Brand new K1 with a moving part inside it

**monochrome** · 10-31-2019, 06:23 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Fernando Sousa

According to what others have being said so far, it looks like there are different experiences about this moving thing subject, which may suggest that there may be variances in manufacturing the cameras, indeed. I just do not know if that is a good thing or not. I mean, it may be a justification for those of us that feel this movement thing, but OTOH, one may wonder how come that there may be such variances in the production of such high tech products...

Pentax packages are not sealed.

With my K-1 in hand - no lens and no battery installed - there is a sound and slight feel of motion inside the camera, as described by many posters above. This is absolutely normal and I do not believe there is significant variance in the SR assembly.

With lens mounted and battery installed but powered off the sound is the same. Power on the camera and the sound stops. Mount a lLens and power the camera on and you might hear the SR mechanism working - it is a high-pitched whine (ultrasonic). That is normal.

If the pictures work you’re good. Otherwise you have a warranty and can exchange the camera for a new one.

**clickclick** · 10-31-2019, 07:03 PM

I never felt this until reading about it and intentionally moving my camera in a way to make it happen. Feel like I have to practically shake the thing in a way I'd never intentionally handle it.

normhead · 10-31-2019, 07:24 PM

Originally posted by Fernando Sousa

According to what others have being said so far, it looks like there are different experiences about this moving thing subject, which may suggest that there may be variances in manufacturing the cameras, indeed. I just do not know if that is a good thing or not. I mean, it may be a justification for those of us that feel this movement thing, but OTOH, one may wonder how come that there may be such variances in the production of such high tech products...

My bottom line her is if you don't have to shake it to hear the noise it's probably OK. If it's noisey during normal use handling I'd send it back. The fact that it's OK right away doesn't mean there isn't something loose that could cause premature failure. Even reasonably fast rotation in mine doesn't cause a noise. I have to shake it with some force to feel a very faint clunk.

HoutHans · 11-01-2019, 01:50 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by biz-engineer

Those are the firmware bugs that got fried inside the camera after the last firmware updade

Let me guess, when the camera is actually updating, you can hear them crawling around on the inside

MarkJerling · 11-01-2019, 02:03 AM

Originally posted by Fernando Sousa

According to what others have being said so far, it looks like there are different experiences about this moving thing subject, which may suggest that there may be variances in manufacturing the cameras, indeed. I just do not know if that is a good thing or not. I mean, it may be a justification for those of us that feel this movement thing, but OTOH, one may wonder how come that there may be such variances in the production of such high tech products...

It also depends how good your ears are. Some people never hear the SR parts clunking about, others do.

**Serkevan** · 11-01-2019, 02:21 AM

Originally posted by stillshot2

I'd like to add that some Pentax DSLR's I've owned have had more movement than others with the shake reduction system inside when off. Can't remember specific models but I think a K-30 I had was very noticeable and a K-200 perhaps was not, so I'd chalk it up to variance in manufacturing.

Differences in the mechanism used, maybe. Is the SR in those two models rated for the same stops of stabilization?

**shardulm** · 11-01-2019, 08:18 AM

The sensor is floating when the camera is powered up. Think magnetic levitation... When there is no battery or no power to the camera there is no levitation of the sensor that happens when SR kicks in and hence the sensor infrastructure is loosely laying in the body. Don't believe this is an issue. All IBIS cameras more or less exhibit this behavior.
There is a way to Turn the SR off and turn it back on. Try taking pictures in both modes.

Ontarian50 · 11-01-2019, 08:22 AM - **1 Like**

What's not been fully explained here, is why the clunking is normal.

The Pentax sensor floats inside a precisely machined sandwich. I don't recommend you take one apart, but if you do, you'll be impressed.

Without power, the sensor just rocks around a few millimeters inside its cage. It can't go anywhere.

