But later in an other article about 70-200 lenses tests, you can see following table :



As you can see, the 2 meter shot is now unsharp ! (green = sharp, yellow = nearly sharp and red = unsharp).

So I have never bought that magazine again...

08-03-2018, 06:00 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
If it's very smart NR, it doesn't affect IQ so it could be easy to see by eyes. As for me K-1II's photos are even sharper. Yes, sharpness is not all, but the details are not worse than K-1.
No, it's not smart. When they announced it I tought they will build a modern neural network based learning system which will be smart and does not smooth out detail, but the FFT images shows a traditional method. Every noise reduction affect IQ and everything visible on the FFT image is visible on the image. (These are mathematical constraints). I think DPreview makes the issue much bigger then what it is in reality, it's even hard to notice when pixelpeeping at 100%. I have a KP with the same chip and I'am happy with it. I think your photos may be sharper because of the better AF algorithms or sample variation.

QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I don't know that they are purposely biased towards Pentax, but I think they are biased negatively towards the (quite traditional) SLRs that Pentax has chosen to make.
Yes, I think this is true. Although I think too the mirrorless is the future, we just have to wait 5-10 years to be sure.
08-03-2018, 06:32 AM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by 08amczb Quote
No, it's not smart. When they announced it I tought they will build a modern neural network based learning system which will be smart and does not smooth out detail, but the FFT images shows a traditional method. Every noise reduction affect IQ and everything visible on the FFT image is visible on the image. (These are mathematical constraints). I think DPreview makes the issue much bigger then what it is in reality, it's even hard to notice when pixelpeeping at 100%. I have a KP with the same chip and I'am happy with it. I think your photos may be sharper because of the better AF algorithms or sample variation.


Yes, I think this is true. Although I think too the mirrorless is the future, we just have to wait 5-10 years to be sure.
I don't disagree about the mirrorless movement. I would say a couple of things about it. First of all, the size difference, assuming the same size sensor and same speed and focal length of your lens is not as big as people think. Most size benefits come from having wide angle primes that are relatively slow. Stick a G Master f2.8 zoom on your Sony NEX camera and you've got a good sized bundle. Second, the companies have to solve the eye strain/headache issue. I really don't mind using an EVF -- to me is just like looking at a tiny TV screen but gives pretty comparable information to your OVF. At the same time, when I use one for any length of time it bothers my eyes and gives me headaches. I don't know why, but it doesn't seem to get better over time. My understanding is that at least 30 percent of the population is similar and unless something changes in the tech, OVFs will still need to be around for quite awhile to accommodate us.
08-03-2018, 06:40 AM   #22
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I didn't want to hijack the thread...

EVF are getting better, wait 5 years. Virtual Reality and Augmented reality are big markets there are many researches for better headsets with better screens inside them. It's hard to notice the improvement if you still get sick in minutes looking at an EVF. Mirorrless is the future, not the present.
08-03-2018, 06:43 AM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by clickclick Quote
As a side note, it does feel like DPR takes every chance possible to have a swing at Pentax. Just skimming the first page, I find this, "This means once you reach ISO 1600, unlike most cameras such as the Pentax 645Z, the dynamic range does not drop by 1 EV drop for each 1 EV increase in ISO." If "most cameras" do this, then why not say, oh Fuji?

Hard to read anything over there without a bad taste in the mouth afterwards. Kinda like a cheap wine.
FWIW, I think Richard Butler has finally heard the complaints we have had for a while, and has now seen some of what we were saying all along. He seems to be far more attuned to the issue now.

08-03-2018, 08:23 AM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by texandrews Quote
FWIW, I think Richard Butler has finally heard the complaints we have had for a while, and has now seen some of what we were saying all along. He seems to be far more attuned to the issue now.
It would be nice to see some more objective reviews in the future. Perhaps we'll see with the DFA* 50 if anything has changed. I'm assuming they will review that at some point. But if they complain it's too heavy, we'll know they haven't changed.

08-22-2018, 01:51 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
I was really deceived by DPR and really think that K-1II is worse than K-1 in terms of details at higher ISO....

Oh. My God...I've compared K-1 and K-1II at ISO6400...It seems to me K-1II is a bit sharper and it has a bit lower noise...!!!!

The blue color is better too...At all ISO.

ISO12800 - I don't see any difference in details, maybe K-1IIs has less colour noise...

As for radical ISO - higher - I don't care
Pentax claims "better color" on the K1-II over the K1. What differences do you see in the whole color palette between the K1 and the K1-II?
08-22-2018, 03:22 AM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by alvaro_garcia Quote
Pentax claims "better color" on the K1-II over the K1. What differences do you see in the whole color palette between the K1 and the K1-II?
try to read my post one more time and you will find the answer
08-22-2018, 04:25 AM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
try to read my post one more time and you will find the answer
Obviously I don't need to read it one more time. You say the blue color is "better" throughout the whole ISO range.

1. I wonder what does "better" mean for you, and

2. I wonder what's about the other colors.

Thanks.
08-22-2018, 07:55 AM   #28
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Ok, I've found (link below) this comparison between the K1 and the K1-II across different ISO settings. You can see the differences.

COLORS:
They say (and you can see) that the colors from the K1-II are "cleaner" and "more saturated" than those from the K1, specially reds and greens (although I can see a difference throughout the whole color palette). However I possibly prefer the darker tonality from the K1. It would be nice to test side by side both models in real life though.

NOISE:
Also the noise is better controlled on the K1-II.

However they state that the differences between both models until ISO 3200 are none to negligible. And since I'm mainly an ISO 100 (only sometimes ISO 200 to 1600) shooter, I wonder if it would be worthy to purchase the K1-II...

Pentax K-1 versus K-1 Mark II: altas sensibilidades - Tienda Pentaxeros

Last edited by alvaro_garcia; 08-22-2018 at 10:34 AM.
08-22-2018, 12:42 PM   #29
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There was some comparison shots made in ISO with MKI &MKII. and bigger difference is @3200, but it already starts @200 to change in MKII advantage.
08-22-2018, 03:38 PM - 1 Like   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by clickclick Quote
It would be nice to see some more objective reviews in the future. Perhaps we'll see with the DFA* 50 if anything has changed. I'm assuming they will review that at some point. But if they complain it's too heavy, we'll know they haven't changed.

They can comment on weight because it is valid that the DFA* 50 is heavy. All I want is balanced and fair reviews. Negatives and positives should be included. It's when things aren't balanced overall or when things are over-emphasised.

I do agree that they seem to be inherently biased against traditional DSLRs though.
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