Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
6 Days Ago   #91
retired sw engineer
Loyal Site Supporter
reh321's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: South Bend, IN, USA
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 12,669
QuoteOriginally posted by SharkyCA Quote
I do not see how these posts are "off topic" as it is documentation of "K-70 Diaphragm Control Failure" and the resolve to that failure, suggesting to open a new thread while this thread is already under "Pentax K-70, K-70 UnderexposedPhoto Reports" seems counter productive if we are looking for solutions.

I have to agree with Photogem.
I believe your photo reveals that we know less than we thought we did. The original purpose of this thread was to determine whether the K-70 really is failing less often than the K-50 did; the K-70 was released nearly three years ago, so the shortage of complaints would suggest something has changed, but your photo makes us less certain what that change might be. That is not bad, but it is somewhat disconcerting.

6 Days Ago   #92
Otis Memorial Pentaxian
Loyal Site Supporter
stevebrot's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Vancouver (USA)
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 32,653
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by photogem Quote
It is by no means off-topic!
Read the original post. This thread is for reportage, not discussion, of what is turning out to be a rare problem. I know that the aperture control issue is a strong interest of yours and that participation in all related threads makes sense, but starting a side discussion is not helpful, IMHO.

QuoteOriginally posted by SharkyCA Quote
suggesting to open a new thread while this thread is already under "Pentax K-70, K-70 UnderexposedPhoto Reports" seems counter productive if we are looking for solutions.
We are looking to see if there is under-reportage of what is turning out to be a rare problem for K-70 owners. The solution is to get it repaired. So far yours is the only documented case of actual failure of the diaphragm control block on this site. Endless discussions of what component of the replaced unit might have failed are sort of futile. (I.e. there is no indication that the solenoid was at fault.) If you are planning on dissection or doing a powered test of the failed unit, that would be cool, but ultimately a new thread might result in better exposure. Yes, you have new "photographic evidence" for a problem that might be affecting other K-70 users, I am just making a suggestion to take the discussion elsewhere so that legitimate reports don't get lost in the melee and what you have found can get the attention it deserves. Now y'all (@photogem included) may do as you please. I don't own the thread, nor am I a moderator. I'm just the guy who interacts with those reporting dark frames.


Steve

Last edited by stevebrot; 6 Days Ago at 08:38 AM.
6 Days Ago   #93
Site Supporter
Site Supporter




Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Winterthur
Posts: 391
QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Read the original post. This thread is for reportage, not discussion.
You opened a thread and you have a wish! A wish that everybody complies 100% to rules you want to dictate.
But this is an open forum and you are the TO, i.e. Thread* Opener. So that's what it is ... an open threat.

So please don't mix it up with a *"threat" instead.

QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
The solution is to get it repaired.
This is "one solution". A good one, no daubt.


But .... we know too well that many repairs by Ricoh/Pentax have just led to the same failure again.

So actually, your solution is kind of limited.

Yes, to get it repaired is a good solution: If it is done well!


But... an even better solution would be if this very mistake wouldn't happen at all! There is nothing wrong with this approach.

Now: We had this problem since the days of the Pentax K30. It wasn't solved with the K50/K500. It wasn't fully solved but bettered with the K-S1 and K-S2.
And it still happens. To find out why it happens that is "my solution", you might not like it (you responses at least give me a strong indication that this is the case)
but remember please: This is a forum! You opened a thread. So please be open.

QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
So far your's is the only documented case of actual failure of the diaphragm control block on this site.
No, it is at least the second documented case:
a) K-70 of SharkyCA
b) same unit installed offically into a K30


There several K70 documented cases on the German Pentaxians website!

I know at least of 4 of 'em.


QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Endless discussions of what component of the replaced unit might have failed are sort of futile.
For you this might be futile, but not for others.


QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
I.e. there is no indication that the solenoid was at fault.
Well: How many Pentax DSLR with failed diaphragm control block have *you* checked, repaired?
You know that I have repaired many.


I can tell that "most likely" it was the solenoi who was at fault. With all 4 cases on the German Pentaxian forum it was so!


QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Yes, what came out of your camera is similar to a stock photo from U.S. Camera for the Pentax replacement part that they sell for an earlier model. What would one expect? The part numbers are very likely the same. The reversal of the screw holes might indicate a different mount plate underneath, but even if, is that revelation actionable?
to you, no, to me: YES! And I will prove why!


QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Yes, you have new "evidence" for a problem that might be affecting other K-70 users, I am just making a suggestion to take the discussion elsewhere so that legitimate reports don't get lost in the melee.
So you agree that there "might be new evidence" but at the same time you question my report being "legiti-mate" ???