When the camera powers up, electromagnets grab onto the floating sensor and hold it steady for photography, and can move it in those tiny directions necessary for stabilization (or pixel shift, or astrotracing).

Compared to other IBIS efforts (including the Q) it's pretty impressive.

stillshot2 · 11-01-2019, 05:41 PM

Originally posted by Serkevan

Is the SR in those two models rated for the same stops of stabilization?

Probably not, but I have had 2 K-30's at different times and I recall thinking they may have even felt a little different but impossible to know for sure.

Gimbal · 11-02-2019, 02:32 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by MarkJerling

It also depends how good your ears are. Some people never hear the SR parts clunking about, others do.

Exactly, some people just does not pick up on subtle things, at all.
This is a Pentax thing in all their DSLRs since the K10d, the sensor is loose and can move around up/down and left right a few mm. Some cameras might need a little bump for the sensor to shift, others slide more easily. Nothing to worry about.

**felixkh** · 11-02-2019, 05:48 AM

Originally posted by Fernando Sousa

According to what others have being said so far, it looks like there are different experiences about this moving thing subject, which may suggest that there may be variances in manufacturing the cameras, indeed. I just do not know if that is a good thing or not. I mean, it may be a justification for those of us that feel this movement thing, but OTOH, one may wonder how come that there may be such variances in the production of such high tech products...

If the sound is faint, it is perfectly normal as the others have said. Do not worry too much.

Fernando Sousa · 11-02-2019, 07:22 AM

Hi all, and thanks a lot for all the input and opinions and clarifications.

Meanwhile, i finally got to charge the battery, buy a proper SD card and pick up a lens (M 50mm f1,7). Turning on the camera, and the moving part still, well, moves. Attaching the lens on it, as well. Turning on the SR, as well. However, activating the live view mode, and while on it, the moving part moves no more. Back to normal mode (no LV), the movement is back again. As for the images, all look good to me, but i am still around the manual, there are a lot of settings i need to better understand.

So, does this may suggest that the moving part is not SR related? What could than be? I will be taking more photos over the weekend, and try to see if i am better returning it (i bought it from Amazon, in another country, so it would mean a loooong and difficult wait).

---------- Post added 11-02-19 at 07:28 AM ----------

Originally posted by normhead

My bottom line her is if you don't have to shake it to hear the noise it's probably OK. If it's noisey during normal use handling I'd send it back. The fact that it's OK right away doesn't mean there isn't something loose that could cause premature failure. Even reasonably fast rotation in mine doesn't cause a noise. I have to shake it with some force to feel a very faint clunk.

It is not really the noise, it is more that i feel the movement. Like perhaps, if i was to guess, something of the weight of the battery, moving 2mm or so. And i sill can feel it, even with the camera turned on... But i do not shake my camera, i feel this thing just by tilting it, to the left, then to the right, then tom the left agin, etc.

---------- Post added 11-02-19 at 07:34 AM ----------

Originally posted by Gimbal

Exactly, some people just does not pick up on subtle things, at all.
This is a Pentax thing in all their DSLRs since the K10d, the sensor is loose and can move around up/down and left right a few mm. Some cameras might need a little bump for the sensor to shift, others slide more easily. Nothing to worry about.

But that (loose sensor that can move around up/down and left right a few mm) may happen, regardless of the camera being turned off or on? In my case, only in LV mode i stop feeling any movement inside the camera...

normhead · 11-02-2019, 07:41 AM

Originally posted by Fernando Sousa

It is not really the noise, it is more that i feel the movement. Like perhaps, if i was to guess, something of the weight of the battery, moving 2mm or so. And i sill can feel it, even with the camera turned on... But i do not shake my camera, i feel this thing just by tilting it, to the left, then to the right, then tom the left agin, etc.

To me, that's just not right. It's not like my camera. But if someone else has the same experience and their camera has decent number of shutter actuations, you might want to take a chance. When I turn my camera to the left or right for portrait orientation there is absolutely no movement 95% of the time, and a very slight, soft "thud" maybe one time out of 20.