---------- Post added 06-11-19 at 08:47 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
I believe your photo reveals that we know less than we thought we did. The original purpose of this thread was to determine whether the K-70 really is failing less often than the K-50 did; the K-70 was released nearly three years ago, so the shortage of complaints would suggest something has changed, but your photo makes us less certain what that change might be. That is not bad, but it is somewhat disconcerting.
And that's exactly what I am after (and I am pretty sure I am on the right track!): What that change might have been!
6 Days Ago   #94
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
SharkyCA's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Carleton Place, Ontario, Canada
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 287
I am not trying to muddy the waters on this thread but perhaps it will be the solution for many K-70 owners and a resolve from Pentax so they don't duplicate the problem in the future.
Here are the macro pictures of the "solenoid" that came from my K-70 sent back to me from "SunCamera Service in Canada the authorized Pentax repair facility. Unfortunately not under warranty,.

The full control block image is here:

Attached Images
View Picture EXIF
PENTAX K-70  Photo 
View Picture EXIF
PENTAX K-70  Photo 
6 Days Ago   #95
Otis Memorial Pentaxian
Loyal Site Supporter
stevebrot's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Vancouver (USA)
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 32,653
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by photogem Quote
You opened a thread and you have a wish! A wish that everybody complies 100% to rules you want to dictate.
But this is an open forum and you are the TO, i.e. Thread* Opener. So that's what it is ... an open threat.

So please don't mix it up with a *"threat" instead.
Ummmmm...no, not really. OP's insistence on thread ownership is actually a pet peeve of mine. If you want to have a private party here, it is your privilege. I was just suggesting that to do so is off topic and might actually get better exposure as a new thread. If there is a desire to take it to the personal level (threats), I have little interest.

As for whether I have any experience with the aperture control issues...yes, first hand with a K-50 and yes, as one of those who handled the original surge of K-30 failures (almost all out of warranty by only a month or so) and one of those who characterized the issue as age rather than usage related. No, I have never taken one apart. The K-50 was repaired at Precision under warranty (thank you Ricoh for the extension) in early 2015 and continues to operate trouble-free to the present date. I have no idea what color solenoid was on the repair part, only that the repair was successful. In fact, I have no idea whether the solenoid was a fault, only that they replaced the diaphragm control block.

Having established that I don't do my own dSLR repair (I save that for vintage cameras and lenses), I do recognize your contribution, including the self-repair guide on this site. I am sure it has saved those attempting self-repair a world of pain. Given your post history on this site, the aperture control issue, particularly the solenoid part appears to be a matter of intense interest. I hope for you the greatest of luck in finding the truth regarding this type of failure. There have been so many blind leads and so many potential points of failure.


Steve

Last edited by stevebrot; 6 Days Ago at 11:07 AM.
3 Days Ago   #96
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
SharkyCA's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Carleton Place, Ontario, Canada
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 287
QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Read the original post. This thread is for reportage, not discussion, of what is turning out to be a rare problem. I know that the aperture control issue is a strong interest of yours and that participation in all related threads makes sense, but starting a side discussion is not helpful, IMHO.



We are looking to see if there is under-reportage of what is turning out to be a rare problem for K-70 owners. The solution is to get it repaired. So far yours is the only documented case of actual failure of the diaphragm control block on this site. Endless discussions of what component of the replaced unit might have failed are sort of futile. (I.e. there is no indication that the solenoid was at fault.) If you are planning on dissection or doing a powered test of the failed unit, that would be cool, but ultimately a new thread might result in better exposure. Yes, you have new "photographic evidence" for a problem that might be affecting other K-70 users, I am just making a suggestion to take the discussion elsewhere so that legitimate reports don't get lost in the melee and what you have found can get the attention it deserves. Now y'all (@photogem included) may do as you please. I don't own the thread, nor am I a moderator. I'm just the guy who interacts with those reporting dark frames.


Steve
QuoteOriginally posted by SharkyCA Quote
I am not trying to muddy the waters on this thread but perhaps it will be the solution for many K-70 owners and a resolve from Pentax so they don't duplicate the problem in the future.
Here are the macro pictures of the "solenoid" that came from my K-70 sent back to me from "SunCamera Service in Canada the authorized Pentax repair facility. Unfortunately not under warranty,.

The full control block image is here:
QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Ummmmm...no, not really. OP's insistence on thread ownership is actually a pet peeve of mine. If you want to have a private party here, it is your privilege. I was just suggesting that to do so is off topic and might actually get better exposure as a new thread. If there is a desire to take it to the personal level (threats), I have little interest.