Fernando Sousa · 11-02-2019, 07:42 AM

Originally posted by monochrome

Pentax packages are not sealed.

With my K-1 in hand - no lens and no battery installed - there is a sound and slight feel of motion inside the camera, as described by many posters above. This is absolutely normal and I do not believe there is significant variance in the SR assembly.

With lens mounted and battery installed but powered off the sound is the same. Power on the camera and the sound stops. Mount a lLens and power the camera on and you might hear the SR mechanism working - it is a high-pitched whine (ultrasonic). That is normal.

If the pictures work you’re good. Otherwise you have a warranty and can exchange the camera for a new one.

Thanks for the post, i understand that this feeling of motion inside the camera is normal in the Pentax dslr, due to the shake reduction mechanism, free floating sensor, magnets, etc. But now, since i first turn my camera on, and also the SR on, i was hopping to stop feeling the motion, but that did not happened. Only in LV it goes away. But the camera takes pictures. Is this still normal with yours?

**monochrome** · 11-02-2019, 07:49 AM

Originally posted by Fernando Sousa

Thanks for the post, i understand that this feeling of motion inside the camera is normal in the Pentax dslr, due to the shake reduction mechanism, free floating sensor, magnets, etc. But now, since i first turn my camera on, and also the SR on, i was hopping to stop feeling the motion, but that did not happened. Only in LV it goes away. But the camera takes pictures. Is this still normal with yours?

In my experience just now, camera in hand, there is no internal clunking sound or feel of an internal loose part in OVF Mode, with a lens mounted and the camera powered on. In LV Mode I can hear and feel the SR system. With power on the magnets are working.

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10-31-2019, 06:23 PM - 1 Like	#16
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Originally posted by Fernando Sousa According to what others have being said so far, it looks like there are different experiences about this moving thing subject, which may suggest that there may be variances in manufacturing the cameras, indeed. I just do not know if that is a good thing or not. I mean, it may be a justification for those of us that feel this movement thing, but OTOH, one may wonder how come that there may be such variances in the production of such high tech products... Pentax packages are not sealed. With my K-1 in hand - no lens and no battery installed - there is a sound and slight feel of motion inside the camera, as described by many posters above. This is absolutely normal and I do not believe there is significant variance in the SR assembly. With lens mounted and battery installed but powered off the sound is the same. Power on the camera and the sound stops. Mount a lLens and power the camera on and you might hear the SR mechanism working - it is a high-pitched whine (ultrasonic). That is normal. If the pictures work you’re good. Otherwise you have a warranty and can exchange the camera for a new one.

10-31-2019, 07:03 PM	#17
clickclick Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: May 2016 Location: East Coast Posts: 2,903	I never felt this until reading about it and intentionally moving my camera in a way to make it happen. Feel like I have to practically shake the thing in a way I'd never intentionally handle it.

10-31-2019, 07:24 PM	#18
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	Originally posted by Fernando Sousa According to what others have being said so far, it looks like there are different experiences about this moving thing subject, which may suggest that there may be variances in manufacturing the cameras, indeed. I just do not know if that is a good thing or not. I mean, it may be a justification for those of us that feel this movement thing, but OTOH, one may wonder how come that there may be such variances in the production of such high tech products... My bottom line her is if you don't have to shake it to hear the noise it's probably OK. If it's noisey during normal use handling I'd send it back. The fact that it's OK right away doesn't mean there isn't something loose that could cause premature failure. Even reasonably fast rotation in mine doesn't cause a noise. I have to shake it with some force to feel a very faint clunk.