As for whether I have any experience with the aperture control issues...yes, first hand with a K-50 and yes, as one of those who handled the original surge of K-30 failures (almost all out of warranty by only a month or so) and one of those who characterized the issue as age rather than usage related. No, I have never taken one apart. The K-50 was repaired at Precision under warranty (thank you Ricoh for the extension) in early 2015 and continues to operate trouble-free to the present date. I have no idea what color solenoid was on the repair part, only that the repair was successful. In fact, I have no idea whether the solenoid was a fault, only that they replaced the diaphragm control block.

Having established that I don't do my own dSLR repair (I save that for vintage cameras and lenses), I do recognize your contribution, including the self-repair guide on this site. I am sure it has saved those attempting self-repair a world of pain. Given your post history on this site, the aperture control issue, particularly the solenoid part appears to be a matter of intense interest. I hope for you the greatest of luck in finding the truth regarding this type of failure. There have been so many blind leads and so many potential points of failure.


Steve
Sorry Steve but I have to refer back to my original post on another thread and refer you back to your "original comment to me" K70 aperture block? - Page 3 - PentaxForums.com

Your Quote directing me back to this thread.
"There is a thread on this site dedicated to the matter including how to confirm that your camera has an aperture control problem. You are welcome to participate posting as is appropriate there, particularly in regards to whether you are able to to confirm an aperture control problem as well as any repair center diagnoses and final outcomes. Example photos are not needed, since they are a symptom that contains few, if any clues.*" https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/193-pentax-k-70/377096-k-70-underexposed-photo-reports.html

Read more at: K70 aperture block? - Page 3 - PentaxForums.com

Last edited by SharkyCA; 3 Days Ago at 09:12 AM. Reason: add a link and update message.
3 Days Ago   #97
Otis Memorial Pentaxian
Loyal Site Supporter
stevebrot's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Vancouver (USA)
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 32,653
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by SharkyCA Quote
Your Quote directing me back to this thread.
"There is a thread on this site dedicated to the matter including how to confirm that your camera has an aperture control problem. You are welcome to participate posting as is appropriate there, particularly in regards to whether you are able to to confirm an aperture control problem as well as any repair center diagnoses and final outcomes. Example photos are not needed, since they are a symptom that contains few, if any clues.*"
Yep...and that is still the case. Your problem was confirmed by Sun and repaired and unless the fix did not work, that is the final outcome.


Steve
3 Days Ago   #98
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
SharkyCA's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Carleton Place, Ontario, Canada
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 287
QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Yep...and that is still the case. Your problem was confirmed by Sun and repaired and unless the fix did not work, that is the final outcome.


Steve
So are you saying "end of discussion" the camera failed, was fixed and we don't care that it is going to happen again? Or are we looking for Ricoh/Pentax to step to the plate and rectify the problem instead of letting it continue into the next generations of DSLR?

Cheers

3 Days Ago - 1 Like   #99
Loyal Site Supporter
Loyal Site Supporter
SharkyCA's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Carleton Place, Ontario, Canada
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 287
Stevebrot is still looking for more confirmation of K-70 aperture block failures if you suspect your K-70 has failed like mine post it quoting his original post at the top of this thread.K-70 Underexposed Photo Reports - PentaxForums.com
1 Day Ago - 1 Like   #100
Site Supporter
Site Supporter




Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Winterthur
Posts: 391
So to keep the solenoid question apart from Stevebrot's thread which he wishes for reportage only I have started a new thread and uploaded photos which kindly SharkyCA sent me
and allowed me to use plus photos I took today from different solenoids to show how Ricoh did work to solve this problem (and they did!).

You find the new thread HERE

I think Ricoh did their best and I could document steps which also show why earlier approaches where not yet perfect and particular why the socalled sanding/grinding method is
a kind of foolish.

Ah... when I took the photo of the Japan-Solenoid the plunger which just came out of its housing, so was just fresh in contact with the magnet there:


A tiny metallic (ferro-magnetic) particle stuck to the front which was closest to the magnet!
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
aperture control, aug, block, camera, cause, change, date, dates, diaphragm control, exif, exposure, failure, inconsistency, k-70, k70, message, pentax, pentax k-70, photo, reports, sept, solution, steve, thread, unit
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Q1 2019 Financial Reports - Pentax still not doomed. Kunzite Pentax News and Rumors 179 02-20-2019 01:00 PM
Bright sun, underexposed pics. Where did I get the settings wrong? lushdimple11 Troubleshooting and Beginner Help 43 11-03-2018 11:15 PM
Underexposed Photos K1000 sonygoup Pentax Film SLR Discussion 13 02-24-2018 09:16 AM
Action Full Body Portraits - How Do I Avoid Underexposed Legs? reivax Photographic Technique 27 12-14-2017 10:54 PM
Underexposed viewfinder, normal LiveView iwtgbtp Pentax K-30 & K-50 4 03-10-2017 10:15 AM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:10 AM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top