11-01-2019, 01:50 AM - 1 Like	#19
HoutHans Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Appingedam Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,123	Originally posted by biz-engineer Those are the firmware bugs that got fried inside the camera after the last firmware updade Let me guess, when the camera is actually updating, you can hear them crawling around on the inside

11-01-2019, 02:03 AM	#20
MarkJerling Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: May 2012 Location: Wairarapa, New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 20,408	Originally posted by Fernando Sousa According to what others have being said so far, it looks like there are different experiences about this moving thing subject, which may suggest that there may be variances in manufacturing the cameras, indeed. I just do not know if that is a good thing or not. I mean, it may be a justification for those of us that feel this movement thing, but OTOH, one may wonder how come that there may be such variances in the production of such high tech products... It also depends how good your ears are. Some people never hear the SR parts clunking about, others do.

11-01-2019, 02:21 AM	#21
Serkevan Site Supporter Join Date: May 2019 Photos: Albums Posts: 5,976	Originally posted by stillshot2 I'd like to add that some Pentax DSLR's I've owned have had more movement than others with the shake reduction system inside when off. Can't remember specific models but I think a K-30 I had was very noticeable and a K-200 perhaps was not, so I'd chalk it up to variance in manufacturing. Differences in the mechanism used, maybe. Is the SR in those two models rated for the same stops of stabilization?

11-01-2019, 08:18 AM	#22
shardulm Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Cumming, GA Posts: 793	The sensor is floating when the camera is powered up. Think magnetic levitation... When there is no battery or no power to the camera there is no levitation of the sensor that happens when SR kicks in and hence the sensor infrastructure is loosely laying in the body. Don't believe this is an issue. All IBIS cameras more or less exhibit this behavior. There is a way to Turn the SR off and turn it back on. Try taking pictures in both modes.

11-01-2019, 08:22 AM - 1 Like	#23
Ontarian50 Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2015 Posts: 530	What's not been fully explained here, is why the clunking is normal. The Pentax sensor floats inside a precisely machined sandwich. I don't recommend you take one apart, but if you do, you'll be impressed. Without power, the sensor just rocks around a few millimeters inside its cage. It can't go anywhere. When the camera powers up, electromagnets grab onto the floating sensor and hold it steady for photography, and can move it in those tiny directions necessary for stabilization (or pixel shift, or astrotracing). Compared to other IBIS efforts (including the Q) it's pretty impressive.

11-01-2019, 05:41 PM	#24
stillshot2 Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Phoenix, AZ Photos: Albums Posts: 1,070	Originally posted by Serkevan Is the SR in those two models rated for the same stops of stabilization? Probably not, but I have had 2 K-30's at different times and I recall thinking they may have even felt a little different but impossible to know for sure.

11-02-2019, 02:32 AM - 1 Like	#25
Gimbal Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Sweden Posts: 2,106	Originally posted by MarkJerling It also depends how good your ears are. Some people never hear the SR parts clunking about, others do. Exactly, some people just does not pick up on subtle things, at all. This is a Pentax thing in all their DSLRs since the K10d, the sensor is loose and can move around up/down and left right a few mm. Some cameras might need a little bump for the sensor to shift, others slide more easily. Nothing to worry about.

11-02-2019, 05:48 AM	#26
felixkh Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Singapore Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,201	Originally posted by Fernando Sousa According to what others have being said so far, it looks like there are different experiences about this moving thing subject, which may suggest that there may be variances in manufacturing the cameras, indeed. I just do not know if that is a good thing or not. I mean, it may be a justification for those of us that feel this movement thing, but OTOH, one may wonder how come that there may be such variances in the production of such high tech products... If the sound is faint, it is perfectly normal as the others have said. Do not worry too much.

11-02-2019, 07:22 AM	#27
Fernando Sousa Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2017 Posts: 37 Original Poster	Hi all, and thanks a lot for all the input and opinions and clarifications. Meanwhile, i finally got to charge the battery, buy a proper SD card and pick up a lens (M 50mm f1,7). Turning on the camera, and the moving part still, well, moves. Attaching the lens on it, as well. Turning on the SR, as well. However, activating the live view mode, and while on it, the moving part moves no more. Back to normal mode (no LV), the movement is back again. As for the images, all look good to me, but i am still around the manual, there are a lot of settings i need to better understand. So, does this may suggest that the moving part is not SR related? What could than be? I will be taking more photos over the weekend, and try to see if i am better returning it (i bought it from Amazon, in another country, so it would mean a loooong and difficult wait). ---------- Post added 11-02-19 at 07:28 AM ---------- Originally posted by normhead My bottom line her is if you don't have to shake it to hear the noise it's probably OK. If it's noisey during normal use handling I'd send it back. The fact that it's OK right away doesn't mean there isn't something loose that could cause premature failure. Even reasonably fast rotation in mine doesn't cause a noise. I have to shake it with some force to feel a very faint clunk. It is not really the noise, it is more that i feel the movement. Like perhaps, if i was to guess, something of the weight of the battery, moving 2mm or so. And i sill can feel it, even with the camera turned on... But i do not shake my camera, i feel this thing just by tilting it, to the left, then to the right, then tom the left agin, etc. ---------- Post added 11-02-19 at 07:34 AM ---------- Originally posted by Gimbal Exactly, some people just does not pick up on subtle things, at all. This is a Pentax thing in all their DSLRs since the K10d, the sensor is loose and can move around up/down and left right a few mm. Some cameras might need a little bump for the sensor to shift, others slide more easily. Nothing to worry about. But that (loose sensor that can move around up/down and left right a few mm) may happen, regardless of the camera being turned off or on? In my case, only in LV mode i stop feeling any movement inside the camera...

11-02-2019, 07:41 AM	#28
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	Originally posted by Fernando Sousa It is not really the noise, it is more that i feel the movement. Like perhaps, if i was to guess, something of the weight of the battery, moving 2mm or so. And i sill can feel it, even with the camera turned on... But i do not shake my camera, i feel this thing just by tilting it, to the left, then to the right, then tom the left agin, etc. To me, that's just not right. It's not like my camera. But if someone else has the same experience and their camera has decent number of shutter actuations, you might want to take a chance. When I turn my camera to the left or right for portrait orientation there is absolutely no movement 95% of the time, and a very slight, soft "thud" maybe one time out of 20.

11-02-2019, 07:42 AM	#29
Fernando Sousa Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2017 Posts: 37 Original Poster	Originally posted by monochrome Pentax packages are not sealed. With my K-1 in hand - no lens and no battery installed - there is a sound and slight feel of motion inside the camera, as described by many posters above. This is absolutely normal and I do not believe there is significant variance in the SR assembly. With lens mounted and battery installed but powered off the sound is the same. Power on the camera and the sound stops. Mount a lLens and power the camera on and you might hear the SR mechanism working - it is a high-pitched whine (ultrasonic). That is normal. If the pictures work you’re good. Otherwise you have a warranty and can exchange the camera for a new one. Thanks for the post, i understand that this feeling of motion inside the camera is normal in the Pentax dslr, due to the shake reduction mechanism, free floating sensor, magnets, etc. But now, since i first turn my camera on, and also the SR on, i was hopping to stop feeling the motion, but that did not happened. Only in LV it goes away. But the camera takes pictures. Is this still normal with yours?

11-02-2019, 07:49 AM	#30
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Originally posted by Fernando Sousa Thanks for the post, i understand that this feeling of motion inside the camera is normal in the Pentax dslr, due to the shake reduction mechanism, free floating sensor, magnets, etc. But now, since i first turn my camera on, and also the SR on, i was hopping to stop feeling the motion, but that did not happened. Only in LV it goes away. But the camera takes pictures. Is this still normal with yours? In my experience just now, camera in hand, there is no internal clunking sound or feel of an internal loose part in OVF Mode, with a lens mounted and the camera powered on. In LV Mode I can hear and feel the SR system. With power on the magnets are working.